1
00:00:02,000 --> 00:00:07,000
Downloaded from
YTS.MX

2
00:00:08,000 --> 00:00:13,000
Official YIFY movies site:
YTS.MX

3
00:00:37,829 --> 00:00:40,165
MAN 1:
I first started collecting when I was seven years old.

4
00:00:40,207 --> 00:00:42,334
MAN 2: I'd have been
eight years old at the time.

5
00:00:42,376 --> 00:00:46,630
MAN 3: When I first started
collecting sports cards, I was in elementary school.

6
00:00:46,672 --> 00:00:50,551
MAN 2: I was fortunate enough
that my father was already working and involved

7
00:00:50,592 --> 00:00:53,387
in the business
that he would bring packets home.

8
00:00:53,428 --> 00:00:55,055
MAN 1: I was too young
to join Little League.

9
00:00:55,097 --> 00:00:57,683
I fell in love with the sport
and started collecting cards.

10
00:00:57,724 --> 00:01:00,936
MAN 4: Still remember my mom
taking me to the local grocer on our way home

11
00:01:00,978 --> 00:01:03,272
and buying my first packs.

12
00:01:03,313 --> 00:01:06,233
Still a very vivid memory,
opening those packs and chewing that gum,

13
00:01:06,275 --> 00:01:07,442
back in 1976.

14
00:01:10,195 --> 00:01:12,656
MAN 5: After school,
me and my few friends

15
00:01:12,698 --> 00:01:14,533
would go
to the local card shop,

16
00:01:14,575 --> 00:01:16,743
gather up the few dollars
that we had,

17
00:01:16,785 --> 00:01:19,329
and just get a pack
and try to get Ken Griffey Jr. ,

18
00:01:19,371 --> 00:01:21,874
or Barry Sanders,
or Bo Jackson.

19
00:01:21,915 --> 00:01:24,334
MAN 6: And then I...
I stopped collecting,

20
00:01:24,376 --> 00:01:27,713
and I went on with,
you know, school and work,

21
00:01:27,754 --> 00:01:29,381
and became an adult.

22
00:01:29,423 --> 00:01:32,843
MAN 5: Junior high,
I kind of outgrew collecting cards.

23
00:01:32,885 --> 00:01:37,848
And then it just sat in
the back of my mom's garage for decades.

24
00:01:39,141 --> 00:01:41,685
MAN 6: And then,
in August of 2020,

25
00:01:41,727 --> 00:01:43,937
I got back into it
and started buying again.

26
00:01:43,979 --> 00:01:46,732
MAN 7: I just recently
got back into it about three months ago.

27
00:01:46,773 --> 00:01:48,150
MAN 8: I'm probably
a little bit older

28
00:01:48,192 --> 00:01:50,277
than some folks who have
gotten back in the game.

29
00:01:50,319 --> 00:01:53,113
MAN 9: But now we're back
into it in a large way.

30
00:01:53,155 --> 00:01:55,949
MAN 6: My mom was excited
and she sent me all my cards.

31
00:01:55,991 --> 00:01:58,368
Boxes and boxes arrived
in Puerto Rico.

32
00:01:58,410 --> 00:02:02,122
And in there I saw all the ones
that, to me as a kid, were so important

33
00:02:02,164 --> 00:02:05,459
and one of them in the...
in the biggest glass case,

34
00:02:05,501 --> 00:02:07,419
one of the big
screwdown cases,

35
00:02:07,461 --> 00:02:10,214
was a 1952 Topps
Mickey Mantle.

36
00:02:10,255 --> 00:02:12,758
MAN 7: So I'm a collector
of what has culturally hit me.

37
00:02:12,799 --> 00:02:14,885
I want to have
a piece of history

38
00:02:14,927 --> 00:02:16,303
in the same way
I look at art.

39
00:02:16,345 --> 00:02:17,346
It's just smaller.

40
00:02:24,811 --> 00:02:26,688
When the pandemic hit
in 2020,

41
00:02:26,730 --> 00:02:28,565
if you had taken $1,000

42
00:02:28,607 --> 00:02:31,235
from one of
the stimulus checks the government sent out

43
00:02:31,276 --> 00:02:33,278
and put it
in the sports card market,

44
00:02:33,320 --> 00:02:37,241
you would have had
$10,000 or more, less than a year later.

45
00:02:37,282 --> 00:02:39,076
During the pandemic,
you know, just sharing,

46
00:02:39,117 --> 00:02:41,912
like, trying to get
your parents to understand

47
00:02:41,954 --> 00:02:43,914
what's happening
in the trading card market...

48
00:02:43,956 --> 00:02:46,708
Taking that
screenshot picture from a Target that says,

49
00:02:46,750 --> 00:02:50,212
"Limit two rolls
of toilet paper, three boxes of cards, "

50
00:02:50,254 --> 00:02:52,256
I think really kind of
hit home to people

51
00:02:52,297 --> 00:02:54,758
that don't know
what's happening in the trading card space.

52
00:02:58,846 --> 00:03:02,015
-[SHOPPING CARTS RATTLING]
-[INDISTINCT CONVERSATIONS]

53
00:03:02,057 --> 00:03:03,600
MAN: If they're running,
I'm running.

54
00:03:04,893 --> 00:03:06,520
I'm not getting in that.

55
00:03:06,562 --> 00:03:08,063
No [BLEEP] way, dude.

56
00:03:09,189 --> 00:03:10,482
I am not doing that.

57
00:03:12,985 --> 00:03:17,072
MAN 1: Employees buying
all the cards out before the stores even open.

58
00:03:17,114 --> 00:03:19,700
Guy standing here
two hours before opening.

59
00:03:19,741 --> 00:03:21,827
We got back door action.

60
00:03:21,869 --> 00:03:23,412
Back door [BLEEP] action.

61
00:03:23,453 --> 00:03:25,497
-MAN 2: Are you serious?
-MAN 3: Because I need it.

62
00:03:25,539 --> 00:03:26,707
MAN 1: Because
you need it?

63
00:03:26,748 --> 00:03:29,126
You're about to
lose your job now.

64
00:03:29,168 --> 00:03:31,712
I hope your family
doesn't go hungry over cards, man.

65
00:03:31,753 --> 00:03:34,173
The money that's in the industry
right now is staggering.

66
00:03:34,214 --> 00:03:36,842
I... Literally,
my employees bug me,

67
00:03:36,884 --> 00:03:39,386
but all I do is stand
at the cash register and take money all day.

68
00:03:39,428 --> 00:03:43,557
There's so many people
that are coming in that they pull out a wad

69
00:03:43,599 --> 00:03:47,936
of $1,000, $2,000, $3,000
to make their "weekly purchase. "

70
00:03:47,978 --> 00:03:50,230
From 2016 to 2021,

71
00:03:50,272 --> 00:03:52,524
the stock market
had an incredible run.

72
00:03:52,566 --> 00:03:55,027
It about doubled
during that period.

73
00:03:55,068 --> 00:04:00,324
But would you believe
that the sports card market went up more than 20 times?

74
00:04:00,365 --> 00:04:02,451
There are kids
in high school right now

75
00:04:02,492 --> 00:04:04,077
that will be
financially independent

76
00:04:04,119 --> 00:04:05,537
by the time they are 30,

77
00:04:05,579 --> 00:04:07,998
because they've started
investing in sports cards today.

78
00:04:08,040 --> 00:04:10,250
The only reason
the sports card market took off

79
00:04:10,292 --> 00:04:11,793
was because of me.

80
00:04:11,835 --> 00:04:14,254
I put that card on the map
and said, "Look what I bought. "

81
00:04:14,296 --> 00:04:15,964
Mike Trout.

82
00:04:16,006 --> 00:04:17,841
People can laugh at me now.

83
00:04:17,883 --> 00:04:20,010
But in 10 years from now,
this card will be worth 5 to 10 million dollars.

84
00:04:20,052 --> 00:04:21,470
Mark my words.
I know what I'm doing.

85
00:04:21,512 --> 00:04:23,597
And when it sold
for $4 million,

86
00:04:23,639 --> 00:04:25,516
it broke
the Honus Wagner record.

87
00:04:25,557 --> 00:04:28,477
People now saw baseball cards
as no longer a hobby.

88
00:04:28,519 --> 00:04:30,854
"Holy [BLEEP].
You can make millions off this. "

89
00:04:30,896 --> 00:04:32,481
All these people
from Wall Street,

90
00:04:32,523 --> 00:04:33,899
they started getting
the card market.

91
00:04:33,941 --> 00:04:36,443
No way you would've saw
LeBron sell for millions.

92
00:04:36,485 --> 00:04:38,320
Luka sell for four million.

93
00:04:38,362 --> 00:04:42,199
I single-handedly
changed the market from a hobby to a business,

94
00:04:42,241 --> 00:04:44,159
and to an investment.

95
00:04:44,201 --> 00:04:47,037
If I didn't take that risk,
who knows where the industry would be right now?

96
00:05:01,593 --> 00:05:04,388
I don't really have time
to spend

97
00:05:04,429 --> 00:05:07,766
time on the Internet,
buying things, or going on eBay.

98
00:05:07,808 --> 00:05:09,101
I just never did that.

99
00:05:09,142 --> 00:05:15,274
I'm doing 250 shows a year
for the last 15 years.

100
00:05:15,315 --> 00:05:18,569
Here I am,
in my early 40s.

101
00:05:18,610 --> 00:05:20,112
COVID hits.

102
00:05:20,153 --> 00:05:24,283
Um, my touring schedule
has come to a screeching halt.

103
00:05:24,324 --> 00:05:25,617
And now I have like...

104
00:05:25,659 --> 00:05:27,661
"Whoa, I don't know
how long this is gonna be. "

105
00:05:27,703 --> 00:05:32,291
So, I was in the studio
just cranking music out, and then I got burnt out.

106
00:05:32,332 --> 00:05:33,792
After a few months,
I got burnt out.

107
00:05:33,834 --> 00:05:36,003
I was like, "Well, this is
a lot longer than I thought. "

108
00:05:36,044 --> 00:05:37,212
And what do you do
when you get burnt out?

109
00:05:37,254 --> 00:05:39,131
You just find
different interests.

110
00:05:39,173 --> 00:05:40,382
I just left the studio.

111
00:05:40,424 --> 00:05:42,176
I was like, "I need to
take a break on this.

112
00:05:42,217 --> 00:05:44,178
"This is a lot longer
than expected. "

113
00:05:44,219 --> 00:05:49,933
That was the opportune time
for me to just kind of just put my reachers out,

114
00:05:49,975 --> 00:05:51,602
and one of my friends was like,

115
00:05:51,643 --> 00:05:57,149
"Hey, I just bought
a sports card for $15,000. "

116
00:05:57,191 --> 00:05:59,193
I have...
I have those cards, too.

117
00:05:59,234 --> 00:06:02,070
Like, they're not
worth that much. There's just no way.

118
00:06:02,112 --> 00:06:03,405
I could not believe it.

119
00:06:03,447 --> 00:06:05,616
I just was like,
"I don't understand it. "

120
00:06:05,657 --> 00:06:08,493
I called him up,
I was like, "Okay, explain what is going on. "

121
00:06:08,535 --> 00:06:10,829
Like, it just sounds ludicrous.
It's crazy.

122
00:06:10,871 --> 00:06:14,416
He broke it down almost like...
very much like an investment.

123
00:06:14,458 --> 00:06:16,376
He's like,
"I just spent 15 grand,

124
00:06:16,418 --> 00:06:21,757
"and I plan to sell it
in maybe 6 weeks' time for 10 grand more. "

125
00:06:21,798 --> 00:06:24,551
I'm like, "Six weeks' time,
you're gonna make ten grand?

126
00:06:24,593 --> 00:06:26,386
"How is that possible?"

127
00:06:26,428 --> 00:06:28,305
NICK GONZALES:
My first feeling when I saw my own baseball cards

128
00:06:28,347 --> 00:06:30,182
was like,
"Is this even real?"

129
00:06:30,224 --> 00:06:31,808
'Cause you see stuff
photoshopped all the time,

130
00:06:31,850 --> 00:06:33,977
and you kind of just assume
that it's not, but it is real,

131
00:06:34,019 --> 00:06:36,146
and you see the Topps on it,
and it's kind of shiny.

132
00:06:36,188 --> 00:06:38,440
So it's really cool
to see that.

133
00:06:38,482 --> 00:06:41,151
JOSH JACOBS: Man...
So we moved into our house.

134
00:06:41,193 --> 00:06:45,739
Growing up, and in the attic,
there was a deck of cards like a book of cards.

135
00:06:45,781 --> 00:06:48,617
That kind of started
my fascination with cards.

136
00:06:48,659 --> 00:06:51,870
And, young, I didn't know
it was this big of a deal,

137
00:06:51,912 --> 00:06:53,956
but I kind of got into it
until like high school.

138
00:06:53,997 --> 00:06:57,376
Until I got into girls
and sports and things like that.

139
00:06:57,417 --> 00:06:59,378
So, yeah. [CHUCKLES]

140
00:06:59,419 --> 00:07:01,171
So, I do collect
my own cards.

141
00:07:01,213 --> 00:07:04,842
I try to get
at least one of each card just for my kids.

142
00:07:04,883 --> 00:07:06,677
So when they grow up,
they can see it

143
00:07:06,718 --> 00:07:10,347
and be like, "Me and my dad...
It's just some... some memorable moments. "

144
00:07:10,389 --> 00:07:12,766
GEOFF WILSON:
I started collecting sports cards as a kid.

145
00:07:12,808 --> 00:07:14,893
I was absolutely obsessed.

146
00:07:14,935 --> 00:07:18,522
Every week,
when I got my $5 allowance from my mom,

147
00:07:18,564 --> 00:07:20,607
I would get on my bike
immediately,

148
00:07:20,649 --> 00:07:22,442
ride down
to the corner drugstore

149
00:07:22,484 --> 00:07:25,988
and buy as many
sports card packs as I could possibly get.

150
00:07:26,029 --> 00:07:31,368
My first job ever, at age 14,
was at a sports card store in Sarasota, Florida.

151
00:07:31,410 --> 00:07:33,745
Sports cards were my life
as a kid.

152
00:07:33,787 --> 00:07:38,000
As I got into high school
and then went off to college, I lost touch with sports cards.

153
00:07:38,041 --> 00:07:41,086
And it wasn't until
a few years ago that I got back into them.

154
00:07:41,128 --> 00:07:44,673
My son came home from
his grandmother's house one day,

155
00:07:44,715 --> 00:07:46,758
and had a pack
of football cards.

156
00:07:46,800 --> 00:07:51,638
So we opened the pack together
and it brought back for me a ton of nostalgia.

157
00:07:51,680 --> 00:07:55,767
And the more that I got into it,
packs that I opened, cards that I researched,

158
00:07:55,809 --> 00:08:00,647
I all of a sudden saw
this has incredible investment potential

159
00:08:00,689 --> 00:08:02,900
and incredible
business potential.

160
00:08:02,941 --> 00:08:05,569
And this is
a sleeping giant industry,

161
00:08:05,611 --> 00:08:07,946
and nobody realizes it
right now.

162
00:08:07,988 --> 00:08:12,117
You know, as an immigrant
coming from South Africa, and being an only child,

163
00:08:12,159 --> 00:08:17,164
I knew that I had to connect
to my peers at school through something.

164
00:08:17,206 --> 00:08:19,458
And sports cards
was the perfect answer.

165
00:08:19,499 --> 00:08:23,837
Even though most kids
collected back then because it was the fun thing to do,

166
00:08:23,879 --> 00:08:27,049
I really had
that investor mentality back then.

167
00:08:27,090 --> 00:08:29,218
I loved looking at
those Beckett magazines

168
00:08:29,259 --> 00:08:32,638
and seeing if my cards
had gone up $2 or $3

169
00:08:32,679 --> 00:08:33,972
because if they did,

170
00:08:34,014 --> 00:08:36,141
I would have more to trade
with my other friends.

171
00:08:36,183 --> 00:08:38,268
And, to me,
that was even more fun

172
00:08:38,310 --> 00:08:40,145
than just collecting the cards
for myself.

173
00:08:40,187 --> 00:08:43,106
I started collecting
baseball cards at a very young age,

174
00:08:43,148 --> 00:08:46,693
about 12, 13 years old,
buying and flipping cards.

175
00:08:46,735 --> 00:08:50,113
While most of my neighbors
and friends were playing in the backyards

176
00:08:50,155 --> 00:08:51,907
and just hanging out,

177
00:08:51,949 --> 00:08:55,994
I was, on the weekends,
going to the local trade shows with my dad.

178
00:08:56,036 --> 00:09:00,457
He used to leave me at a table,
and he goes to the next table

179
00:09:00,499 --> 00:09:03,085
and he comes back
and he buys cards.

180
00:09:03,126 --> 00:09:04,711
I say, "Why you buy this for?"

181
00:09:04,753 --> 00:09:06,672
He say, "Trust me. "

182
00:09:06,713 --> 00:09:09,967
As a 12-, 13-year-old,
I was making $1,000 a week buying and flipping cards.

183
00:09:10,008 --> 00:09:12,553
By 14,
I was actually a dealer.

184
00:09:12,594 --> 00:09:15,264
I'd run a table for 40 bucks
and sell cards.

185
00:09:15,305 --> 00:09:20,143
And then, before I was 15,
I became a real entrepreneur.

186
00:09:20,185 --> 00:09:26,525
I'd rent Holiday Inns
or hotels in Michigan, rent the tables out,

187
00:09:26,567 --> 00:09:30,195
hire Detroit Red Wings players
to sign autographs, pay them 1,000 bucks.

188
00:09:30,237 --> 00:09:31,989
Charge a door fee.

189
00:09:32,030 --> 00:09:34,491
So I was making the door fee,
the autograph fee, and the table fee.

190
00:09:34,533 --> 00:09:38,787
And I was making
about $8,000 a month, and I was only 15 years old.

191
00:09:38,829 --> 00:09:41,582
So, that's when I first became
a real entrepreneur.

192
00:09:41,623 --> 00:09:43,083
But then when you
get to high school,

193
00:09:43,125 --> 00:09:45,627
you want to chase girls
and get fancy cars,

194
00:09:45,669 --> 00:09:47,212
so I sold everything.

195
00:09:47,254 --> 00:09:49,298
And it's funny
how I circled back in the card industry

196
00:09:49,339 --> 00:09:50,549
almost 30 years later.

197
00:10:10,694 --> 00:10:11,653
[INAUDIBLE]

198
00:10:15,908 --> 00:10:19,119
Initially, when I first got back
in August of 2020,

199
00:10:19,161 --> 00:10:20,495
I thought it was kind of crazy.

200
00:10:20,537 --> 00:10:22,039
I limped in.

201
00:10:22,080 --> 00:10:26,084
I had a dealer send me
$100,000 in cards, diversified box,

202
00:10:26,126 --> 00:10:29,630
and thinking I was gonna
buy it as a, you know, just a diversified asset class.

203
00:10:29,671 --> 00:10:32,216
Once you hold these cards
in your hand,

204
00:10:32,257 --> 00:10:34,635
then you realize
it's American history.

205
00:10:34,676 --> 00:10:39,389
Think about
Jackie Robinson's 1948 Leaf, his rookie card,

206
00:10:39,431 --> 00:10:40,891
and Michael Jordan's
rookie card.

207
00:10:40,933 --> 00:10:42,726
And once you
hold these things,

208
00:10:42,768 --> 00:10:45,896
it brings back all that
excitement of a kid and also brings back...

209
00:10:45,938 --> 00:10:50,526
You learn more about
the player, and the sport, and the history of it,

210
00:10:50,567 --> 00:10:54,154
and you become addicted,
and it's exciting and fun.

211
00:10:54,196 --> 00:10:58,283
And I think when more
and more people kind of just dip their toes back in,

212
00:10:58,325 --> 00:11:00,786
they go in their garages
and they grab their cards

213
00:11:00,827 --> 00:11:02,913
and they kind of get
that feeling again,

214
00:11:02,955 --> 00:11:06,375
it gets them so excited
and back into the hobby.

215
00:11:06,416 --> 00:11:09,002
-Ooh! Wow!
-Oh, wow, that's cool.

216
00:11:09,044 --> 00:11:10,838
-BOY: Look at that.
-Yeah.

217
00:11:10,879 --> 00:11:14,383
Tom Brady with
Ronald Jones Jr. and Mike Evans, the Super Bowl champions.

218
00:11:14,424 --> 00:11:15,843
That's fitting.

219
00:11:15,884 --> 00:11:17,386
MAN: For me,
I stand at a Target

220
00:11:17,427 --> 00:11:20,138
probably 6:00 in the morning,
every Friday,

221
00:11:20,180 --> 00:11:23,517
just so I can get myself
500 bucks' worth of Pokemon cards.

222
00:11:23,559 --> 00:11:28,230
And, you know, as an adult,
people laugh at me that I'm looking at Pokemon cards,

223
00:11:28,272 --> 00:11:31,191
but I'm having fun,
'cause I'm revisiting my childhood.

224
00:11:31,233 --> 00:11:34,111
At the same time,
I'm monetizing my future.

225
00:11:34,152 --> 00:11:37,155
And it's... Instead of having
to invest the boring way

226
00:11:37,197 --> 00:11:40,117
with, like, you know,
stocks, trusting somebody,

227
00:11:40,158 --> 00:11:42,202
at least I have control
over my future

228
00:11:42,244 --> 00:11:43,912
and I'm having fun
at the same time.

229
00:11:43,954 --> 00:11:45,914
So that's why
I dove back into it.

230
00:11:49,126 --> 00:11:51,670
The rise of
the sports card market has even seen

231
00:11:51,712 --> 00:11:54,673
a number of celebrities
get involved in the industry.

232
00:11:54,715 --> 00:11:58,802
For instance, Steve Aoki
even had his own set released by Topps.

233
00:11:58,844 --> 00:12:01,805
So we're seeing
more and more celebrities pour into our industry.

234
00:12:01,847 --> 00:12:03,223
STEVE AOKI:
That was really cool,

235
00:12:03,265 --> 00:12:07,394
to have my own auto
in the Topps set was very cool.

236
00:12:07,436 --> 00:12:11,607
I mean,
I did my first Topps card as a first pitch card.

237
00:12:13,025 --> 00:12:14,735
You know, whenever I get into
any industry,

238
00:12:14,776 --> 00:12:18,947
I always want to be
creative in the space.

239
00:12:18,989 --> 00:12:20,991
You know,
'cause I throw cakes at my shows,

240
00:12:21,033 --> 00:12:23,744
we splattered a cake theme
on the parallels.

241
00:12:23,785 --> 00:12:25,787
It's a lot of fun
to work with them.

242
00:12:25,829 --> 00:12:28,457
Influencers, celebrities
entering the space is incredible,

243
00:12:28,498 --> 00:12:31,168
and they're coming in
on a daily basis.

244
00:12:31,210 --> 00:12:35,964
I think athletes
are the best person to come into the space,

245
00:12:36,006 --> 00:12:38,300
because, one,
they know the industry better than anybody.

246
00:12:38,342 --> 00:12:39,760
They know the players.

247
00:12:39,801 --> 00:12:41,386
They know how
they're gonna perform.

248
00:12:41,428 --> 00:12:43,388
They know how they're working
on the off season.

249
00:12:43,430 --> 00:12:46,350
And also,
they're kind of many VCs.

250
00:12:46,391 --> 00:12:48,894
They make a phenomenal
amount of money doing what they do,

251
00:12:48,936 --> 00:12:51,480
so as they come in,
it's like having a new VC come in.

252
00:12:51,522 --> 00:12:52,898
VEGAS DAVE:
I had a federal case.

253
00:12:52,940 --> 00:12:54,358
I was the number-one
sports better in the world,

254
00:12:54,399 --> 00:12:58,529
and the casinos banned me
and they didn't wanna pay me.

255
00:12:58,570 --> 00:13:02,407
So I fought for my money,
and when I fought the casinos,

256
00:13:02,449 --> 00:13:06,119
they teamed up with the feds
and they indicted me on 19 alleged felony counts.

257
00:13:06,161 --> 00:13:08,121
So while I fought
that federal case,

258
00:13:08,163 --> 00:13:11,250
which was
a 40-year prison term, 19 alleged felonies,

259
00:13:11,291 --> 00:13:13,794
during that time,
they banned me from sports betting.

260
00:13:13,836 --> 00:13:15,921
So I had to figure out
another source of income.

261
00:13:15,963 --> 00:13:17,965
So I started consulting,
selling picks.

262
00:13:18,006 --> 00:13:20,926
But the other thing that I did
was get into sports cards.

263
00:13:20,968 --> 00:13:23,011
I was known as
the King of Futures.

264
00:13:23,053 --> 00:13:25,514
I have all the biggest
payouts in the history of sports betting.

265
00:13:25,556 --> 00:13:29,685
I could predict teams that
would win the World Series at very long-shot odds,

266
00:13:29,726 --> 00:13:34,439
including the record-breaking
Kansas City Royals, 100,000 to win 2.5 million

267
00:13:34,481 --> 00:13:36,567
for a team that
never won a World Series for 30 years.

268
00:13:36,608 --> 00:13:39,111
So, I was the king of futures.
I just had a vision.

269
00:13:39,152 --> 00:13:40,821
So when they banned me,

270
00:13:40,863 --> 00:13:43,824
and eventually
I did beat the case, no felonies, no prison time.

271
00:13:43,866 --> 00:13:45,242
But I'm still banned.

272
00:13:45,284 --> 00:13:47,286
So what I did when I got in
the sports card industry,

273
00:13:47,327 --> 00:13:51,748
I just parlayed my visions
of sports cards, um, kind of like futures in sports.

274
00:14:07,723 --> 00:14:10,934
MARK WARSOP:
The Panini business was founded in 1954,

275
00:14:10,976 --> 00:14:14,855
and was actually originally
a newspaper distribution business in Italy,

276
00:14:14,897 --> 00:14:17,649
based in a small town
called Modena.

277
00:14:17,691 --> 00:14:23,447
Essentially, what they did is
they bought some small soccer images of players

278
00:14:23,488 --> 00:14:27,993
and inserted them
into the newspaper to try and sell more newspapers.

279
00:14:28,035 --> 00:14:33,290
And very quickly found out
that the demand for the actual collectible

280
00:14:33,332 --> 00:14:35,417
figurine sticker
inside the newspaper

281
00:14:35,459 --> 00:14:37,836
was more valuable
than the newspaper.

282
00:14:37,878 --> 00:14:41,798
So it morphed into
the very first sticker collection,

283
00:14:41,840 --> 00:14:44,218
which was for Calciatori,

284
00:14:44,259 --> 00:14:46,970
which in Italian
simply means "players. "

285
00:14:48,055 --> 00:14:51,225
And that was launched
in 1961,

286
00:14:51,266 --> 00:14:54,478
and took off incredibly quickly
in terms of demand.

287
00:14:54,520 --> 00:14:58,649
And then, Panini very quickly
established itself across all of Europe,

288
00:14:58,690 --> 00:15:02,486
buying up rights
predominantly for all the major soccer leagues,

289
00:15:02,528 --> 00:15:04,613
branched into South America,

290
00:15:04,655 --> 00:15:07,157
and then in 2009,

291
00:15:07,199 --> 00:15:12,246
started an operation in the U. S.
after acquiring the assets of the Donruss business,

292
00:15:12,287 --> 00:15:15,040
which became available
here in America.

293
00:15:15,082 --> 00:15:17,543
JOE DAVIS:
The sports card industry looks so much better today

294
00:15:17,584 --> 00:15:20,879
than it did
over the last 10 to 20 years.

295
00:15:20,921 --> 00:15:24,258
I've been in it full time
since 1991,

296
00:15:24,299 --> 00:15:27,594
and in 1991, we were
in the middle of a boom.

297
00:15:27,636 --> 00:15:30,681
But it quickly declined
by the mid-'90s.

298
00:15:30,722 --> 00:15:36,186
We've seen spikes and valleys
in the industry over the years,

299
00:15:36,228 --> 00:15:38,772
but I can say for sure,
without question,

300
00:15:38,814 --> 00:15:42,860
the last five years
have been the strongest I've ever experienced.

301
00:15:42,901 --> 00:15:44,903
When I was collecting cards
as a kid,

302
00:15:44,945 --> 00:15:50,492
your big brands were
Topps, Fleer, Donruss and Upper Deck.

303
00:15:50,534 --> 00:15:53,787
And those brands
actually still all exist today,

304
00:15:53,829 --> 00:15:55,914
although the ownership's
a little different.

305
00:15:55,956 --> 00:16:01,461
The four major U. S. sports
have given exclusive licenses to the card manufacturers.

306
00:16:01,503 --> 00:16:05,340
Right now, Panini's got
the exclusive license for football and basketball,

307
00:16:05,382 --> 00:16:08,093
Topps for baseball,
and Upper Deck for hockey.

308
00:16:08,135 --> 00:16:11,138
The licensing with sports cards
is really interesting,

309
00:16:11,180 --> 00:16:13,307
because, as a kid,
I grew up collecting Topps.

310
00:16:13,348 --> 00:16:15,893
That was my favorite company.
I love Topps Chrome.

311
00:16:15,934 --> 00:16:19,313
My most favorite memory
of being a kid

312
00:16:19,354 --> 00:16:22,691
was grabbing a Topps
Kobe Bryant rookie card from a dollar bin.

313
00:16:22,733 --> 00:16:27,821
I can't do that anymore
because Panini now owns the license for the NBA and NFL

314
00:16:27,863 --> 00:16:30,073
while Topps
is focused on baseball.

315
00:16:30,115 --> 00:16:31,783
DAVIS: When you think
about brands,

316
00:16:31,825 --> 00:16:34,244
first of all, you start with
different manufacturers.

317
00:16:34,286 --> 00:16:36,788
Each manufacturer
has multiple products,

318
00:16:36,830 --> 00:16:39,625
multiple brands of cards
that they produce.

319
00:16:39,666 --> 00:16:43,295
If you take Panini,
for instance, they make a number of great products.

320
00:16:43,337 --> 00:16:47,841
But in my mind,
I categorize them as kind of the entry-level products,

321
00:16:47,883 --> 00:16:50,135
the mid-tier,
and then the high-end.

322
00:16:50,177 --> 00:16:53,597
On the entry level,
you've got products like Score,

323
00:16:53,639 --> 00:16:56,725
and Hoops,
and Prestige, and Donruss.

324
00:16:56,767 --> 00:16:59,478
Then as you move up the scale
more into the middle tier,

325
00:16:59,520 --> 00:17:04,900
you've got products like
Mosaic, Prizm, Select, and Optic brands.

326
00:17:04,942 --> 00:17:06,860
And then as you move up
to the very top end,

327
00:17:06,902 --> 00:17:11,406
you've got products
like Flawless, National Treasures...

328
00:17:11,448 --> 00:17:13,408
Great cards
all the way up the scale,

329
00:17:13,450 --> 00:17:15,827
but a lot of
different variety there.

330
00:17:15,869 --> 00:17:19,331
I remember going
to the store as a kid,

331
00:17:19,373 --> 00:17:24,920
and they would have
boxes of 89, 90 Hoops on the shelf.

332
00:17:24,962 --> 00:17:26,964
I would buy a handful of packs,

333
00:17:27,005 --> 00:17:29,883
and then somebody else
would come in and buy a handful more.

334
00:17:29,925 --> 00:17:33,637
And I would come back
the next day and there'd be another box,

335
00:17:33,679 --> 00:17:36,431
and maybe even two,
and so on, and so on, and so on.

336
00:17:36,473 --> 00:17:38,100
They never ran out, it seemed.

337
00:17:38,141 --> 00:17:42,646
Nowadays, if you see
a handful of boxes on a card store shelf,

338
00:17:42,688 --> 00:17:45,482
once they're gone,
they may be gone forever.

339
00:17:45,524 --> 00:17:48,402
So, the big difference
between modern trading cards

340
00:17:48,443 --> 00:17:51,446
and trading cards
from 20, 30 years ago,

341
00:17:51,488 --> 00:17:53,991
when there was a crash
within the marketplace...

342
00:17:54,032 --> 00:17:57,119
If you go back
20, 30 years ago, you were buying products

343
00:17:57,160 --> 00:17:59,872
and essentially
what happened is manufacturers got greedy

344
00:17:59,913 --> 00:18:02,124
and they left the machines
running for a long time.

345
00:18:02,165 --> 00:18:05,669
So you would find
a rookie card in that product, think that it was rare,

346
00:18:05,711 --> 00:18:07,713
but essentially
there'd be thousands of them.

347
00:18:07,754 --> 00:18:10,215
You'd put it in the loft,
bring it down 20 years later

348
00:18:10,257 --> 00:18:13,385
and find out that eBay
had come around and your cards were worthless.

349
00:18:13,427 --> 00:18:15,053
And everybody gets
afraid of that.

350
00:18:15,095 --> 00:18:16,680
You know, it's a "bubble. "

351
00:18:16,722 --> 00:18:18,682
When the bubble burst
in the '90s,

352
00:18:18,724 --> 00:18:21,643
will it happen again,
or are they gonna increase print runs,

353
00:18:21,685 --> 00:18:23,937
and are they gonna
do this and that?

354
00:18:23,979 --> 00:18:29,776
Of course, that's something
that longtime collectors are never gonna forget.

355
00:18:29,818 --> 00:18:34,615
WARSOP: The difference
with modern-day cards is we now print on every card

356
00:18:34,656 --> 00:18:36,533
the volume of which
we're buying.

357
00:18:36,575 --> 00:18:40,412
So if we say this card
is numbered to 10, there will only ever be 10,

358
00:18:40,454 --> 00:18:42,247
and you know there's 10,

359
00:18:42,289 --> 00:18:45,792
which means that
you can be assured that it's gonna continue to remain

360
00:18:45,834 --> 00:18:49,546
in value and increase in value
based on how that player might perform.

361
00:19:00,140 --> 00:19:05,145
For us at PWCC,
we consider a vintage card 1986 or older.

362
00:19:05,187 --> 00:19:09,566
Modern kind of starts
when you get into the late '80s or '90s.

363
00:19:09,608 --> 00:19:14,696
The kind of middle ground
is about '87 to, let's say, '99.

364
00:19:14,738 --> 00:19:17,658
But a lot of
the really important parts of our industry

365
00:19:17,699 --> 00:19:20,452
were produced
from '96 and on.

366
00:19:20,494 --> 00:19:25,040
'96 was the first year that
they did serial numbering.

367
00:19:25,082 --> 00:19:26,917
So that was
super-important.

368
00:19:26,959 --> 00:19:28,919
There's only two Kobe rookies
that have serial numbering on them,

369
00:19:28,961 --> 00:19:32,381
and that's really...
that was the start that propelled our market

370
00:19:32,422 --> 00:19:34,341
to the modern market
that we have today.

371
00:19:34,383 --> 00:19:36,051
When I got back
into sports cards,

372
00:19:36,093 --> 00:19:38,303
one of the early mistakes
that I probably made

373
00:19:38,345 --> 00:19:42,891
was putting too much money
in risky young players.

374
00:19:42,933 --> 00:19:45,060
And I didn't know
how their careers were gonna turn out,

375
00:19:45,102 --> 00:19:47,062
but I liked
the upside potential.

376
00:19:47,104 --> 00:19:50,858
But that meant that
I invested a lot of money in guys like Justise Winslow

377
00:19:50,899 --> 00:19:52,359
and Mitchell Robinson,

378
00:19:52,401 --> 00:19:55,946
names that I thought could
go on to become great players,

379
00:19:55,988 --> 00:19:58,323
but never really
played out that way.

380
00:19:58,365 --> 00:20:00,826
So their card values
didn't go up the way I was hoping.

381
00:20:00,868 --> 00:20:02,536
ROB GOUGH: If you look at
vintage versus modern,

382
00:20:02,578 --> 00:20:04,288
for me,
I'm more of a vintage guy.

383
00:20:04,329 --> 00:20:08,208
And the reason why is
I'm not gonna put $5 million

384
00:20:08,250 --> 00:20:10,586
into a guy that's
currently playing baseball.

385
00:20:10,627 --> 00:20:13,172
The guy could
slide into home play. He can get hurt.

386
00:20:13,213 --> 00:20:15,716
He can say something stupid
in the news.

387
00:20:15,757 --> 00:20:17,176
He could do something illegal.

388
00:20:17,217 --> 00:20:19,761
That $5-million card
then goes down to nothing.

389
00:20:19,803 --> 00:20:21,889
He could retire early
without a championship.

390
00:20:21,930 --> 00:20:23,307
You never know
what's gonna happen.

391
00:20:23,891 --> 00:20:25,559
Versus vintage...

392
00:20:25,601 --> 00:20:27,352
You know,
he's already kind of past.

393
00:20:27,394 --> 00:20:28,812
He's already
created his legacy.

394
00:20:28,854 --> 00:20:31,273
It's a very consistent history.

395
00:20:31,315 --> 00:20:32,733
You know what you're getting,

396
00:20:32,774 --> 00:20:35,277
and the price is not gonna
fluctuate because of it.

397
00:20:35,319 --> 00:20:36,862
So, for me, it's a lot safer.

398
00:20:36,904 --> 00:20:39,406
I think of it as
Apple/Google stock,

399
00:20:39,448 --> 00:20:41,867
and I think of a current player
as a penny stock.

400
00:20:41,909 --> 00:20:44,161
That he has a great game,
the price goes up 10X,

401
00:20:44,203 --> 00:20:46,330
but he has a really, you know,
something terrible happens

402
00:20:46,371 --> 00:20:47,664
and it goes down tremendously.

403
00:20:47,706 --> 00:20:51,084
So, for me,
it's a safer play and, um...

404
00:20:51,126 --> 00:20:53,545
And it's also there's just
so many rookie cards.

405
00:20:53,587 --> 00:20:56,965
Like let's look at, you know,
a LeBron James rookie.

406
00:20:57,007 --> 00:21:01,345
Yes, they're gonna have
a couple very expensive LeBron James rookies,

407
00:21:01,386 --> 00:21:03,597
but there's so many different
versions of his rookie card.

408
00:21:03,639 --> 00:21:05,807
There's so many different
population of it.

409
00:21:05,849 --> 00:21:08,894
Whereas let's say Mickey Mantle,
there's only one card.

410
00:21:08,936 --> 00:21:12,105
And that's very important for me
from a collection standpoint.

411
00:21:12,147 --> 00:21:14,316
I chose to invest in
a modern-day player.

412
00:21:14,358 --> 00:21:16,276
I'll never understand vintage.

413
00:21:16,318 --> 00:21:19,738
How can that guy's card go up
while he's in the grave dead, collecting dust?

414
00:21:19,780 --> 00:21:23,575
With Mike Trout,
I wanted to buy a card and a player

415
00:21:23,617 --> 00:21:25,702
that could improve his stats
every year,

416
00:21:25,744 --> 00:21:28,830
'cause if he could improve
his stats every year, the card value would go up.

417
00:21:28,872 --> 00:21:30,374
So I don't believe in vintage.

418
00:21:30,415 --> 00:21:32,709
I don't believe that
a Babe Ruth can keep going up.

419
00:21:32,751 --> 00:21:35,128
That's why I think
the Mickey Mantle buy is so stupid.

420
00:21:35,170 --> 00:21:38,507
The two dumbest buys
in the history right now

421
00:21:38,549 --> 00:21:40,676
are Luka Doncic for $4 million,
which is a joke.

422
00:21:40,717 --> 00:21:42,469
Guy's been playing
three years,

423
00:21:42,511 --> 00:21:44,596
and you're gonna pay
$4 million for a guy that's played 3 years.

424
00:21:44,638 --> 00:21:47,599
And Mickey Mantle?
The dude's dead.

425
00:21:47,641 --> 00:21:49,309
Card's not gonna
keep appreciating.

426
00:21:56,441 --> 00:21:58,443
You know, in 2009,

427
00:21:58,485 --> 00:22:02,114
when Panini came into
the U. S. market, you know, there are three things they did.

428
00:22:02,155 --> 00:22:04,074
They got the exclusive
in the NBA,

429
00:22:04,116 --> 00:22:06,076
they bought Donruss

430
00:22:06,118 --> 00:22:10,539
to put that foothold
in the trading card space here in Texas,

431
00:22:10,581 --> 00:22:13,792
and they went out
and signed Kobe Bryant as a global ambassador.

432
00:22:13,834 --> 00:22:17,796
And he was super-important
for us because, you know, as a kid, he lived in Italy.

433
00:22:17,838 --> 00:22:19,298
He understood the Panini brand.

434
00:22:19,339 --> 00:22:21,300
He collected Panini stickers.

435
00:22:21,341 --> 00:22:23,260
So there was already
that connection.

436
00:22:23,302 --> 00:22:25,804
Kobe really became
like a brand ambassador

437
00:22:25,846 --> 00:22:28,891
and a launch platform
for Panini in the U. S. ,

438
00:22:28,932 --> 00:22:33,061
and we've had that exclusive
relationship, obviously, all the way up until today.

439
00:22:33,103 --> 00:22:35,439
Obviously,
Panini was very distraught

440
00:22:35,480 --> 00:22:38,483
at the passing of Kobe
so prematurely,

441
00:22:38,525 --> 00:22:41,069
but we'll continue to develop

442
00:22:41,111 --> 00:22:44,615
high-quality trading cards
for Kobe for many years to come.

443
00:22:44,656 --> 00:22:47,910
This Eminence Collection
is a beautiful collection

444
00:22:48,785 --> 00:22:51,872
of my career

445
00:22:51,914 --> 00:22:56,251
and some of the great moments
that were captured within it.

446
00:22:58,003 --> 00:23:02,841
As I sit here and sign
card after card,

447
00:23:02,883 --> 00:23:06,053
I play a little game with myself
in terms of trying to remember

448
00:23:06,094 --> 00:23:09,056
the exact moment
on the card that I'm signing.

449
00:23:09,097 --> 00:23:12,643
And I can pretty much remember
every single one.

450
00:23:12,684 --> 00:23:17,272
Which is a little frightening,
I would think.

451
00:23:17,314 --> 00:23:21,151
But it's awesome to take
a trip down memory lane as I sign each card,

452
00:23:21,193 --> 00:23:24,404
and all of these things
seem like they just happened yesterday, so...

453
00:23:24,446 --> 00:23:27,074
It's pretty cool of Panini
to create such a beautiful set.

454
00:23:27,115 --> 00:23:29,409
When Panini came into
the U. S. market,

455
00:23:29,451 --> 00:23:32,663
Kobe wanted to do
something different in the trading card space.

456
00:23:32,704 --> 00:23:35,374
And really, what's happening
in the trading card space right now

457
00:23:35,415 --> 00:23:39,336
is kind of
what Kobe's vision was way back in 2009.

458
00:23:39,378 --> 00:23:40,963
He wanted to change it.

459
00:23:41,004 --> 00:23:44,466
He wanted to create disruption
in the trading card space.

460
00:23:44,508 --> 00:23:48,679
And so, you know,
just like Kobe, that mentality that he carried on the court

461
00:23:48,720 --> 00:23:51,932
is kind of...
it's in the Panini America DNA.

462
00:23:51,974 --> 00:23:53,851
When Panini develops
a new product,

463
00:23:53,892 --> 00:23:58,397
we're always looking to have
a unique item in each box,

464
00:23:58,438 --> 00:24:02,067
which makes sure that
collectors will come in and buy multiple brands.

465
00:24:02,109 --> 00:24:04,278
So, the manufacturing process
of a trading card

466
00:24:04,319 --> 00:24:08,574
is very much dependant on
which brand we're looking at,

467
00:24:08,615 --> 00:24:11,660
because there's so many
different print technologies that we use.

468
00:24:11,702 --> 00:24:13,871
In fact,
the trading card industry

469
00:24:13,912 --> 00:24:18,584
stretches the boundaries
of print and technology like nothing else on the planet.

470
00:24:18,625 --> 00:24:20,586
In most places in the world,
print is dead.

471
00:24:20,627 --> 00:24:22,087
Everything has moved
to digital.

472
00:24:22,129 --> 00:24:24,423
So trading cards
are really leading the way

473
00:24:24,464 --> 00:24:27,092
in stretching the boundaries
on new print technologies.

474
00:24:27,134 --> 00:24:29,386
For example, if there's
game-used equipment in there,

475
00:24:29,428 --> 00:24:31,680
we have to get that
game-used piece of equipment.

476
00:24:31,722 --> 00:24:33,265
We de-seam it.

477
00:24:33,307 --> 00:24:35,684
We put a lacquer on the back,
which has a unique barcode

478
00:24:35,726 --> 00:24:38,937
that will identify that
piece of memorabilia forever.

479
00:24:38,979 --> 00:24:42,274
So even if you were to grab
that trading card in 20 years,

480
00:24:42,316 --> 00:24:44,318
we could take
that piece of memorabilia,

481
00:24:44,359 --> 00:24:45,986
scan the barcode
on the back of it

482
00:24:46,028 --> 00:24:48,071
and tell you exactly
which jersey it came from.

483
00:24:48,113 --> 00:24:49,823
That process takes place.

484
00:24:49,865 --> 00:24:52,242
We have to collect
all the autographs from all the players.

485
00:24:52,284 --> 00:24:54,036
This can take many weeks.

486
00:24:54,077 --> 00:24:56,121
A lot of the time
some of the players in soccer, for example,

487
00:24:56,163 --> 00:24:57,748
are all over the world.

488
00:24:57,789 --> 00:25:00,626
And then when all of these
components come together,

489
00:25:00,667 --> 00:25:03,837
a majority of the cards
are printed on press.

490
00:25:03,879 --> 00:25:08,008
However, a lot of the
memorabilia and autograph cards are still built by hand,

491
00:25:08,050 --> 00:25:10,344
and this process
can take some time.

492
00:25:10,385 --> 00:25:14,932
So, again, where most people
think, "Ink and cardboard, easy, turn the machine on, "

493
00:25:14,973 --> 00:25:16,850
it's just not
the way that it rolls.

494
00:25:16,892 --> 00:25:18,268
Memorabilia is
one of the other things

495
00:25:18,310 --> 00:25:21,063
that's really transformed
and differentiated

496
00:25:21,104 --> 00:25:23,440
you know,
the modern-day trading card

497
00:25:23,482 --> 00:25:25,984
compared to
the vintage category,

498
00:25:26,026 --> 00:25:29,279
in that
you're getting autographs from the players.

499
00:25:29,321 --> 00:25:34,701
In the products nowadays,
you're getting game-worn, game-used jerseys

500
00:25:34,743 --> 00:25:37,079
that are cut up and then
put into cards over here.

501
00:25:37,120 --> 00:25:39,414
You won't see
is a mess in my office

502
00:25:39,456 --> 00:25:41,875
of Cowboys jerseys
and Rams jerseys

503
00:25:41,917 --> 00:25:46,547
and 49ers jerseys,
all waiting to be cut up to be put into trading cards.

504
00:25:46,588 --> 00:25:48,257
WARSOP: Although we have
a vast number of brands,

505
00:25:48,298 --> 00:25:51,009
one of our key ones
is Rated Rookie,

506
00:25:51,051 --> 00:25:53,971
because rookies
are a key driver within the product,

507
00:25:54,012 --> 00:25:56,765
so it wouldn't be unusual
to see an athlete

508
00:25:56,807 --> 00:26:01,395
wearing a Rated Rookie T-shirt
whilst walking down the street.

509
00:26:01,436 --> 00:26:06,483
The brands have become
iconic over the years, not just within trading cards.

510
00:26:06,525 --> 00:26:08,694
Just thinking about
what Rated Rookie means

511
00:26:08,735 --> 00:26:11,071
to the hobby community,
the trading card community...

512
00:26:11,113 --> 00:26:14,157
Every kid remembers
that Rated Rookie in that royal blue

513
00:26:14,199 --> 00:26:17,327
and the iconic logo
that was on that card.

514
00:26:17,369 --> 00:26:20,497
That Rated Rookie legacy
is continuing today.

515
00:26:20,539 --> 00:26:23,667
Think about, you know,
all the guys that kind of come through.

516
00:26:23,709 --> 00:26:26,336
It really starts with
the moment they declare for the Draft,

517
00:26:26,378 --> 00:26:28,255
or announce that
they're gonna be a pro.

518
00:26:28,297 --> 00:26:30,174
We've had so many players
come through,

519
00:26:30,215 --> 00:26:32,759
whether that's, you know...
I think about Josh Jacobs,

520
00:26:32,801 --> 00:26:36,263
a guy that really kind of
stepped out and emerged,

521
00:26:36,305 --> 00:26:39,683
in week three
of his rookie year,

522
00:26:39,725 --> 00:26:43,187
-and that's that
Rated Rookie moment for him. -[REFEREE WHISTLES]

523
00:26:43,228 --> 00:26:45,189
COMMENTATOR:
His third of the day!

524
00:26:45,230 --> 00:26:48,025
And for collectors knowing that
they had picked up that card back in August,

525
00:26:48,066 --> 00:26:50,986
before he'd even stepped
on the field.

526
00:26:51,028 --> 00:26:53,155
You know, that's that
prospecting culture,

527
00:26:53,197 --> 00:26:56,658
that's that Rated Rookie,
why everyone loves to collect it.

528
00:26:56,700 --> 00:27:00,078
During Draft night
we had a lot of interviews, a lot of different things,

529
00:27:00,120 --> 00:27:02,372
and even leading up
to the Draft.

530
00:27:02,414 --> 00:27:05,375
Oh, man. Panini was
the first to really, like,

531
00:27:05,417 --> 00:27:08,837
show me how huge
the card game was.

532
00:27:08,879 --> 00:27:10,797
They showed me
the Rated Rookie cards.

533
00:27:10,839 --> 00:27:12,633
They were showing us
the limited edition.

534
00:27:12,674 --> 00:27:14,551
They let us put on the chain,
you know what I'm saying?

535
00:27:14,593 --> 00:27:16,803
Walk out, take pictures,
and things like that.

536
00:27:16,845 --> 00:27:19,806
So it was just
a dope experience, really.

537
00:27:19,848 --> 00:27:24,102
The 24th pick
in the 2019 NFL Draft,

538
00:27:25,103 --> 00:27:26,980
the Oakland Raiders select...

539
00:27:27,022 --> 00:27:30,150
JACOBS: So, people don't know
about the Draft and I tell people

540
00:27:30,192 --> 00:27:34,196
it was a blessing to be there,
but it's the longest day ever.

541
00:27:34,238 --> 00:27:37,699
Like, you have media interviews,
all before the Draft.

542
00:27:37,741 --> 00:27:42,162
And then, like, the...
the longest part is sitting in the room and waiting,

543
00:27:42,204 --> 00:27:45,832
hearing all the guys go in
and being excited for your friends and things like that,

544
00:27:45,874 --> 00:27:47,376
having your family there
with you.

545
00:27:47,417 --> 00:27:49,419
And then you hear
your name called...

546
00:27:49,461 --> 00:27:51,004
Josh Jacobs.

547
00:27:51,046 --> 00:27:53,757
And I remember just
walking out,

548
00:27:53,799 --> 00:27:55,843
and it was weird,
because I was like,

549
00:27:55,884 --> 00:27:58,554
the only thing I was
thinking about when I went up the stairs was, "Do not fall. "

550
00:27:58,595 --> 00:28:00,931
Do not fall
when you walk up these steps.

551
00:28:00,973 --> 00:28:03,600
Oh. But, man,
hugging Roger Goodell

552
00:28:03,642 --> 00:28:05,227
and seeing that "1"
on the jersey...

553
00:28:05,269 --> 00:28:07,104
Man, seeing the excitement
from the crowd,

554
00:28:07,145 --> 00:28:08,856
um, it was definitely
a blessing.

555
00:28:08,897 --> 00:28:11,733
Due to the overwhelming demand
for trading cards

556
00:28:11,775 --> 00:28:15,946
and the fact that
we're not manufacturing any larger volumes on the hobby,

557
00:28:15,988 --> 00:28:20,117
this has pushed
a vast number of people into retail.

558
00:28:20,158 --> 00:28:23,036
You see people lining up
outside of hobby stores.

559
00:28:23,078 --> 00:28:26,373
We have people sleeping
outside of Targets and Walmarts,

560
00:28:26,415 --> 00:28:31,086
waiting for that product to drop
and get on to the shelves at those stores now.

561
00:28:31,128 --> 00:28:32,504
It's insane.

562
00:28:32,546 --> 00:28:35,299
One of the challenges
the sports card market is facing

563
00:28:35,340 --> 00:28:38,677
is the fact that
it's really difficult to find products

564
00:28:38,719 --> 00:28:40,971
in big-box
retail stores anymore.

565
00:28:41,013 --> 00:28:45,267
And the reason for that
is because flippers are taking advantage.

566
00:28:45,309 --> 00:28:47,394
They are going to
big-box retail stores

567
00:28:47,436 --> 00:28:51,023
the day products
are put on shelves, buying as many as they can,

568
00:28:51,064 --> 00:28:54,526
because then they're able
to resell them online that same night

569
00:28:54,568 --> 00:28:57,738
for three times, four times,
five times, or more.

570
00:29:15,297 --> 00:29:18,050
Because these flippers
have been raiding retail stores

571
00:29:18,091 --> 00:29:21,220
and then selling boxes online
for several times more,

572
00:29:21,261 --> 00:29:25,098
it can sometimes be hard to find
a box at a reasonable price.

573
00:29:25,140 --> 00:29:27,351
It can be
really, really difficult

574
00:29:27,392 --> 00:29:30,103
to get anything of value
out of that box

575
00:29:30,145 --> 00:29:31,688
based on the price
you had to pay.

576
00:29:31,730 --> 00:29:34,191
I believe that anyone that
buys something at MSRP

577
00:29:34,233 --> 00:29:37,611
to flip it for 50%, 100%
right there and then...

578
00:29:37,653 --> 00:29:39,571
I mean, there should be
some type of law against it.

579
00:29:39,613 --> 00:29:42,658
In the future,
it's three years down the line, a year down the line,

580
00:29:42,699 --> 00:29:44,618
they stopped making it...
I get it.

581
00:29:44,660 --> 00:29:47,829
But not when it's attainable
at a card store like this,

582
00:29:47,871 --> 00:29:50,791
I can come walk in and say,
"Hey, can I get a UFC box?"

583
00:29:50,832 --> 00:29:55,003
Instead of
right now, after today, those boxes will be $1,300.

584
00:29:55,045 --> 00:29:57,798
2020, there still was stuff
at the beginning of the year

585
00:29:57,840 --> 00:30:00,300
that would sit on the shelf
for literally 6, 8 months.

586
00:30:00,342 --> 00:30:04,096
And every time it came in,
you'd kind of cringe.

587
00:30:04,137 --> 00:30:07,933
About March of 2020,
stuff like Heritage started disappearing.

588
00:30:07,975 --> 00:30:10,185
Opening day,
it would fly off the shelves.

589
00:30:10,227 --> 00:30:12,604
I mean, they would just
take anything there was.

590
00:30:12,646 --> 00:30:14,857
I still wasn't seeing people
around me,

591
00:30:14,898 --> 00:30:17,901
but the stuff
definitely was not there when I went back the next week.

592
00:30:17,943 --> 00:30:20,445
Slowly, I'd start noticing
people around me.

593
00:30:21,989 --> 00:30:23,532
They, you know...
They come up, talk,

594
00:30:23,574 --> 00:30:26,201
be nice, you know,
blah, blah, blah.

595
00:30:26,243 --> 00:30:28,912
Got a little bit creepy
when I was doing other work in the store

596
00:30:28,954 --> 00:30:32,541
and they'd come at me,
"When are you putting out the cards?"

597
00:30:32,583 --> 00:30:35,419
After March 20th, there would
start being crowds around me.

598
00:30:35,460 --> 00:30:40,632
And maybe it started out
at some stores two or three, then three or four.

599
00:30:40,674 --> 00:30:43,594
People started
following me to areas nowhere near their home.

600
00:30:44,511 --> 00:30:45,721
It did get worse.

601
00:30:45,762 --> 00:30:47,764
I mean, people would
come up, grab stuff.

602
00:30:47,806 --> 00:30:51,643
I'd be accused of
holding product for different people and all that,

603
00:30:51,685 --> 00:30:55,814
and anybody
who doesn't get product feels that they were messed with,

604
00:30:55,856 --> 00:30:57,649
because it's all their right
to get it all.

605
00:30:58,692 --> 00:31:00,235
Security did change.

606
00:31:00,277 --> 00:31:02,487
They started roping me off,

607
00:31:02,529 --> 00:31:05,532
and I had
a security guard with me the whole time I was working,

608
00:31:05,574 --> 00:31:09,369
and with the option
to be escorted out to my car if I wanted to be.

609
00:31:09,411 --> 00:31:13,040
I would come in different doors
to try to lose people.

610
00:31:13,081 --> 00:31:14,625
I would work odd hours.

611
00:31:14,666 --> 00:31:17,461
Shoppers at a Brookfield Target
were forced to run and hide

612
00:31:17,503 --> 00:31:19,505
after a fight this morning
in the parking lot.

613
00:31:19,546 --> 00:31:23,425
Police say it all started
with a disagreement over trading cards.

614
00:31:23,467 --> 00:31:25,928
Recently, Target implemented
new rules.

615
00:31:25,969 --> 00:31:29,097
Trading cards are
only sold at 8:00 a. m. on Fridays,

616
00:31:29,139 --> 00:31:32,017
and customers are limited
to one pack per person.

617
00:31:32,059 --> 00:31:35,687
Just 20 minutes after
sales began this morning, things got physical.

618
00:31:35,729 --> 00:31:38,148
REPORTER: Brookfield Police
say a 35-year-old man

619
00:31:38,190 --> 00:31:41,860
was physically assaulted
by four other men in the parking lot

620
00:31:41,902 --> 00:31:44,821
after an argument
over sports trading cards.

621
00:31:44,863 --> 00:31:48,075
The victim pulled out the gun
he was legally carrying,

622
00:31:48,116 --> 00:31:50,035
and the four attackers
ran away.

623
00:31:50,077 --> 00:31:51,954
All four later arrested.

624
00:31:51,995 --> 00:31:54,122
OFFICER: Let me see your hands.
Put your hands up.

625
00:31:54,164 --> 00:31:56,667
REPORTER: Officers found
the other four men around the area,

626
00:31:56,708 --> 00:31:58,252
putting each in handcuffs.

627
00:31:58,293 --> 00:32:01,547
What's so big
about these right now?

628
00:32:01,588 --> 00:32:03,131
MAN: It's, like,
a craze for it.

629
00:32:03,173 --> 00:32:06,927
So people are buying it all out
and, like, reselling it.

630
00:32:06,969 --> 00:32:09,012
-OFFICER: Yeah?
-MAN: Because they're like...

631
00:32:09,054 --> 00:32:12,766
They're kind of selling
for double or triple more than what they go for in the store.

632
00:32:12,808 --> 00:32:16,061
It is crazy. The marketplace
is insane right now.

633
00:32:16,103 --> 00:32:17,855
It's unbelievable.

634
00:32:17,896 --> 00:32:20,357
Even from just
a year and a half ago when I got into the hobby,

635
00:32:20,399 --> 00:32:22,234
they weren't going
for that much.

636
00:32:22,276 --> 00:32:25,320
But now, it's like,
a new box of baseball is, like, $1,400 now.

637
00:32:25,362 --> 00:32:28,115
It is getting
harder and harder to buy some of the newer stuff

638
00:32:28,156 --> 00:32:32,160
'cause it is just...
it is so expensive and a lot of people want it.

639
00:32:32,202 --> 00:32:34,496
So, it's hard to get
your hands on it sometimes.

640
00:32:34,538 --> 00:32:37,040
I got here
at 9:00 p. m. last night.

641
00:32:37,082 --> 00:32:38,917
There was about
almost 100 people sitting in line.

642
00:32:38,959 --> 00:32:40,711
-INTERVIEWER: Wow.
-It's getting bigger and bigger.

643
00:32:40,752 --> 00:32:41,879
INTERVIEWER: Do you go...

644
00:32:41,920 --> 00:32:44,214
Do you guys go
to each spot every day?

645
00:32:44,256 --> 00:32:46,258
Nah, you got to know
the drop zones.

646
00:32:46,300 --> 00:32:48,427
[CHUCKLING]
It's a secret society.

647
00:32:48,468 --> 00:32:50,470
You're just player, all right?
I'm just getting in.

648
00:32:50,512 --> 00:32:52,890
Like I say, you don't know,
you won't know.

649
00:32:52,931 --> 00:32:54,850
You're gonna miss
every day.

650
00:32:54,892 --> 00:32:58,145
MAN: The reason
why everybody is in line is mostly to flip.

651
00:32:58,187 --> 00:33:00,105
To make money,
to profit from it.

652
00:33:00,147 --> 00:33:05,027
Um, these boxes might cost
20, 15 bucks, and you can sell them for hundreds.

653
00:33:05,068 --> 00:33:09,198
So, a lot of people just...
They're after the money, mostly.

654
00:33:09,239 --> 00:33:12,159
And then, like,
there are some hobbyists that just have to do this

655
00:33:12,201 --> 00:33:14,578
because you won't be able
to get cards in retail. So...

656
00:33:14,620 --> 00:33:16,413
INTERVIEWER: Do you
consider yourself a flipper?

657
00:33:16,455 --> 00:33:18,165
You know how everybody
calls people flippers?

658
00:33:18,207 --> 00:33:19,833
Yeah, of course. Of course.

659
00:33:19,875 --> 00:33:22,669
I mean, I wouldn't be here
if I wasn't. [LAUGHS]

660
00:33:22,711 --> 00:33:26,381
In 2020, people started bringing
a lot of product back to Target,

661
00:33:26,423 --> 00:33:31,762
and I actually had one reseller
tell me he likes buying from Target and Walmart

662
00:33:31,803 --> 00:33:33,055
because they take returns.

663
00:33:33,096 --> 00:33:35,307
So, anything
he cannot sell online,

664
00:33:35,349 --> 00:33:37,059
he gets his money back for.

665
00:33:37,100 --> 00:33:38,727
The problem with that is

666
00:33:38,769 --> 00:33:41,897
some people know
how to reseal the product and put junk in there,

667
00:33:41,939 --> 00:33:44,191
that it is basically
useless to anyone

668
00:33:44,233 --> 00:33:48,570
and it will not get caught
until the next person buys it and then returns it.

669
00:34:13,262 --> 00:34:14,638
INTERVIEWER: Nothing?

670
00:34:14,680 --> 00:34:17,349
I just got a Pokemon
because they ran out of Optics.

671
00:34:17,391 --> 00:34:20,727
My friend got all the Optics
and then I got NBA Hoops.

672
00:34:20,769 --> 00:34:22,813
-Oh, you did get
a Hoops, though. -I got a Hoops.

673
00:34:22,855 --> 00:34:24,857
So, we're gonna get
some Ja Morant.

674
00:34:24,898 --> 00:34:26,817
We don't go to sleep
until we get the money.

675
00:34:26,859 --> 00:34:30,779
As an owner of an actual
TCG company like MetaZoo,

676
00:34:30,821 --> 00:34:34,116
it's not up to us
what the secondary market price is at.

677
00:34:34,157 --> 00:34:37,202
We're gonna sell it as MSRP,
at that price,

678
00:34:37,244 --> 00:34:42,207
and we allow
the secondary market to dictate what the value of this box is,

679
00:34:42,249 --> 00:34:44,376
what the value
of these items are.

680
00:34:44,418 --> 00:34:47,171
The secondary market
is incredibly important

681
00:34:47,212 --> 00:34:52,926
in defining the rarity
or the desirability of the actual product.

682
00:35:07,149 --> 00:35:09,401
Hi, Joe. I gotta pick up
something for my son here,

683
00:35:09,443 --> 00:35:12,029
I gotta take him back maybe
a little football to break.

684
00:35:12,070 --> 00:35:13,655
If you're gonna go buy boxes,

685
00:35:13,697 --> 00:35:17,117
you could go to
a local card shop or an online card retailer

686
00:35:17,159 --> 00:35:19,745
where you're gonna find
what are called hobby boxes.

687
00:35:19,786 --> 00:35:22,915
They're more expensive,
but often packed with better cards.

688
00:35:22,956 --> 00:35:24,166
We're gonna have
a big rip party.

689
00:35:24,208 --> 00:35:25,334
He'll have a lot of fun
with this.

690
00:35:27,169 --> 00:35:28,879
-Hope you get
some great pulls. -Excellent.

691
00:35:28,921 --> 00:35:32,758
DAVIS: I started
GotBaseballCards back in May of 1991.

692
00:35:32,799 --> 00:35:34,718
At the time,
I was doing card shows

693
00:35:34,760 --> 00:35:36,845
with a college friend
named Jeff Porter,

694
00:35:36,887 --> 00:35:39,306
and we would travel around
the southeast doing shows.

695
00:35:39,348 --> 00:35:41,475
And he was working
in a card store

696
00:35:41,517 --> 00:35:44,436
and the owner
had decided to close.

697
00:35:44,478 --> 00:35:47,940
And he called me and said,
"Hey, you know, we can buy out this store. "

698
00:35:47,981 --> 00:35:51,735
So, we partnered
and opened the store in May of 1991,

699
00:35:51,777 --> 00:35:54,154
and then I bought him out
a few years later.

700
00:35:54,196 --> 00:35:58,534
So, I've been going at it
for over 30 years now full time.

701
00:35:58,575 --> 00:36:02,871
We went through some of the
most transformational changes we've ever seen during COVID.

702
00:36:02,913 --> 00:36:04,831
First of all,
our retail store shut down.

703
00:36:04,873 --> 00:36:09,419
We've actually been closed
for regular walk-in for about a year now.

704
00:36:09,461 --> 00:36:12,381
The market
actually grew exponentially during that time.

705
00:36:12,422 --> 00:36:15,467
We shifted all of our focus
to online.

706
00:36:15,509 --> 00:36:17,761
The changes in the industry
were staggering.

707
00:36:17,803 --> 00:36:22,182
When COVID first hit
and all the leagues started to shut down,

708
00:36:22,224 --> 00:36:25,102
we were very concerned about
the impact it was gonna have on the industry

709
00:36:25,143 --> 00:36:28,480
'cause it was...
We felt it was like a strike.

710
00:36:28,522 --> 00:36:30,816
I've lived through a lot
of strikes in this industry

711
00:36:30,858 --> 00:36:32,651
and I saw
how it hurt the industry.

712
00:36:32,693 --> 00:36:35,696
But we had a fear
it was gonna impact it the same way.

713
00:36:35,737 --> 00:36:40,492
But instead, it seemed that
it fueled the fire more because people were at home,

714
00:36:40,534 --> 00:36:42,953
fathers and sons
were collecting together,

715
00:36:42,995 --> 00:36:45,330
reigniting the passion
they had had as a kid,

716
00:36:45,372 --> 00:36:47,624
and the dads
were teaching the sons, and so forth.

717
00:36:47,666 --> 00:36:51,879
So, we started seeing
an incredible growth of new business,

718
00:36:51,920 --> 00:36:54,339
new customers
we'd never dealt with before

719
00:36:54,381 --> 00:36:56,800
who were approaching us
wanting to place orders, buy cards,

720
00:36:56,842 --> 00:36:58,969
sending us want lists,
filling old sets.

721
00:36:59,011 --> 00:37:02,681
So, it was...
The growth in the last year has been unbelievable,

722
00:37:02,723 --> 00:37:04,349
something we never
expected to see.

723
00:37:21,283 --> 00:37:25,245
MAN: I'm Parry Solomon.
I run Wonder Water Sports Cards Comics & Games.

724
00:37:25,287 --> 00:37:29,249
We've been doing this
since March of 1989.

725
00:37:29,291 --> 00:37:33,128
So, I've lived
in Clearwater, Florida for the last 32-plus years.

726
00:37:33,170 --> 00:37:36,006
I think the one thing
that we've done is that we do a lot of everything,

727
00:37:36,048 --> 00:37:37,799
we're not just
a card shop, obviously.

728
00:37:37,841 --> 00:37:41,470
We do comic books,
we do games, we do toys, we do memorabilia.

729
00:37:41,512 --> 00:37:45,891
There's a lot of things that
certain card shops don't do.

730
00:37:45,933 --> 00:37:48,769
We try to be more of
a one-stop shop

731
00:37:48,810 --> 00:37:52,689
for whatever
collectors in the family... Whatever they're into.

732
00:37:52,731 --> 00:37:57,027
Early on, we would do
whatever it took to try to get product.

733
00:37:57,069 --> 00:37:59,071
We would visit
candy wholesalers locally.

734
00:37:59,112 --> 00:38:01,782
My father would drive to Canada
to get hockey cards.

735
00:38:01,823 --> 00:38:04,826
We're from Canada originally,
so he had contacts there business-wise

736
00:38:04,868 --> 00:38:06,370
that he would get stuff from.

737
00:38:06,411 --> 00:38:09,206
But it was always
very difficult

738
00:38:09,248 --> 00:38:11,542
in those early years
to get product.

739
00:38:11,583 --> 00:38:13,335
So, in 2017,
things started changing,

740
00:38:13,377 --> 00:38:15,754
and our relationship
with the distributors started to change.

741
00:38:15,796 --> 00:38:17,714
We, you know...

742
00:38:17,756 --> 00:38:21,760
We were now given limitations
on what product we could buy, at what price.

743
00:38:21,802 --> 00:38:23,136
They would raise the price.

744
00:38:23,178 --> 00:38:25,180
And it became...

745
00:38:25,222 --> 00:38:27,516
So now, like,
the price rises daily.

746
00:38:27,558 --> 00:38:30,561
You know, when I call,
if I bought something yesterday,

747
00:38:30,602 --> 00:38:33,939
it's probably more today
to buy that same item.

748
00:38:33,981 --> 00:38:39,611
We do our absolute best
to obtain as much product as we possibly can

749
00:38:39,653 --> 00:38:42,447
that meets the demands
of our customers.

750
00:38:42,489 --> 00:38:44,783
I pay attention
to our Facebook group.

751
00:38:44,825 --> 00:38:48,036
I pay attention to emails.
I watch social media.

752
00:38:48,078 --> 00:38:51,290
Everybody starts asking me,
"Hey, when are you getting this product?"

753
00:38:51,331 --> 00:38:53,166
"Hey, when are you listing
this product?"

754
00:38:53,208 --> 00:38:56,461
I know that I'm gonna need
a large amount of that product.

755
00:38:56,503 --> 00:38:59,506
In order to obtain it,
I go through distributors,

756
00:38:59,548 --> 00:39:02,384
they're massive
wholesale distributors

757
00:39:02,426 --> 00:39:08,348
that supply
all the different releases to retailers by release day.

758
00:39:08,390 --> 00:39:12,644
We kind of rely on
our relationships with them,

759
00:39:12,686 --> 00:39:16,148
and what we've done
in the past years

760
00:39:16,190 --> 00:39:19,943
to build up
what they call "allocations, "

761
00:39:19,985 --> 00:39:22,446
uh, for different products.

762
00:39:22,487 --> 00:39:27,868
So, basically,
the more you would spend on products,

763
00:39:27,910 --> 00:39:32,206
the more you would
then get of that product the next time it came around,

764
00:39:32,247 --> 00:39:35,751
or the more you would get
of other products later in the season.

765
00:39:35,792 --> 00:39:37,878
PARRY SOLOMON:
We can't get enough of anything.

766
00:39:37,920 --> 00:39:41,924
Uh, we get a small portion
direct from the manufacturers,

767
00:39:41,965 --> 00:39:44,676
and then we get
another small portion from the distributors.

768
00:39:44,718 --> 00:39:48,972
And that amount,
depending on how hot the product is,

769
00:39:49,014 --> 00:39:51,058
may not be enough
to last us for an hour.

770
00:39:51,099 --> 00:39:53,018
There's plenty of things
that we're sold out of...

771
00:39:53,060 --> 00:39:56,021
We open at noon.
There's plenty of things we're sold out of by 12:30.

772
00:39:56,063 --> 00:40:00,609
Quite often, if I wanted to,
we would be sold out before a product comes out.

773
00:40:00,651 --> 00:40:02,861
I could make two phone calls
and be sold out of everything.

774
00:40:02,903 --> 00:40:06,823
Today, due to
the raise in demand

775
00:40:06,865 --> 00:40:10,661
um, for breaks
and for boxes and for cases,

776
00:40:10,702 --> 00:40:13,539
we are currently, uh...

777
00:40:13,580 --> 00:40:17,376
We're paying
close to going retail price,

778
00:40:17,417 --> 00:40:19,837
uh, just to replenish stock.

779
00:40:19,878 --> 00:40:27,719
The rise in price
in particular products, currently...

780
00:40:27,761 --> 00:40:33,809
I think a lot of it
was driven from, you know, the beginning of the pandemic.

781
00:40:33,851 --> 00:40:37,980
I don't know that
he industry has fully caught up to the demand.

782
00:40:38,021 --> 00:40:39,731
I don't know that it ever will.

783
00:40:39,773 --> 00:40:41,984
INTERVIEWER:
Could you ever imagine shutting your doors down

784
00:40:42,025 --> 00:40:43,735
because you're too busy?

785
00:40:43,777 --> 00:40:46,446
SOLOMON: I do that now.
We're closed on Mondays and Tuesdays.

786
00:40:46,488 --> 00:40:49,032
I'm here... Like, I'm here on
Mondays and Tuesdays.

787
00:40:49,074 --> 00:40:53,704
All I do, for probably
eight to ten hours on Monday and Tuesday

788
00:40:53,745 --> 00:40:56,874
is call different distributors
to look for more product,

789
00:40:56,915 --> 00:41:01,670
try to redo things in here
to get it ready for the next week

790
00:41:01,712 --> 00:41:04,590
because Wednesday,
when we open up again, it's full blast.

791
00:41:04,631 --> 00:41:07,509
New release of something,
new comic books are every Wednesday.

792
00:41:07,551 --> 00:41:09,136
So we're busy.

793
00:41:09,178 --> 00:41:13,223
Those big releases,
there's so much anticipation for them,

794
00:41:13,265 --> 00:41:16,435
and it's amazing,
just the buildup that we go into.

795
00:41:16,476 --> 00:41:19,354
There's this eight-month process
where we're producing a product.

796
00:41:19,396 --> 00:41:21,356
That release day
is like its birthday.

797
00:41:21,398 --> 00:41:25,819
It's the celebration
of a new product coming to market,

798
00:41:25,861 --> 00:41:28,906
and people
opening up that product all over the world, globally,

799
00:41:28,947 --> 00:41:31,200
through case breaking
or live streams.

800
00:41:31,241 --> 00:41:33,785
Well, release date is,
depending on what the product is,

801
00:41:33,827 --> 00:41:35,704
is very much
a lineup at the door.

802
00:41:35,746 --> 00:41:39,583
You know, I've said that
the first time we had a lineup at the door

803
00:41:39,625 --> 00:41:42,252
was with
The Death of Superman back in the early '90s,

804
00:41:42,294 --> 00:41:48,175
and, suddenly, we went from,
you know, wondering how a product would sell

805
00:41:48,217 --> 00:41:50,886
to wondering
how long it will last us

806
00:41:50,928 --> 00:41:52,846
and how many people
I can try to make happy.

807
00:41:52,888 --> 00:41:54,556
Because the lineups
at the door...

808
00:41:54,598 --> 00:41:57,684
I get in here
any given morning, 8:30, 9 o' clock in the morning,

809
00:41:57,726 --> 00:42:01,355
and there's already people
sitting outside, waiting for us to open at noon.

810
00:42:01,396 --> 00:42:06,151
So, Prizm Football,
the first guy, allegedly, was here at 5:30 a. m.

811
00:42:06,193 --> 00:42:08,987
MAN: People realized that
there was money to be made in this industry.

812
00:42:09,029 --> 00:42:12,115
New people that were not
in this marketplace before said,

813
00:42:12,157 --> 00:42:14,785
"This is fun.
This is really exciting.

814
00:42:14,826 --> 00:42:18,997
"These are my favorite athletes
and I want to invest with these cards. "

815
00:42:19,039 --> 00:42:21,834
And it started
to spike, spike, spike,

816
00:42:21,875 --> 00:42:24,253
month after month,
to where we are now.

817
00:42:24,294 --> 00:42:28,799
Cards are pouring in,
thousands of orders per day are coming in the building.

818
00:42:28,841 --> 00:42:33,178
Hundreds and hundreds
and hundreds of cards per order are coming in.

819
00:42:33,220 --> 00:42:36,932
And it's a real challenge
to keep up with the demand of the market that we have now.

820
00:42:36,974 --> 00:42:38,725
The prices are
escalating everywhere,

821
00:42:38,767 --> 00:42:41,353
whether you're talking online,
eBay, or whether you're talking stores,

822
00:42:41,395 --> 00:42:43,146
at the distributor level,
everywhere.

823
00:42:43,188 --> 00:42:46,275
The money that's flowing
into the industry has never been seen before.

824
00:42:46,316 --> 00:42:49,486
INTERVIEWER: Do you have
to stand in line elsewhere? Do you ever do retail?

825
00:42:49,528 --> 00:42:51,613
I don't do retail anymore.

826
00:42:51,655 --> 00:42:55,534
I mean, I got to the point where
there was never anything there when you wanted it,

827
00:42:55,576 --> 00:42:58,787
and you just hear
the horror stories about these long lines of people,

828
00:42:58,829 --> 00:43:00,789
and they're just pouncing
on this stuff,

829
00:43:00,831 --> 00:43:04,293
you know, the people
that are flipping it for double the price.

830
00:43:04,334 --> 00:43:07,796
I mean, it just got to the point
where it's ridiculous.

831
00:43:07,838 --> 00:43:09,923
So, I don't even bother
with that anymore.

832
00:43:09,965 --> 00:43:14,553
I always just find it way harder
to find any product when I go to Target or Walmart.

833
00:43:14,595 --> 00:43:16,388
Everything is just so sold out,

834
00:43:16,430 --> 00:43:19,975
and it's just...
Ugh, it's a mess trying to find everything.

835
00:43:20,017 --> 00:43:24,396
Yeah. To discuss the differences
in hobby and retail boxes, there is a vast difference.

836
00:43:24,438 --> 00:43:29,067
Hobby boxes are ones
that are distributed to hobby retailers like myself

837
00:43:29,109 --> 00:43:30,986
directly from
the manufacturers,

838
00:43:31,028 --> 00:43:34,573
whereas "retail products, "
those are ones that go to mass market,

839
00:43:34,615 --> 00:43:36,158
like a Walmart or a Target.

840
00:43:36,200 --> 00:43:38,994
And they have different cont...
They have different cards,

841
00:43:39,036 --> 00:43:42,623
different special inserts
than you would get in a hobby box.

842
00:43:42,664 --> 00:43:45,918
SOLOMON:
There's very few products in the retail, you know,

843
00:43:45,959 --> 00:43:49,379
Targets and Walmarts
and things like that, that are more than $50.

844
00:43:49,421 --> 00:43:52,341
But in general, a retail product
has only certain odds

845
00:43:52,382 --> 00:43:56,345
to get certain types
of desirable collectible cards.

846
00:43:56,386 --> 00:43:58,680
In a hobby product,
it's a lot more money,

847
00:43:58,722 --> 00:44:01,308
but you get a lot more
guaranteed items in a box.

848
00:44:01,350 --> 00:44:05,812
A little blaster box for $19.95
has no guaranteed item in it, usually,

849
00:44:05,854 --> 00:44:10,859
or the item that's guaranteed
is, you know, not that special,

850
00:44:10,901 --> 00:44:13,570
where a hobby box,
you get a certain amount of guaranteed autographs,

851
00:44:13,612 --> 00:44:15,656
certain amount of
guaranteed relics,

852
00:44:15,697 --> 00:44:20,827
um, and that content
is more clearly spelled out of what your possibilities are.

853
00:44:20,869 --> 00:44:23,288
INTERVIEWER:
When you talk about individuals that get it from Target,

854
00:44:23,330 --> 00:44:24,790
they're considered
flippers nowadays,

855
00:44:24,831 --> 00:44:26,458
what do you think they've done?

856
00:44:26,500 --> 00:44:28,752
Are they a positive
or a negative to the industry,

857
00:44:28,794 --> 00:44:30,629
and how it's happening
currently?

858
00:44:30,671 --> 00:44:34,758
"The flippers are part of
the problem, " is the easiest way to answer that.

859
00:44:34,800 --> 00:44:39,263
Because most of those people
aren't buying it because they're collecting it.

860
00:44:39,304 --> 00:44:41,974
It makes it
very difficult for...

861
00:44:42,015 --> 00:44:44,476
You know, I have parents
come in here all the time

862
00:44:44,518 --> 00:44:48,355
that are just looking for
some football packs for their 9-year-old kid.

863
00:44:48,397 --> 00:44:51,525
And they're like,
"Target and Walmart don't have any. "

864
00:44:51,567 --> 00:44:57,322
And so, it has become very much
just about making money for those people.

865
00:44:57,364 --> 00:45:00,659
They don't care about
what the product is.

866
00:45:00,701 --> 00:45:03,203
They just care about
how much they can sell it for.

867
00:45:03,245 --> 00:45:06,623
And so, that ripping
and flipping idea,

868
00:45:06,665 --> 00:45:09,126
some people rip it open
to sell the singles,

869
00:45:09,168 --> 00:45:12,588
some people just buy the wax
to flip it in that manner.

870
00:45:12,629 --> 00:45:17,217
So, it depends on what level
of hobbyist you happen to be.

871
00:45:17,259 --> 00:45:19,344
You know, sometimes,
it's a little off-putting.

872
00:45:19,386 --> 00:45:21,722
You know, a lot of the people
out there are scalpers.

873
00:45:21,763 --> 00:45:24,516
They're not really collectors,
you know.

874
00:45:24,558 --> 00:45:27,394
It's good for the hobby
as far as increasing

875
00:45:27,436 --> 00:45:30,314
the value of everything
that I am going to get.

876
00:45:30,355 --> 00:45:33,400
But at the same time, you know,
it does take away that joy.

877
00:45:33,442 --> 00:45:37,821
Buying individual packs of cards
instead of a sealed box can be dangerous

878
00:45:37,863 --> 00:45:41,241
because, unfortunately,
what some people do is, they'll buy a box,

879
00:45:41,283 --> 00:45:44,077
they'll find the pack that's
got the really big hit in it,

880
00:45:44,119 --> 00:45:46,163
and then, they'll sell
the other packs

881
00:45:46,205 --> 00:45:47,915
that aren't as good
on the market.

882
00:45:47,956 --> 00:45:50,709
So, we have...
All of our product is behind the counter,

883
00:45:50,751 --> 00:45:54,171
other than right up front
where the new releases are, and I'm always standing there.

884
00:45:54,213 --> 00:45:56,798
We don't let people
mess with packs.

885
00:45:56,840 --> 00:45:59,843
We have people who have
walked in the store in past years,

886
00:45:59,885 --> 00:46:02,721
carrying their scale and ask
if they can weigh the packs.

887
00:46:02,763 --> 00:46:06,350
You'll see it happen
at Target or Walmart, you know, all the time.

888
00:46:06,391 --> 00:46:10,312
So, yes, there is a difference
between the weight of a specific pack

889
00:46:10,354 --> 00:46:12,147
that has a relic in it
or doesn't.

890
00:46:15,651 --> 00:46:20,697
Topps Museum Collection
has one metal card per case of 12.

891
00:46:20,739 --> 00:46:24,618
So, that box is heavier,
and guaranteed.

892
00:46:24,660 --> 00:46:26,954
If you're buying boxes
of certain things,

893
00:46:26,995 --> 00:46:29,456
there is that potential for it
to have been weighed

894
00:46:29,498 --> 00:46:32,167
and they're selling it
for that reason,

895
00:46:32,209 --> 00:46:34,211
'cause they know
that item's not in there.

896
00:46:34,253 --> 00:46:41,009
We've always had
that type of challenge with people buying stuff online.

897
00:46:41,051 --> 00:46:44,304
Searching cases is not new,
but now the money is so much bigger.

898
00:46:44,346 --> 00:46:49,184
So, the old thing was that
you always had a specific content per box or per case,

899
00:46:49,226 --> 00:46:53,355
and people would sell
packs or boxes of whatever they didn't open.

900
00:46:53,397 --> 00:46:55,190
So, they might get
a box or a case,

901
00:46:55,232 --> 00:46:58,277
and they might rip open
until they hit that big card.

902
00:46:58,318 --> 00:47:02,698
And then they put the rest
of those packs or boxes on sale on eBay,

903
00:47:02,739 --> 00:47:05,993
and you don't have any chance
of hitting that big card.

904
00:47:06,034 --> 00:47:08,287
Obviously, we have
no way of knowing when people walk in

905
00:47:08,328 --> 00:47:11,832
if they bought the box
that has the good card in it,

906
00:47:11,874 --> 00:47:14,459
but at least
we don't do that to you on purpose.

907
00:47:25,804 --> 00:47:31,476
MAN: Hello, everybody.
This is Chris with HOTT Hott Breaks,

908
00:47:31,518 --> 00:47:34,062
coming at you
with another Break.

909
00:47:34,104 --> 00:47:37,191
2020 Topps Heritage High Number.

910
00:47:37,232 --> 00:47:40,861
We are looking for
what's considered a hot box,

911
00:47:40,903 --> 00:47:43,447
and, hopefully,
that's what this is.

912
00:47:43,488 --> 00:47:48,785
When you look at hot boxes,
they come with one purple Chrome per pack.

913
00:47:48,827 --> 00:47:50,454
That's why
they call it a hot box.

914
00:47:50,495 --> 00:47:53,040
I think we'll just pull
every pack right now.

915
00:47:53,081 --> 00:47:55,209
All right.
Let's get into this.

916
00:48:00,130 --> 00:48:03,509
Oh. My gosh, we have a hot pack.

917
00:48:03,550 --> 00:48:07,721
Let's go to HOTT Hot Box!

918
00:48:07,763 --> 00:48:10,516
We're actually going to
get one of those per pack.

919
00:48:14,853 --> 00:48:17,481
All-Star rookie
Mike Soroka.

920
00:48:21,902 --> 00:48:26,198
Today, the sports card market
is more protected because we have scarcity.

921
00:48:26,240 --> 00:48:30,786
We have manufacturers
that are actually building scarcity into their products

922
00:48:30,827 --> 00:48:33,455
through numbered cards
and through other mechanisms.

923
00:48:33,497 --> 00:48:36,959
We've got grading,
which inherently adds scarcity

924
00:48:37,000 --> 00:48:40,128
because it's really hard
to get cards in perfect grades.

925
00:48:40,170 --> 00:48:43,215
We've got really strong
online community

926
00:48:43,257 --> 00:48:46,093
and social media
around sports cards.

927
00:48:46,134 --> 00:48:50,514
People are into investing
and collecting more than just for the money.

928
00:48:50,556 --> 00:48:53,767
They're in it
for the community as well, which keeps them there.

929
00:48:53,809 --> 00:48:55,811
And then,
we've got online breaking.

930
00:48:55,853 --> 00:48:58,897
And that's a big deal as well,
because it's entertainment.

931
00:48:58,939 --> 00:49:01,942
It's a big piece
of people's lives now

932
00:49:01,984 --> 00:49:06,196
to sit on their couch
and watch an online break on TV.

933
00:49:06,238 --> 00:49:09,867
Watching online breaks
can be an incredible spectacle.

934
00:49:09,908 --> 00:49:11,451
It's so much fun to watch,

935
00:49:11,493 --> 00:49:15,038
and even if cards being pulled
aren't the ones that you bought,

936
00:49:15,080 --> 00:49:18,000
just simply getting to
watch them is a thrill.

937
00:49:18,041 --> 00:49:21,461
I've seen huge cards,
like a Honus Wagner cut auto,

938
00:49:21,503 --> 00:49:24,131
get pulled out of
a box of Transcendent.

939
00:49:24,173 --> 00:49:27,384
Oh, man. How about that?

940
00:49:27,426 --> 00:49:28,552
Honus Wagner.

941
00:49:29,553 --> 00:49:30,929
Kaboom!

942
00:49:30,971 --> 00:49:33,473
WILSON: Online breaking
is an incredible thrill.

943
00:49:33,515 --> 00:49:36,518
You can often
buy into these breaks for not very much money,

944
00:49:36,560 --> 00:49:39,104
but you've got the opportunity
to strike it big.

945
00:49:39,146 --> 00:49:41,231
You can hit that big hit card

946
00:49:41,273 --> 00:49:44,151
and make that break worth it
a hundred times over for you.

947
00:49:44,193 --> 00:49:45,777
Oh, my gosh!

948
00:49:46,945 --> 00:49:48,906
Oh, wow!

949
00:49:48,947 --> 00:49:52,492
Superfractor rookie
auto, one of one,

950
00:49:52,534 --> 00:49:55,537
Fernando Tatis Jr.

951
00:49:55,579 --> 00:49:59,249
Justin...
I'm shaking so bad. I'm sorry.

952
00:49:59,291 --> 00:50:04,463
Justin Herbert,
NFL shield art PA, one of one.

953
00:50:05,464 --> 00:50:06,965
Boom!

954
00:50:07,007 --> 00:50:12,721
Logoman Patch auto,
one of one, Luka Doncic.

955
00:50:12,763 --> 00:50:14,139
Boom!

956
00:50:14,181 --> 00:50:17,684
So, Sarah came home one day
with this box of cards.

957
00:50:17,726 --> 00:50:21,563
Uh, I believe it was
2011 Topp Series 2.

958
00:50:21,605 --> 00:50:22,898
I believe it was.

959
00:50:23,774 --> 00:50:25,275
We opened the box together.

960
00:50:25,317 --> 00:50:27,736
It takes me
down this rabbit hole.

961
00:50:27,778 --> 00:50:30,239
We start doing research
and I jump on YouTube

962
00:50:30,280 --> 00:50:34,409
and I start seeing videos
of people opening cards.

963
00:50:34,451 --> 00:50:38,830
I never saw this before.
I did not know this existed.

964
00:50:38,872 --> 00:50:41,917
There were a couple of people
doing what they called "breaks. "

965
00:50:43,418 --> 00:50:46,129
I didn't know what it was.
I started watching.

966
00:50:46,171 --> 00:50:47,965
I started actually
even participating.

967
00:50:48,006 --> 00:50:52,219
I bought into
a couple of breaks, and I had a lot of fun.

968
00:50:52,261 --> 00:50:56,390
I thought it was really cool,
being a part of something

969
00:50:56,431 --> 00:50:59,226
that was taking place live
on the Internet,

970
00:50:59,268 --> 00:51:03,272
and this is 2011
to the end of 2012.

971
00:51:03,313 --> 00:51:08,026
So, streaming live
was a very new concept at the time.

972
00:51:08,068 --> 00:51:11,029
I immediately thought,
"This is for me. "

973
00:51:11,071 --> 00:51:15,576
I knew then and there
that this was something that I could do,

974
00:51:15,617 --> 00:51:18,120
and I can hopefully do
as good, if not better,

975
00:51:18,161 --> 00:51:20,205
than other people
that were already doing it.

976
00:51:20,247 --> 00:51:22,124
VLOGGER: It's Friday night.
We're opening Pokemon cards.

977
00:51:22,165 --> 00:51:23,500
Let's see what we got next.

978
00:51:23,542 --> 00:51:25,335
Instagram @thecoffeebreakers.

979
00:51:25,377 --> 00:51:27,296
Let's see what it is
right now.

980
00:51:27,337 --> 00:51:29,381
-A Chansey!
-[PEOPLE CHEERING]

981
00:51:29,423 --> 00:51:33,635
Yeah. Breaking boxes online
is that treasure...

982
00:51:33,677 --> 00:51:36,680
that treasure hunt,
like finding that treasure.

983
00:51:36,722 --> 00:51:38,974
You know it's in
one of these boxes.

984
00:51:39,016 --> 00:51:40,309
You know it's sitting there.

985
00:51:40,350 --> 00:51:43,312
There is, like,
the possibility of getting

986
00:51:43,353 --> 00:51:49,359
the extremely rare, uh,
refractor or extremely rare card

987
00:51:49,401 --> 00:51:52,988
that is worth,
you know, a gazillion dollars.

988
00:51:53,030 --> 00:51:54,281
And that's what's exciting.

989
00:51:54,323 --> 00:51:55,449
MAN: Oh, Mahomes!

990
00:51:55,490 --> 00:51:58,535
-[BOTH EXCLAIMING]
-Silver. [BLEEP]

991
00:51:58,577 --> 00:52:00,746
-Nice.
-Oh, we got that second pack.

992
00:52:00,787 --> 00:52:03,749
Group breaks have existed
for quite some time,

993
00:52:03,790 --> 00:52:08,670
well before anyone
was streaming live or opening boxes on camera.

994
00:52:10,005 --> 00:52:11,965
A group of people
can get together

995
00:52:12,007 --> 00:52:15,761
and decide to split the cost
of a case or box

996
00:52:15,802 --> 00:52:19,223
or any number of cards
together as a group.

997
00:52:19,264 --> 00:52:23,185
You can go to a card store,
and you and five of your buddies

998
00:52:23,227 --> 00:52:26,104
want to buy a case
of baseball, we'll say.

999
00:52:26,146 --> 00:52:30,275
And you could split it up
by division, six spots.

1000
00:52:30,317 --> 00:52:33,737
Everybody pays
the same amount of money and we split it six ways,

1001
00:52:33,779 --> 00:52:35,948
and then we can open the cards
and all decide,

1002
00:52:35,989 --> 00:52:39,326
"All right.
He's gonna get the AL East and I'll get the NL East, "

1003
00:52:39,368 --> 00:52:40,786
and so on and so forth.

1004
00:52:40,827 --> 00:52:43,163
And everybody would
split the cards.

1005
00:52:43,205 --> 00:52:45,874
That's essentially
what a group break is.

1006
00:52:45,916 --> 00:52:50,546
Got David Montgomery Patch,
to 25 NFC North.

1007
00:52:50,587 --> 00:52:54,424
AFC West,
Larry Rountree auto to 25.

1008
00:52:54,466 --> 00:52:59,847
And AFC South RPA to 49,

1009
00:52:59,888 --> 00:53:02,933
Trevor Lawrence. Boom!

1010
00:53:02,975 --> 00:53:06,770
What it does is,
it allows for consumers

1011
00:53:06,812 --> 00:53:12,234
to get into a product
that they may never be able to afford.

1012
00:53:12,276 --> 00:53:16,572
Uh, you're getting in
for a portion of the price of the case of cards.

1013
00:53:16,613 --> 00:53:20,158
[CHUCKLES] Good luck, guys.
Team old Topps is going to win it.

1014
00:53:22,244 --> 00:53:25,831
Lucky seven.
And number seven, good luck.

1015
00:53:28,083 --> 00:53:29,376
Packers!

1016
00:53:29,418 --> 00:53:31,545
Madison. Congratulations.

1017
00:53:31,587 --> 00:53:34,006
How about that?
Hell of a hit.

1018
00:53:34,047 --> 00:53:36,884
Back in 2012, '13, '14,
I would...

1019
00:53:36,925 --> 00:53:41,054
I said "Boom" one time
and everyone's like, "Yeah, that's a boom. "

1020
00:53:41,096 --> 00:53:42,723
VLOGGER : One of one,
Jeremy Lin.

1021
00:53:44,141 --> 00:53:45,976
Boom!

1022
00:53:46,018 --> 00:53:48,187
RICH LAYTON:
"You've got to say 'boom. '" Oh, everything's a boom.

1023
00:53:48,228 --> 00:53:50,772
I have customers to this day
that get...

1024
00:53:50,814 --> 00:53:52,608
They're, like, upset.

1025
00:53:52,649 --> 00:53:56,445
They feel like they
were left out if their card didn't get a "boom. "

1026
00:53:56,486 --> 00:54:01,742
They've set a value
on our level of entertainment. They expect us to deliver.

1027
00:54:01,783 --> 00:54:04,244
And that's a big deal to us.

1028
00:54:04,286 --> 00:54:07,372
Forrest was yelling "Coleslaw"
the other day.

1029
00:54:07,414 --> 00:54:09,208
We don't know why.

1030
00:54:09,249 --> 00:54:11,960
I mean, they were like,
"You've got to have your own thing, Forrest. "

1031
00:54:12,002 --> 00:54:15,881
And he was like...
He started yelling out, like, "Kablowie" and "Kachow. "

1032
00:54:15,923 --> 00:54:18,383
They were like,
"No, no, you got to say something random, "

1033
00:54:18,425 --> 00:54:20,427
and he's like, "Coleslaw!"

1034
00:54:20,469 --> 00:54:24,515
And then, of course,
the chat got crazy with it, and everything was "coleslaw. "

1035
00:54:24,556 --> 00:54:29,436
Hey, everyone. Forrest here,
ripping one box of 2020 Contenders Optic Football,

1036
00:54:29,478 --> 00:54:35,651
and on the back
is a Tua Tagovailoa Rookie Ticket Silver auto.

1037
00:54:35,692 --> 00:54:37,861
Nice. Coleslaw.

1038
00:54:37,903 --> 00:54:40,489
Layton Sports Cards has been
breaking for a long time.

1039
00:54:40,531 --> 00:54:44,201
We started in 2014
and did it through about 2017.

1040
00:54:44,243 --> 00:54:47,037
We got in probably
six months too early.

1041
00:54:47,079 --> 00:54:50,624
But we got to a point
where we didn't wanna be up till 2:00 in the morning.

1042
00:54:50,666 --> 00:54:53,252
I have a kid and a wife. So...

1043
00:54:53,293 --> 00:54:58,841
But, now, there's not just
breaking online in the traditional formats.

1044
00:54:58,882 --> 00:55:02,553
Now, Instagram is a big deal.
Facebook is big deal.

1045
00:55:02,594 --> 00:55:08,308
A lot of my customers
are breakers on various platforms, YouTube.

1046
00:55:08,350 --> 00:55:11,770
So, that has grown immensely.

1047
00:55:11,812 --> 00:55:16,942
Two of my best young customers
started when they were 17, breaking wax on Instagram,

1048
00:55:16,984 --> 00:55:20,279
and they went from buying,
a couple of boxes a week

1049
00:55:20,320 --> 00:55:25,784
to now, they spend a couple
thousand dollars a week easy on most new releases.

1050
00:55:25,826 --> 00:55:27,786
They want
as much as they can get.

1051
00:55:27,828 --> 00:55:29,746
And they're 18 now, so...

1052
00:55:29,788 --> 00:55:34,209
A big part of what we do
is community,

1053
00:55:34,251 --> 00:55:36,962
um, and the building
of that community

1054
00:55:37,004 --> 00:55:40,966
and making sure that
our customers feel like they're part of a family.

1055
00:55:41,008 --> 00:55:45,971
We created a safe place
for our customers to buy, sell, and trade on Facebook.

1056
00:55:46,013 --> 00:55:48,849
Everything we do
is family friendly.

1057
00:55:48,891 --> 00:55:52,895
No swearing,
no cussing, no acting out.

1058
00:55:52,936 --> 00:55:56,773
And we try to make it
a safe place for them

1059
00:55:56,815 --> 00:56:01,653
to come and enjoy collecting
and enjoy watching boxes being opened.

1060
00:56:01,695 --> 00:56:04,156
I mean, everybody should be able
to enjoy our hobby.

1061
00:56:04,198 --> 00:56:06,408
Everybody,
no matter who they are.

1062
00:56:06,450 --> 00:56:08,994
Like any industry where there's
a lot of money involved,

1063
00:56:09,036 --> 00:56:11,163
there are scams that take place.

1064
00:56:11,205 --> 00:56:12,706
You have to be careful.

1065
00:56:12,748 --> 00:56:14,583
The easiest way
you can get scammed

1066
00:56:14,625 --> 00:56:19,004
is to buy a card
that's different than the one you think you're buying.

1067
00:56:19,046 --> 00:56:23,258
People can make
misleading listings when they put things online,

1068
00:56:23,300 --> 00:56:28,430
or they can take photos
that maybe don't show damage that exists on a card.

1069
00:56:28,472 --> 00:56:30,432
Be careful. Do your homework.

1070
00:56:30,474 --> 00:56:33,894
Make sure you are buying
the card that you intend to buy.

1071
00:56:33,936 --> 00:56:35,270
And then,
when you receive it,

1072
00:56:35,312 --> 00:56:37,022
inspect the condition
thoroughly.

1073
00:56:37,064 --> 00:56:38,941
Make sure
it's all on the up and up.

1074
00:56:38,982 --> 00:56:40,817
You also have to watch out
for fake cards.

1075
00:56:40,859 --> 00:56:44,112
Because there is so much money
in higher-end cards these days,

1076
00:56:44,154 --> 00:56:47,241
you do, unfortunately,
have people that are out there

1077
00:56:47,282 --> 00:56:51,328
trying to create
counterfeit versions of really expensive cards,

1078
00:56:51,370 --> 00:56:54,873
like Wayne Gretzky rookie cards
or Michael Jordan rookie cards.

1079
00:56:54,915 --> 00:56:57,960
That's why it's always good
to buy cards that are graded,

1080
00:56:58,001 --> 00:57:00,420
because that means
that they're also authenticated,

1081
00:57:00,462 --> 00:57:04,842
assuming that
they're graded through a reputable grading company.

1082
00:57:04,883 --> 00:57:07,010
-AOKI: This looks
like a fake card. -WOMAN: It's fake.

1083
00:57:07,052 --> 00:57:08,762
MAN: That is one
that is fake, Steve.

1084
00:57:08,804 --> 00:57:10,931
AOKI: So I got...
I mean, it looks fake.

1085
00:57:10,973 --> 00:57:13,475
MAN: It's 100% fake.
That's not live ink.

1086
00:57:13,517 --> 00:57:15,727
It's Cracked Ice.
You bought a Cracked Ice.

1087
00:57:15,769 --> 00:57:17,980
That thing should be
sparkling from here to...

1088
00:57:18,021 --> 00:57:20,274
AOKI: I feel sick,
getting ripped off like that.

1089
00:57:20,315 --> 00:57:21,608
WOMAN: We can get the money...

1090
00:57:21,650 --> 00:57:23,569
AOKI: 'Cause this is
gonna be expensive...

1091
00:57:23,610 --> 00:57:28,615
-It was 11K. Eleven thou...
-WOMAN: It was 11, right, Elizabeth?

1092
00:57:28,657 --> 00:57:30,367
-WOMAN 2: Yeah.
-AOKI: Holy [BLEEP]!

1093
00:57:30,409 --> 00:57:33,370
MAN: But this one's
100% fake. So...

1094
00:57:33,412 --> 00:57:37,207
-AOKI: Clear as day. Like,
it's a printed laser copy. -MAN: Yeah, feel that.

1095
00:57:37,249 --> 00:57:40,711
You got to be careful.
So, on the back end of cards,

1096
00:57:40,752 --> 00:57:42,254
not only are there
people chasing,

1097
00:57:42,296 --> 00:57:44,006
there's also people
manipulating a little bit.

1098
00:57:44,047 --> 00:57:47,718
So, maybe they'll buy,
you know, 100 of a particular card

1099
00:57:47,759 --> 00:57:51,388
and then
they throw it at auction and bid the price up a little bit.

1100
00:57:51,430 --> 00:57:52,973
So, now there's
a new price point.

1101
00:57:53,015 --> 00:57:56,310
And then,
they go and try to sell some of their collection.

1102
00:57:56,351 --> 00:57:58,061
So, you've got to be careful,
you know?

1103
00:57:58,103 --> 00:58:00,397
Just because
one sells for a high price,

1104
00:58:00,439 --> 00:58:02,274
doesn't mean that
that's the real price of the card.

1105
00:58:02,316 --> 00:58:05,986
You've got to look at
how many cards have sold at that price

1106
00:58:06,028 --> 00:58:09,072
before you can really say
that that's the value of the card.

1107
00:58:09,114 --> 00:58:11,867
There's a slew of options
in selling a trading card.

1108
00:58:11,909 --> 00:58:15,621
But, really, the the biggest
and largest platform in our market is eBay.

1109
00:58:15,662 --> 00:58:17,331
eBay is a publicly
traded company.

1110
00:58:17,372 --> 00:58:20,501
There's 180 million users.
They're international.

1111
00:58:20,542 --> 00:58:23,378
So, if you're looking for a card
or looking to sell a card,

1112
00:58:23,420 --> 00:58:25,672
eBay is probably
the first place that I would go.

1113
00:58:25,714 --> 00:58:30,219
Also for that market research
to see what a card might be potentially worth that you own.

1114
00:58:30,260 --> 00:58:36,725
Until a couple of years ago,
it was rare to see any card go for a million dollars or more,

1115
00:58:36,767 --> 00:58:39,895
and there were
a lot of big auction houses doing big auctions,

1116
00:58:39,937 --> 00:58:42,272
but they were driving cards
in the tens of thousands,

1117
00:58:42,314 --> 00:58:43,899
or hundreds of thousands
of dollars.

1118
00:58:43,941 --> 00:58:48,237
But in the last
couple of years, auctions have boomed.

1119
00:58:48,278 --> 00:58:53,200
And now, there are
a ton of cards that have sold in the millions of dollars.

1120
00:58:53,242 --> 00:58:56,954
JESSE CRAIG:
So, PWCC has historically been just an auction house

1121
00:58:56,995 --> 00:58:59,248
selling cards on eBay
for over 20 years.

1122
00:58:59,289 --> 00:59:04,962
And we've transitioned into
kind of a full-stop shop for our clients.

1123
00:59:05,003 --> 00:59:09,091
We have a vault,
an online marketplace,

1124
00:59:09,132 --> 00:59:12,886
and we lend,
and we digitally archive people's assets.

1125
00:59:12,928 --> 00:59:14,555
We image it,
title it, price it,

1126
00:59:14,596 --> 00:59:16,932
and it's all put away
and safely insured and stored.

1127
00:59:18,892 --> 00:59:22,354
Our vault here is
a Class-3 UL rated vault.

1128
00:59:22,396 --> 00:59:25,941
It's actually constructed
of 750,000 pounds of concrete.

1129
00:59:25,983 --> 00:59:28,944
We have two huge vault doors
that weigh 11,000 pounds apiece.

1130
00:59:28,986 --> 00:59:31,947
And our facility,
we consider it the Fort Knox for trading cards.

1131
00:59:31,989 --> 00:59:34,074
We have over 65 cameras
on site.

1132
00:59:34,116 --> 00:59:37,619
Um, you know,
it's all gated, key-coded, and 24-hour surveillance.

1133
00:59:37,661 --> 00:59:40,914
Since, you know, probably
the beginning of 2020, I would say,

1134
00:59:40,956 --> 00:59:44,960
the demand for having
assets graded is massive.

1135
00:59:45,002 --> 00:59:48,088
People want graded assets,
they want them verified and authenticated.

1136
00:59:48,130 --> 00:59:50,883
And that's why that's all
that we sell anymore.

1137
00:59:50,924 --> 00:59:55,679
At PWCC,
we only sell slabbed or factory-sealed products

1138
00:59:55,721 --> 00:59:57,556
because
the third-party authentication

1139
00:59:57,598 --> 00:59:59,433
for our market
is so important.

1140
00:59:59,474 --> 01:00:01,727
It gives the buyer
the confidence

1141
01:00:01,768 --> 01:00:04,021
that they are getting
what they're seeing.

1142
01:00:04,062 --> 01:00:05,856
JACOBS: That's lit.

1143
01:00:05,898 --> 01:00:08,358
-They come in these
cases like this? -INTERVIEWER: No.

1144
01:00:08,400 --> 01:00:10,402
That's a graded card
from Beckett.

1145
01:00:10,444 --> 01:00:11,987
Oh, that's lit.

1146
01:00:12,029 --> 01:00:13,530
Not once have I bought
a raw card.

1147
01:00:13,572 --> 01:00:15,866
I see so many people
make that mistake, beginners.

1148
01:00:15,908 --> 01:00:17,701
It's like playing the lottery.

1149
01:00:17,743 --> 01:00:21,872
Get a card cheaper 'cause
it's raw and get it graded? Think about it.

1150
01:00:21,914 --> 01:00:24,166
The person
that sold you the card sells cards for a living.

1151
01:00:24,208 --> 01:00:28,504
There's a reason
he didn't get it graded himself because he sees a defect on it.

1152
01:00:28,545 --> 01:00:31,256
So, again, your local dealer
lying and manipulating you.

1153
01:00:31,298 --> 01:00:35,552
So, for me,
I mess with big dollars, millions of dollars of cards,

1154
01:00:35,594 --> 01:00:36,970
Why am I gonna buy
a raw card?

1155
01:00:37,012 --> 01:00:41,266
I'd rather pay the premium price
and have it graded

1156
01:00:41,308 --> 01:00:43,560
than buy a card
for one-fourth the value,

1157
01:00:43,602 --> 01:00:45,896
and take the chance
of it getting lost in the mail,

1158
01:00:45,938 --> 01:00:49,024
someone stealing it,
or it coming back with a four or five grade.

1159
01:00:49,066 --> 01:00:51,568
The grading aspect changed
everything for me, too,

1160
01:00:51,610 --> 01:00:53,362
'cause it's one thing
having a raw card,

1161
01:00:53,403 --> 01:00:55,155
and another thing
having a graded card.

1162
01:00:55,197 --> 01:00:56,657
Those are two different things.

1163
01:00:56,698 --> 01:00:59,451
Like, having a raw card
is really, really great.

1164
01:00:59,493 --> 01:01:02,746
But until it's in the slab,

1165
01:01:02,788 --> 01:01:08,043
a slab that's trusted,
PSA, BGS, SGC,

1166
01:01:08,085 --> 01:01:10,671
and even, I'm trusting
these other ones like HGA.

1167
01:01:10,712 --> 01:01:14,591
As long as it's in a slab
and it's protected,

1168
01:01:14,633 --> 01:01:18,762
it's framed, it's authenticated,
it's graded by a professional

1169
01:01:18,804 --> 01:01:23,559
that the whole market respects
and knows that's the value,

1170
01:01:25,018 --> 01:01:26,687
that's when, like for me,

1171
01:01:26,728 --> 01:01:32,109
that's when the card itself
has changed into an investment.

1172
01:01:32,150 --> 01:01:36,822
Beckett was doing price guides
in the '80s and the '90s,

1173
01:01:36,864 --> 01:01:43,078
just print magazines that were
being distributed to stores and retailers across the country.

1174
01:01:43,120 --> 01:01:46,957
And then, we slowly adapted
and got into the Beckett Marketplace,

1175
01:01:46,999 --> 01:01:50,085
and then
Beckett Card Grading in 2000.

1176
01:01:50,127 --> 01:01:53,172
So, the grading industry
started to really catch on

1177
01:01:53,213 --> 01:01:56,300
when people realized
that they needed to have

1178
01:01:56,341 --> 01:01:59,595
a third party
examine their pieces,

1179
01:01:59,636 --> 01:02:02,389
especially as online platforms
started selling cards.

1180
01:02:02,431 --> 01:02:04,808
And when you want
to sell stuff around the world,

1181
01:02:04,850 --> 01:02:08,896
it was much, much easier
to say, "I have a BGS-graded this card"

1182
01:02:08,937 --> 01:02:10,689
instead of just going out
and saying,

1183
01:02:10,731 --> 01:02:13,817
"I personally think that
I have a mint card. "

1184
01:02:13,859 --> 01:02:16,820
WILSON: One of the most
challenging things for someone new in the hobby

1185
01:02:16,862 --> 01:02:19,489
is to understand
if the condition of their card

1186
01:02:19,531 --> 01:02:21,992
is good enough
for it to get graded.

1187
01:02:22,034 --> 01:02:24,536
Because when you send it off
to the grading companies,

1188
01:02:24,578 --> 01:02:27,039
they're really going to
scrutinize it.

1189
01:02:27,080 --> 01:02:29,958
They put it under
a ton of magnification,

1190
01:02:30,000 --> 01:02:34,880
and if it has any flaws,
it's not likely to get a wonderful grade.

1191
01:02:34,922 --> 01:02:39,510
They're going to look at
the sharpness of the corners, the sharpness of the edges,

1192
01:02:39,551 --> 01:02:42,596
how well-centered the image is
on the card,

1193
01:02:42,638 --> 01:02:45,474
and then, also,
if the surface of the card

1194
01:02:45,516 --> 01:02:48,852
is in pristine,
scratch-free condition.

1195
01:02:48,894 --> 01:02:51,730
So, there's now
a lot of different companies that do grading.

1196
01:02:51,772 --> 01:02:53,941
So customers also have to choose

1197
01:02:53,982 --> 01:02:57,611
which company do they
want us to submit through to do the grading.

1198
01:02:57,653 --> 01:03:00,531
The industry leaders,
PSA and BGS,

1199
01:03:00,572 --> 01:03:03,116
those are the big boys
who you normally recommend.

1200
01:03:03,158 --> 01:03:06,662
Right. We've been working
with both PSA and BGS for decades.

1201
01:03:06,703 --> 01:03:08,830
They are the two
industry leaders,

1202
01:03:08,872 --> 01:03:10,624
though there are
a lot of up and comers

1203
01:03:10,666 --> 01:03:13,460
who are vying to take that
market share from them.

1204
01:03:13,502 --> 01:03:15,254
JEROMY MURRAY:
When a card is received here,

1205
01:03:15,295 --> 01:03:18,715
it's received in our
logistics department, and the cards are counted

1206
01:03:18,757 --> 01:03:21,927
to make sure that it matches up
with the submission form for our customer.

1207
01:03:21,969 --> 01:03:25,889
It then moves on to
our invoicing system where the customer receives an email.

1208
01:03:25,931 --> 01:03:27,724
"Congratulations,
we've received your order.

1209
01:03:27,766 --> 01:03:30,811
"Everything is working.
We'll be in contact if there's any issues. "

1210
01:03:30,853 --> 01:03:33,105
At that point, it goes on
to our verification team.

1211
01:03:33,146 --> 01:03:35,732
Verification team
will identify the cards.

1212
01:03:35,774 --> 01:03:39,611
These are guys that are
encyclopedias of cards.

1213
01:03:39,653 --> 01:03:42,531
Their knowledge
is amazing and stunning,

1214
01:03:42,573 --> 01:03:46,368
and they can mow through
an order and identify cards.

1215
01:03:46,410 --> 01:03:48,954
There's times that
you have to do some research on those,

1216
01:03:48,996 --> 01:03:50,873
and they spend time
researching the cards.

1217
01:03:50,914 --> 01:03:54,168
At that point,
it either goes in our vault to wait to be graded,

1218
01:03:54,209 --> 01:03:57,588
or it moves on to our graders,
depending on the service level that you select.

1219
01:03:57,629 --> 01:04:00,507
At that point,
the graders will sit down, examine the card,

1220
01:04:00,549 --> 01:04:01,967
make sure
the card is authentic,

1221
01:04:02,009 --> 01:04:03,468
make sure the card
as not been altered

1222
01:04:03,510 --> 01:04:06,430
and then give a grade
on the card, with subgrades.

1223
01:04:06,471 --> 01:04:08,182
Break it down with
each of the four categories.

1224
01:04:08,223 --> 01:04:11,518
So there's four main things
that the grading company is gonna look at

1225
01:04:11,560 --> 01:04:14,605
to determine the overall grade
your card gets,

1226
01:04:14,646 --> 01:04:17,774
and of course,
Joe is the expert on this type of stuff.

1227
01:04:17,816 --> 01:04:20,110
Yeah, Geoff,
when I'm assessing a card,

1228
01:04:20,152 --> 01:04:23,405
the very first thing
I will look at is the centering

1229
01:04:23,447 --> 01:04:26,825
because that's the first thing
to see when you hold it in front of you.

1230
01:04:26,867 --> 01:04:28,493
You can tell,
"Is this card well-centered?

1231
01:04:28,535 --> 01:04:30,829
"Is there a wider border
at the top or the bottom,

1232
01:04:30,871 --> 01:04:33,081
"a wider border
at the left or the right?"

1233
01:04:33,123 --> 01:04:34,708
After that,
I move on to the corners

1234
01:04:34,750 --> 01:04:36,960
'cause those are the most
noticeable after that.

1235
01:04:37,002 --> 01:04:39,213
"Is there white showing
on the corners?"

1236
01:04:39,254 --> 01:04:42,174
And then I move on
to the edges after that.

1237
01:04:42,216 --> 01:04:44,510
Because often cards, especially
as you get into vintage cards,

1238
01:04:44,551 --> 01:04:47,095
are gonna have chipping
on the border of the card.

1239
01:04:47,137 --> 01:04:51,058
And then last of all,
look at both the front and the back for the surface,

1240
01:04:51,099 --> 01:04:53,685
because often
there'll be a crease, there'll be a scratch.

1241
01:04:53,727 --> 01:04:56,313
Like with newer cards,
there'll be scratches on the surface.

1242
01:04:56,355 --> 01:04:58,649
There can be print lines
of all different types,

1243
01:04:58,690 --> 01:05:00,484
sometimes on the front
or the back.

1244
01:05:00,526 --> 01:05:03,529
So you've really got
four key areas to look at

1245
01:05:03,570 --> 01:05:05,697
that could all impact
the grade of the card.

1246
01:05:05,739 --> 01:05:08,784
MURRAY: After that's done,
a label is produced for the card.

1247
01:05:08,825 --> 01:05:12,955
It moves on to our slabbing
and production room where the card is encased

1248
01:05:12,996 --> 01:05:14,748
and then it's shipped out
as quickly as possible.

1249
01:05:14,790 --> 01:05:17,626
There's been a lot of innovation
with new companies coming about.

1250
01:05:17,668 --> 01:05:21,713
You've got companies
like HGA, with their really colorful labels

1251
01:05:21,755 --> 01:05:24,049
that a lot of people
have been really attracted to,

1252
01:05:24,091 --> 01:05:26,677
the design of their labels
and the design of their slabs.

1253
01:05:26,718 --> 01:05:28,720
So, HCA started
because we noticed

1254
01:05:28,762 --> 01:05:31,098
a lot of inconsistencies
with companies that we were grading with,

1255
01:05:31,139 --> 01:05:34,726
some of the larger companies
we were cracking cards or having to resubmit

1256
01:05:34,768 --> 01:05:37,229
and over 50% would come
back with different grades.

1257
01:05:37,271 --> 01:05:40,232
At that point, we realized
that there needed to be some change in the industry.

1258
01:05:40,274 --> 01:05:44,903
So we wanted to go ahead
and see if there was a way to bring in AI for assured,

1259
01:05:44,945 --> 01:05:48,031
um, some better technology
into the grading field.

1260
01:05:48,073 --> 01:05:53,662
The three biggest differences
with us are, one, the AI. Obviously, the grading.

1261
01:05:53,704 --> 01:05:59,042
Two, our labels.
We have a plethora of options so we can do color splash.

1262
01:05:59,084 --> 01:06:01,044
We can do
the neutrals type labels.

1263
01:06:01,086 --> 01:06:03,380
We also do custom labels,
which I'm sure many people are now aware of.

1264
01:06:06,175 --> 01:06:08,719
The other third biggest thing
is we were hitting our turnaround times.

1265
01:06:08,760 --> 01:06:11,763
So a lot of the companies
were getting behind because of the infiltration

1266
01:06:11,805 --> 01:06:14,474
of so many cards, base cards
and everything coming in.

1267
01:06:14,516 --> 01:06:17,769
So we're actually hitting
our turnaround times.

1268
01:06:17,811 --> 01:06:24,234
Imagine the hobby being so busy
that the leading grading company literally shut their doors

1269
01:06:24,276 --> 01:06:26,820
from new submissions for months

1270
01:06:26,862 --> 01:06:28,655
'cause they couldn't handle
the volume.

1271
01:06:28,697 --> 01:06:30,949
But that's actually
what happened to us.

1272
01:06:30,991 --> 01:06:33,619
DAVIS: Yes, that was
a staggering day.

1273
01:06:33,660 --> 01:06:36,163
It sent shockwaves
through the entire industry.

1274
01:06:36,205 --> 01:06:38,540
I couldn't believe it.
I got no advance notice.

1275
01:06:38,582 --> 01:06:40,751
And all of a sudden
my inbox was full with,

1276
01:06:40,792 --> 01:06:43,045
"Did you hear PSA shut down?"
"PSA shut down. "

1277
01:06:43,086 --> 01:06:44,421
"What are you gonna do?"

1278
01:06:44,463 --> 01:06:46,423
It spread fear
through the industry.

1279
01:06:46,465 --> 01:06:49,218
Everybody was in a panic mode,
like, "What are we gonna do with our cards?"

1280
01:06:49,259 --> 01:06:51,220
And so we immediately
had to transition.

1281
01:06:51,261 --> 01:06:53,597
We were like,
"We've got to offer something. "

1282
01:06:53,639 --> 01:06:55,891
And 'cause we were offering
just PSA at the time

1283
01:06:55,933 --> 01:06:57,518
we had to recalibrate and say,

1284
01:06:57,559 --> 01:06:59,978
"Okay. There's some other
really good companies out there. "

1285
01:07:00,020 --> 01:07:01,647
We started offering
BGS submissions,

1286
01:07:01,688 --> 01:07:03,565
started offering
CSG submissions

1287
01:07:03,607 --> 01:07:07,361
to fill that void for
the cheaper grading for cards.

1288
01:07:07,402 --> 01:07:11,907
Because PSA continued
to offer their express services, their really high-end grading.

1289
01:07:11,949 --> 01:07:13,450
But for the bulk submitter,

1290
01:07:13,492 --> 01:07:15,410
the guy that has
a bunch of cards that he...

1291
01:07:15,452 --> 01:07:17,287
$10, $20 rookie cards,

1292
01:07:17,329 --> 01:07:20,749
that doesn't work
at $300-plus a card for grading.

1293
01:07:20,791 --> 01:07:25,087
So, yeah, we call it
"the Day that Grading Died, " because PSA just went to a halt.

1294
01:07:25,128 --> 01:07:28,173
And it's amazing to think
they were that many millions of cards behind

1295
01:07:28,215 --> 01:07:30,592
-where they had to shut down.
-Thirteen million cards.

1296
01:07:30,634 --> 01:07:33,554
Thirteen million cards
in their backlog.

1297
01:07:33,595 --> 01:07:35,430
That's absolutely incredible
to think about,

1298
01:07:35,472 --> 01:07:38,851
that, literally,
a company that is leading an industry

1299
01:07:38,892 --> 01:07:41,478
shuts its doors for months

1300
01:07:41,520 --> 01:07:45,399
and says, "No new customers.
We can't handle the business right now. "

1301
01:07:45,440 --> 01:07:48,151
Like, as a business guy,
as an entrepreneur,

1302
01:07:48,193 --> 01:07:50,487
as someone who started
a ton of different companies,

1303
01:07:50,529 --> 01:07:53,824
I can't even fathom
ever doing that with one of my companies.

1304
01:07:53,866 --> 01:07:56,201
But that's the decision
PSA had to make

1305
01:07:56,243 --> 01:08:00,038
because the hobby is so busy
and has so much heat right now.

1306
01:08:00,080 --> 01:08:02,708
DAVIS: Yeah,
they kept raising prices and raising prices,

1307
01:08:02,749 --> 01:08:05,252
saying, "That'll slow
submissions down. " It didn't.

1308
01:08:05,294 --> 01:08:07,546
In fact,
people kept submitting more 'cause they said,

1309
01:08:07,588 --> 01:08:10,340
"We're gonna get our cards in
before the next price increase. "

1310
01:08:10,382 --> 01:08:12,843
So, none of us saw it coming.

1311
01:08:12,885 --> 01:08:15,012
But, hey,
it's what they had to do.

1312
01:08:15,053 --> 01:08:17,389
BRAD DE COMARMOND:
My first year of investing,

1313
01:08:17,431 --> 01:08:20,475
I was so excited
about my first PSA submission

1314
01:08:20,517 --> 01:08:23,562
because I had all of these
Kobe Bryant cards I was gonna send in

1315
01:08:23,604 --> 01:08:25,606
and I was gonna make
a killing off of it.

1316
01:08:25,647 --> 01:08:31,028
But I had a mental lapse
where I signed up for the wrong submission level,

1317
01:08:31,069 --> 01:08:33,655
which cost me an extra $3,000
for that submission.

1318
01:08:33,697 --> 01:08:39,411
And that should have negated
every single bit of profit that I was anticipating making.

1319
01:08:39,453 --> 01:08:41,788
Fortunately,
money flooded the hobby,

1320
01:08:41,830 --> 01:08:43,999
and I was able
to still make a profit,

1321
01:08:44,041 --> 01:08:46,376
but it was just
a horrible, horrible mistake,

1322
01:08:46,418 --> 01:08:48,629
especially for
your first submission.

1323
01:08:48,670 --> 01:08:51,465
So, as the grading companies
grade cards,

1324
01:08:51,507 --> 01:08:54,718
they keep track of
how many cards they've graded

1325
01:08:54,760 --> 01:08:57,179
of each type of card
in each grade.

1326
01:08:57,221 --> 01:09:00,057
That is called
a population report.

1327
01:09:00,098 --> 01:09:03,685
The population reports
can be very helpful to consult

1328
01:09:03,727 --> 01:09:08,315
because they give you
an understanding of how common or rare a card is.

1329
01:09:08,357 --> 01:09:10,984
And if you're gonna be
investing a lot of money in a card,

1330
01:09:11,026 --> 01:09:15,405
you often want to invest
in a card that's got a low population report,

1331
01:09:15,447 --> 01:09:18,408
meaning, there's not many
other cards out there

1332
01:09:18,450 --> 01:09:21,119
of that particular grade
in that particular type.

1333
01:09:21,161 --> 01:09:24,081
If I'm looking at brands,
let's say for modern,

1334
01:09:24,122 --> 01:09:28,418
I'm not gonna really go for
the generic, the base,

1335
01:09:28,460 --> 01:09:31,255
just because
the supply is so large.

1336
01:09:31,296 --> 01:09:34,842
So, personally,
I'm gonna go more towards the limited supply.

1337
01:09:34,883 --> 01:09:36,760
But again,
you look at Zion Williamson,

1338
01:09:36,802 --> 01:09:38,887
which was
a big boom in 2019,

1339
01:09:38,929 --> 01:09:41,932
in his rookie year,
you know, there's...

1340
01:09:41,974 --> 01:09:45,435
I heard that there were
1,300 different versions of his rookie card.

1341
01:09:45,477 --> 01:09:48,605
That scares me.
Again, why I go back to vintage.

1342
01:09:48,647 --> 01:09:50,732
But if I'm gonna buy
his rookie card,

1343
01:09:50,774 --> 01:09:55,612
I'm gonna do
a Panini Silver Prizm versus a normal rookie.

1344
01:09:55,654 --> 01:09:56,697
So that's kind of...

1345
01:09:56,738 --> 01:10:01,034
I like to be smaller
in quantities.

1346
01:10:01,076 --> 01:10:02,828
I think all the cards
are garbage.

1347
01:10:02,870 --> 01:10:05,372
I think all the cards
are inflated.

1348
01:10:05,414 --> 01:10:07,958
They're manipulated prices.

1349
01:10:08,000 --> 01:10:10,627
All you guys out there,
you auction houses,

1350
01:10:11,670 --> 01:10:13,088
"big industry leaders, "

1351
01:10:14,756 --> 01:10:17,301
you know you're getting
butterflies watching this

1352
01:10:17,342 --> 01:10:19,052
'cause you know
I'm spitting facts.

1353
01:10:19,094 --> 01:10:23,640
You know there's fraud going on,
market manipulation going on,

1354
01:10:23,682 --> 01:10:27,561
fake sales going on,
fake grading going on.

1355
01:10:27,603 --> 01:10:29,688
Why am I the only person
that wants to speak about it?

1356
01:10:36,820 --> 01:10:40,032
One of the reasons I believe
the sports card industry has grown so much

1357
01:10:40,073 --> 01:10:41,909
over the last five years,

1358
01:10:41,950 --> 01:10:43,660
first of all,
the economy has been good

1359
01:10:43,702 --> 01:10:45,412
when you're just talking
about the U. S. ,

1360
01:10:45,454 --> 01:10:50,667
but also, we're seeing a trend
both locally, I mean, in the U. S.

1361
01:10:50,709 --> 01:10:54,004
and globally,
where people are looking for alternative investments.

1362
01:10:54,046 --> 01:10:57,508
So the card market's not
the only thing that has been growing,

1363
01:10:57,549 --> 01:10:59,885
but that's what
I'm most experienced in.

1364
01:10:59,927 --> 01:11:02,095
But people are looking for
alternative investments.

1365
01:11:02,137 --> 01:11:03,972
And what better
alternative investment

1366
01:11:04,014 --> 01:11:06,975
than sports cards
that you can have fun with, you can experience.

1367
01:11:07,017 --> 01:11:09,311
You're not buying a stock
that's just out there.

1368
01:11:09,353 --> 01:11:11,396
You actually have something
you can hold in your hand.

1369
01:11:11,438 --> 01:11:13,440
You can enjoy.
You can treasure.

1370
01:11:13,482 --> 01:11:17,236
You can follow the player
on ESPN or wherever you're watching each week.

1371
01:11:17,277 --> 01:11:19,696
you can keep up
with statistics.

1372
01:11:19,738 --> 01:11:22,783
So I think it's the best
alternative investment out there.

1373
01:11:22,824 --> 01:11:26,203
You also have a lot of people
putting in money into infrastructure,

1374
01:11:26,245 --> 01:11:28,872
you know, vaulting companies,
or grading companies,

1375
01:11:28,914 --> 01:11:31,708
or just putting a lot of money
into technology.

1376
01:11:31,750 --> 01:11:33,752
There's a reason why
they're doing it.

1377
01:11:33,794 --> 01:11:37,881
I think they're also predicting
that this card market's gonna continue to rise

1378
01:11:37,923 --> 01:11:40,050
and you're having
a lot of art collectors.

1379
01:11:40,092 --> 01:11:41,718
A lot of my good friends,

1380
01:11:41,760 --> 01:11:44,096
in addition to
the athletes and things, but wealthy individuals

1381
01:11:44,137 --> 01:11:48,141
that are collecting,
you know, Picassos and Warhols,

1382
01:11:48,183 --> 01:11:52,396
they're now allocating
a piece of their resources to cards.

1383
01:11:52,437 --> 01:11:55,232
So, I think
the future is bright.

1384
01:11:55,274 --> 01:11:57,651
DE COMARMOND: The great thing
about the hobby is that

1385
01:11:57,693 --> 01:12:00,863
there are so many ways
to buy low and sell high.

1386
01:12:00,904 --> 01:12:03,574
And at the end of the day,
investing is just buying something today

1387
01:12:03,615 --> 01:12:05,617
and selling for more
in the future.

1388
01:12:05,659 --> 01:12:07,411
For me personally,
I like singles.

1389
01:12:07,452 --> 01:12:09,580
I like looking at players
and specific cards

1390
01:12:09,621 --> 01:12:11,665
that I can buy now
and sell in the future.

1391
01:12:11,707 --> 01:12:14,168
But people make great money
with sealed wax

1392
01:12:14,209 --> 01:12:17,087
and all different types
of other investments.

1393
01:12:17,129 --> 01:12:19,256
When it comes to
any type of investing,

1394
01:12:19,298 --> 01:12:22,426
data is everything,
and sports cards are no different.

1395
01:12:22,467 --> 01:12:25,220
You need to understand
how the market is changing.

1396
01:12:25,262 --> 01:12:27,681
You need to understand
what is going up and down.

1397
01:12:27,723 --> 01:12:29,850
And of course,
you want to buy during dips

1398
01:12:29,892 --> 01:12:31,935
and you want to sell
during peak periods.

1399
01:12:31,977 --> 01:12:33,604
So when I got back
into sports cards,

1400
01:12:33,645 --> 01:12:36,648
I naturally saw
tons of business ideas,

1401
01:12:36,690 --> 01:12:40,736
but I decided to start
with my YouTube show, and there were two reasons why.

1402
01:12:40,777 --> 01:12:44,364
First of all,
I knew that if I could build a successful following

1403
01:12:44,406 --> 01:12:46,617
that that would validate
my business ideas,

1404
01:12:46,658 --> 01:12:48,368
validate that
there was a market for them.

1405
01:12:48,410 --> 01:12:52,706
And second of all,
that would give me a built-in base of people

1406
01:12:52,748 --> 01:12:55,417
to market my products
and services to.

1407
01:12:55,459 --> 01:12:57,586
My name is Geoff Wilson.

1408
01:12:57,628 --> 01:13:00,088
By day,
I invest in tech companies,

1409
01:13:00,130 --> 01:13:04,092
and at night
I invest in sports cards.

1410
01:13:04,134 --> 01:13:08,388
Join me on my journey to profit
from the hobby we all love.

1411
01:13:10,599 --> 01:13:12,726
The YouTube show
got off to a great start,

1412
01:13:12,768 --> 01:13:17,564
so I immediately went forward
with building the concept for what is now Market Movers.

1413
01:13:17,606 --> 01:13:20,526
And I had a real pain point,
and that was the fact that

1414
01:13:20,567 --> 01:13:23,779
it was really hard
to understand

1415
01:13:23,820 --> 01:13:27,241
what the fair price
of sports cards should be,

1416
01:13:27,282 --> 01:13:29,576
and how prices were changing
over time.

1417
01:13:29,618 --> 01:13:31,787
There was no good tool
on the market

1418
01:13:31,828 --> 01:13:33,497
that would give you
that information,

1419
01:13:33,539 --> 01:13:35,749
and that was the vision
for Market Movers.

1420
01:13:38,001 --> 01:13:39,378
Hey there,
sports card investors,

1421
01:13:39,419 --> 01:13:41,797
my name is Tyler Nethercott,
better known as Teapot,

1422
01:13:41,839 --> 01:13:45,551
and I'm our VP of
Product Development here at Sports Card Investor,

1423
01:13:45,592 --> 01:13:48,387
and today
I'm excited to give you an updated overview

1424
01:13:48,428 --> 01:13:51,056
of our sports card
analytics tool, Market Movers.

1425
01:13:51,098 --> 01:13:54,893
Market Movers is a sports card
data and analytics platform

1426
01:13:54,935 --> 01:13:57,437
that helps you understand
the marketplace,

1427
01:13:57,479 --> 01:14:01,149
see the price movements
and pricing of different sports cards

1428
01:14:01,191 --> 01:14:03,986
and track your entire
sports card collection.

1429
01:14:04,027 --> 01:14:07,447
And we track
tens of thousands of sports cards

1430
01:14:07,489 --> 01:14:09,825
and how they are changing
in price every day.

1431
01:14:09,867 --> 01:14:14,538
So you can call up graphs of
cards of your favorite players who you might invest in.

1432
01:14:14,580 --> 01:14:16,707
You can also
enter your collection

1433
01:14:16,748 --> 01:14:20,377
and track how the value
of your collection is changing over time.

1434
01:14:20,419 --> 01:14:23,547
Initially, when I got back
into cards, I really didn't know what I was doing,

1435
01:14:23,589 --> 01:14:27,259
so I started buying
multiples of individual cards

1436
01:14:27,301 --> 01:14:30,053
because if if the price goes up
on a card, then you know,

1437
01:14:30,095 --> 01:14:33,182
you've 10X-ed because
you have 10 times the cards.

1438
01:14:33,223 --> 01:14:35,058
Then I realized
I'm not a card dealer.

1439
01:14:35,100 --> 01:14:37,019
That's not what I do for money,

1440
01:14:37,060 --> 01:14:40,731
and it's a very hard way
to make money to the scale that I like to make money.

1441
01:14:40,772 --> 01:14:43,400
So, if a card goes from
1,000 to 2,000,

1442
01:14:43,442 --> 01:14:47,279
I've got to sell 100 cards
to make 100 grand.

1443
01:14:47,321 --> 01:14:49,281
So I...

1444
01:14:49,323 --> 01:14:53,285
realized that and then pivoted
and started going for the bigger price points

1445
01:14:53,327 --> 01:14:56,371
that make more of a difference
in my life.

1446
01:14:56,413 --> 01:15:02,044
Most of my art, street art...
Most of my art is actually done by Japanese artists.

1447
01:15:02,085 --> 01:15:03,837
Those are the things...

1448
01:15:03,879 --> 01:15:07,925
I'm Japanese,
so Japanese art and street speak to me a certain way.

1449
01:15:07,966 --> 01:15:09,676
Those are like the...

1450
01:15:09,718 --> 01:15:11,303
My big inspiration.

1451
01:15:11,345 --> 01:15:14,473
Even what I wear,
like wearing an Akira shirt, you know.

1452
01:15:14,515 --> 01:15:18,185
Like, I love...
I love Japanese culture, those kinds of things.

1453
01:15:18,227 --> 01:15:21,146
When I follow the sports,
I follow Japanese sportsmen,

1454
01:15:21,188 --> 01:15:24,900
Ichiro and Shohei Ohtani.

1455
01:15:24,942 --> 01:15:27,986
Like, those... those guys,
Rui Hachimura.

1456
01:15:28,028 --> 01:15:30,322
You know, like, these guys,
like, they might not be...

1457
01:15:30,364 --> 01:15:32,866
Some of them
might not be necessarily

1458
01:15:32,908 --> 01:15:35,702
big breakouts,
but it's like what speaks to me.

1459
01:15:35,744 --> 01:15:39,456
When investing the position
of a player, it does make a difference.

1460
01:15:39,498 --> 01:15:42,459
In football, for example,
quarterbacks

1461
01:15:42,501 --> 01:15:45,796
are always the ones
that people chase the most in the hobby.

1462
01:15:45,838 --> 01:15:49,299
Although, in recent years,
running backs and wide receivers,

1463
01:15:49,341 --> 01:15:50,926
they've gotten more attention.

1464
01:15:50,968 --> 01:15:52,469
As new people
have come into the hobby,

1465
01:15:52,511 --> 01:15:54,555
they've started
buying their cards as well.

1466
01:15:54,596 --> 01:15:56,598
But quarterbacks
are still the ones

1467
01:15:56,640 --> 01:15:59,309
that are most likely
to go up over time.

1468
01:15:59,351 --> 01:16:02,187
Josh Jacobs, for example,
the up-and-coming running back,

1469
01:16:02,229 --> 01:16:07,234
his cards went up 600%
during the off-season before the 2020 season.

1470
01:16:07,276 --> 01:16:08,569
[SIGHS SOFTLY]

1471
01:16:09,444 --> 01:16:12,948
I never could imagine my cards

1472
01:16:12,990 --> 01:16:16,577
being that high, like, even
being that valuable, honestly.

1473
01:16:16,618 --> 01:16:21,206
Um, like I said, my dream
was always to get to the league,

1474
01:16:21,248 --> 01:16:25,210
and I didn't really think about
all the other things that came with it.

1475
01:16:25,252 --> 01:16:27,421
So, just to see that it's valued
that high,

1476
01:16:27,462 --> 01:16:31,466
I mean, seeing that my hard work
is paying off somewhat is huge.

1477
01:16:31,508 --> 01:16:33,719
INTERVIEWER: Could you see
your card being worth as much

1478
01:16:33,760 --> 01:16:36,638
-as Barry Sanders
or Walter Payton in the future? -[LAUGHS]

1479
01:16:36,680 --> 01:16:39,808
Man, I don't know.
Them are some legendary guys.

1480
01:16:39,850 --> 01:16:41,768
They're...
They are so different.

1481
01:16:41,810 --> 01:16:46,523
Um, just to be mentioned
with them guys will definitely be an honor.

1482
01:16:46,565 --> 01:16:49,693
GEOFF: In 2016,
the sports card world was rocked

1483
01:16:49,735 --> 01:16:53,530
when a Honus Wagner card sold
for just over $3 million

1484
01:16:53,572 --> 01:16:57,034
and that was a huge record
at that time.

1485
01:16:57,075 --> 01:17:00,412
But now, just
in the last couple of years, we've had modern players,

1486
01:17:00,454 --> 01:17:03,207
like, Mike Trout
sold for 3.9 million,

1487
01:17:03,248 --> 01:17:06,877
Luka Doncic,
sold for 4.6 million.

1488
01:17:06,919 --> 01:17:12,257
And then, of course, we had
the Mickey Mantle that sold for 5.2 million.

1489
01:17:12,299 --> 01:17:14,259
I knew Mike Trout
was the best player.

1490
01:17:14,301 --> 01:17:16,637
Everyone told me,
"You're never going to get it. "

1491
01:17:16,678 --> 01:17:19,598
"You're never going to
get Mike Trout. " Those are personal collections.

1492
01:17:19,640 --> 01:17:21,683
But guess what? Money talks.

1493
01:17:21,725 --> 01:17:24,394
So, what I did, is find out
who had the cards

1494
01:17:24,436 --> 01:17:27,397
and offered them double,
offered them triple.

1495
01:17:27,439 --> 01:17:31,151
So, they had to sell it to me.
So, when cards were going for like 30, 40k,

1496
01:17:31,193 --> 01:17:32,861
I'd fly to the airport,

1497
01:17:32,903 --> 01:17:35,614
pay him $100,000 cash
and everyone would talk [BLEEP] about me

1498
01:17:35,656 --> 01:17:39,868
on the card forums
like, "This guy just has money. He's laundering money. "

1499
01:17:39,910 --> 01:17:43,080
But I had a vision
that if I could monopolize the market

1500
01:17:43,121 --> 01:17:46,333
and collect all the oranges out
of 25 and the reds out of five,

1501
01:17:46,375 --> 01:17:48,168
then I could do
something special.

1502
01:17:48,210 --> 01:17:51,380
So, I overpaid everybody
where they thought they were getting the deal.

1503
01:17:51,421 --> 01:17:55,801
And then, what, two years later,
all these cards, ten, fifteen times.

1504
01:17:55,843 --> 01:17:58,387
I just went all in
with two people, Mike Trout and Derek Carr.

1505
01:17:58,428 --> 01:18:02,099
But with the Trout, you know,
I got the superfractor for $400,000.

1506
01:18:02,140 --> 01:18:05,936
It popped up on eBay one day,
so I messaged the guy in Taiwan

1507
01:18:05,978 --> 01:18:07,938
and I said, "What do you want
for it?" He goes, "To be honest,

1508
01:18:07,980 --> 01:18:09,690
"I'm not going to take
less than $400,000. "

1509
01:18:09,731 --> 01:18:13,527
So, instead
of nickling and diming for like $350,000, $300,000.

1510
01:18:13,569 --> 01:18:15,988
I said, "You know what?
I'll buy it now. $400,000. "

1511
01:18:16,029 --> 01:18:20,075
Then he Googled me
and he's like, "Oh, my God, you might be a scam.

1512
01:18:20,117 --> 01:18:23,203
"All these people
are messaging me. " And I said, "Listen, man,

1513
01:18:23,245 --> 01:18:25,789
"what's your PayPal?
I'm going to send you 1,000 bucks right now.

1514
01:18:25,831 --> 01:18:27,583
"You can keep it
and screw me over.

1515
01:18:27,624 --> 01:18:31,044
"This is how much I'm into this
and I'll buy you and your interpreter

1516
01:18:31,086 --> 01:18:34,006
"a first class ticket
for tomorrow to come from Taiwan. "

1517
01:18:34,047 --> 01:18:36,425
Everyone said I was crazy,

1518
01:18:36,466 --> 01:18:38,677
stupid, I'm a joke, I'm a loser.

1519
01:18:38,719 --> 01:18:40,804
I could have bought a house.

1520
01:18:40,846 --> 01:18:42,931
Two years later,
I executed my vision,

1521
01:18:42,973 --> 01:18:46,935
flipped it for the most
expensive card at the time, beat the Honus Wagner record.

1522
01:18:46,977 --> 01:18:48,645
And that's how I got
into Trout cards,

1523
01:18:48,687 --> 01:18:51,815
and I really believe
if I did not take that chance,

1524
01:18:51,857 --> 01:18:54,985
of the Mike Trout, the industry
would've never blown up.

1525
01:18:55,027 --> 01:18:57,821
It's because of me, the hobby
went to a big business.

1526
01:18:57,863 --> 01:19:00,073
This dude just took
a card for $400,000,

1527
01:19:00,115 --> 01:19:02,409
flipped it for four million
within two years.

1528
01:19:02,451 --> 01:19:04,870
That's when the card market
got huge.

1529
01:19:04,912 --> 01:19:07,331
So, for all the hate I take,

1530
01:19:07,372 --> 01:19:10,459
people should thank me
because if I didn't have the balls and vision,

1531
01:19:10,501 --> 01:19:14,087
the market wouldn't be
where it's at right now and that's 100% facts.

1532
01:19:14,129 --> 01:19:16,173
Vegas Dave likes
to anoint himself

1533
01:19:16,215 --> 01:19:18,675
as some sort of
sports card investing experts

1534
01:19:18,717 --> 01:19:21,637
because he bought
a Mike Trout card for $400,000

1535
01:19:21,678 --> 01:19:25,390
and sold it
a couple of years later for 3.9 million.

1536
01:19:25,432 --> 01:19:28,268
And, yeah,
those are big numbers. Congratulations.

1537
01:19:28,310 --> 01:19:30,896
But that's
less than a 10x return.

1538
01:19:30,938 --> 01:19:35,651
In just over a year,
LeBron James cards went up 19x,

1539
01:19:35,692 --> 01:19:39,446
Michael Jordan's cards
went up 23x,

1540
01:19:39,488 --> 01:19:43,450
and Kobe Bryant's cards,
they went up 50x.

1541
01:19:43,492 --> 01:19:47,412
So, Vegas Dave,
you would have been better off investing in one of those guys.

1542
01:19:47,454 --> 01:19:50,082
So, when I was in the process
of finding the Mickey Mantle card,

1543
01:19:50,123 --> 01:19:52,835
I was going
to different dealers.

1544
01:19:52,876 --> 01:19:55,128
Every dealer I could find,
every auction house I could find,

1545
01:19:55,170 --> 01:19:56,880
every private dealer,

1546
01:19:56,922 --> 01:20:00,092
and one of them, you know,
I'm reaching out to them on a daily basis,

1547
01:20:00,133 --> 01:20:01,468
"Hey, what do you have?
What have you heard?

1548
01:20:01,510 --> 01:20:03,220
"Who's selling,
who's willing to sell?"

1549
01:20:03,262 --> 01:20:05,138
And I'm looking
for multimillion dollar cards.

1550
01:20:05,180 --> 01:20:08,725
And, obviously, I want
the Mickey Mantle because it's the most iconic to me

1551
01:20:08,767 --> 01:20:11,562
and because I've already
purchased the four, the five,

1552
01:20:11,603 --> 01:20:14,648
the six, the eight, and I wanted
the nine and the ten.

1553
01:20:14,690 --> 01:20:17,860
So, finally, um, PWCC,

1554
01:20:17,901 --> 01:20:21,572
they said, "Hey, we've actually
found one in our vault.

1555
01:20:21,613 --> 01:20:23,073
"One of the customers has one. "

1556
01:20:23,115 --> 01:20:26,243
One of the beauties of the vault
here at PWCC is, you know,

1557
01:20:26,285 --> 01:20:29,705
we have access to inventory
that nobody else has access to.

1558
01:20:29,746 --> 01:20:33,083
I can log on online and I can
take a look at everything that we have in the vault.

1559
01:20:33,125 --> 01:20:35,961
So, you know, a lot
of these private sales happen

1560
01:20:36,003 --> 01:20:39,631
out of buyers reaching out to us
telling us they're looking for a specific card.

1561
01:20:39,673 --> 01:20:41,300
And then we go,
take a look in our vault.

1562
01:20:41,341 --> 01:20:44,261
Now that card might not be
publicly available for sale,

1563
01:20:44,303 --> 01:20:47,890
but I'm able to reach out
to the owner of that card, see if there's any interest.

1564
01:20:47,931 --> 01:20:51,435
And that's actually how
the Mantle that we sold in January 2021

1565
01:20:51,476 --> 01:20:54,897
for 5.2 million,
that's how that all transpired.

1566
01:20:54,938 --> 01:20:58,525
The buyer contacted me
and was looking for the specific card.

1567
01:20:58,567 --> 01:20:59,776
We had it in the vault.

1568
01:20:59,818 --> 01:21:03,238
ROB: And, so,
we reached out and the guy,

1569
01:21:03,280 --> 01:21:06,325
you know,
was possibly up for it, with the right price.

1570
01:21:06,366 --> 01:21:11,163
So, in two years
before this... I'd say January, 2021,

1571
01:21:11,205 --> 01:21:14,458
two years before, he bought it
for $2.88 million.

1572
01:21:14,499 --> 01:21:17,753
And he wanted,
you know, let's say six million.

1573
01:21:17,794 --> 01:21:20,923
I'm not quite sure... the price,
and I start a lot lower.

1574
01:21:20,964 --> 01:21:24,426
And then we settled on
the 5.2 million bucks.

1575
01:21:24,468 --> 01:21:29,139
And that was, you know,
so exciting because, one, you found the card,

1576
01:21:29,181 --> 01:21:32,768
you found the Mickey Mantle,
the holy grail and the nine

1577
01:21:32,809 --> 01:21:36,063
and it's the best nine
out of all the nines.

1578
01:21:36,104 --> 01:21:39,650
And then you've negotiated
a deal to where

1579
01:21:39,691 --> 01:21:43,654
less than 2x what it was
last paid for two years ago.

1580
01:21:43,695 --> 01:21:48,909
And if you look at the same
time period, other cards, other iconic cards in the hobby

1581
01:21:48,951 --> 01:21:51,411
have 10x, 20x, 30x...

1582
01:21:51,453 --> 01:21:55,165
So, for me to find
the most iconic card, um,

1583
01:21:55,207 --> 01:21:59,878
and to only get it for a 2x was,
in my eyes, an absolute steal.

1584
01:21:59,920 --> 01:22:02,798
The most important thing I think
people need to understand is,

1585
01:22:02,840 --> 01:22:06,969
do you actually love
the card culture?

1586
01:22:07,010 --> 01:22:09,137
That's the most
important question you ask yourself.

1587
01:22:09,179 --> 01:22:12,099
If you don't,
then it doesn't matter if it goes up or down.

1588
01:22:12,140 --> 01:22:15,227
Just don't get involved.
Get into something you like.

1589
01:22:15,269 --> 01:22:18,647
-MAN: Oh, dude...
-Oh, my God.

1590
01:22:18,689 --> 01:22:22,901
Can you believe it,
I have the holy grail right now? This is like...

1591
01:22:22,943 --> 01:22:26,572
I'll never forget this, man.
This is [BLEEP] crazy. I'm sorry!

1592
01:22:26,613 --> 01:22:28,407
You collect
because you love it.

1593
01:22:28,448 --> 01:22:31,994
And, of course, you sell
when the market's hot, you know, that's great.

1594
01:22:32,035 --> 01:22:34,162
Markets will dip,
just ride it out.

1595
01:22:34,204 --> 01:22:38,917
In 2018, I predicted
the card market would boom

1596
01:22:38,959 --> 01:22:41,253
before anybody else did.

1597
01:22:41,295 --> 01:22:43,630
I showed the card
that I bought for $400,000,

1598
01:22:43,672 --> 01:22:46,300
and I said this will break
the Honus Wagner record. And it did.

1599
01:22:46,341 --> 01:22:48,093
I was the first person
to tell the world

1600
01:22:48,135 --> 01:22:50,929
the market was going to boom
in the sports card industry.

1601
01:22:50,971 --> 01:22:53,140
And then in February,
this year, 2021,

1602
01:22:53,182 --> 01:22:57,311
I was the first person
to predict the market will collapse and it will.

1603
01:22:57,352 --> 01:23:00,647
And I even posted a video
on YouTube about a million views,

1604
01:23:00,689 --> 01:23:03,984
and I burned a Michael Jordan
sticker rookie that was worth

1605
01:23:04,026 --> 01:23:07,529
"a quarter million dollars"
at the time and I lit it on fire to prove a point.

1606
01:23:16,121 --> 01:23:18,665
-It's ringing.
- All right.

1607
01:23:18,707 --> 01:23:20,334
Yeah, they're just
shooting me right now.

1608
01:23:20,375 --> 01:23:21,877
They're going to...
they said they're going to your place next.

1609
01:23:21,919 --> 01:23:23,086
Oh, [BLEEP]

1610
01:23:23,128 --> 01:23:25,714
This is for you,
which you wanted.

1611
01:23:25,756 --> 01:23:29,051
But I got a burn one more corner
before I give it to you.

1612
01:23:32,054 --> 01:23:33,680
Just to keep it fresh, huh?

1613
01:23:33,722 --> 01:23:37,226
Yup. I gave you my word
this is yours.

1614
01:23:37,267 --> 01:23:39,269
So, they're going
to bring it over to your place next.

1615
01:23:39,311 --> 01:23:41,396
Got a special delivery
from Vegas Dave.

1616
01:23:41,438 --> 01:23:45,901
Ooh! [CHUCKLES]
Oh, this hurts my heart.

1617
01:23:45,943 --> 01:23:49,738
But at the same time, like,
this is history right here.

1618
01:23:49,780 --> 01:23:56,161
Everyone saw this card and had
an emotional reaction to it.

1619
01:23:56,203 --> 01:23:59,373
And that's why it's so special.

1620
01:23:59,414 --> 01:24:03,460
It's more special than holding
a pristine Michael Jordan.

1621
01:24:03,502 --> 01:24:04,753
Wow.

1622
01:24:06,505 --> 01:24:08,215
I'm going to cherish this thing.

1623
01:24:08,257 --> 01:24:10,968
Well, first, I'm going to have
Vegas Dave sign it for me,

1624
01:24:11,009 --> 01:24:13,887
and I'm going to grade it.

1625
01:24:13,929 --> 01:24:17,599
You know how I am about grading.
I need to have it graded.

1626
01:24:17,641 --> 01:24:21,061
I wonder what PSA
is going to say when I bring this in.

1627
01:24:22,729 --> 01:24:25,148
This is Vegas Dave's
rookie card.

1628
01:24:25,190 --> 01:24:26,525
My 101 superfractor.

1629
01:24:26,567 --> 01:24:28,402
STEVE: This is special,
really is.

1630
01:24:28,443 --> 01:24:31,530
It could be an auto ten

1631
01:24:31,572 --> 01:24:34,658
with a card grade of...

1632
01:24:34,700 --> 01:24:37,244
I mean, can you get
below one? 0.5?

1633
01:24:37,286 --> 01:24:42,791
Once it's in the slab,
this will be a piece of history,

1634
01:24:42,833 --> 01:24:46,962
you know, which talks
about all the opinions

1635
01:24:47,004 --> 01:24:51,466
of where
the sports card industry is going, where it's not going.

1636
01:24:51,508 --> 01:24:54,970
Is it going to go up?
Is it going to crash?

1637
01:24:55,012 --> 01:24:57,764
This is a very volatile time.

1638
01:24:57,806 --> 01:25:02,394
2021, for all the varying
opinions of sports cards,

1639
01:25:02,436 --> 01:25:04,062
this is one of the loudest
right here.

1640
01:25:04,104 --> 01:25:05,689
I gotta speak what's on my mind.

1641
01:25:05,731 --> 01:25:07,524
The market was all manipulated.

1642
01:25:07,566 --> 01:25:11,153
Why would I light a card
on fire that's worth a quarter million dollars?

1643
01:25:11,195 --> 01:25:14,448
To prove a point
that it's worthless, it's worth trash.

1644
01:25:14,489 --> 01:25:16,241
It's the truth.

1645
01:25:16,283 --> 01:25:18,493
When I held that card up,
I said this will break the record.

1646
01:25:18,535 --> 01:25:20,162
They all laughed at me.

1647
01:25:20,204 --> 01:25:22,122
And now they all laughed
at me when I said it was going to crash.

1648
01:25:22,164 --> 01:25:24,082
But every day, everyone
messages me, "You were right. "

1649
01:25:24,124 --> 01:25:27,419
"You're right,
it went down by 30%. You're right. You're right. "

1650
01:25:27,461 --> 01:25:29,963
I know I'm right.
I don't need people to tell me that.

1651
01:25:30,005 --> 01:25:33,675
I think you're going to also
have some rise in the industry and rising prices

1652
01:25:33,717 --> 01:25:35,552
because you have
so much money coming in

1653
01:25:35,594 --> 01:25:37,179
not only from individuals,
but funds.

1654
01:25:37,221 --> 01:25:38,889
There's so many
funds being created.

1655
01:25:38,931 --> 01:25:43,352
And as those funds
start infusing cash into the market again,

1656
01:25:43,393 --> 01:25:45,896
you've got more and more
money coming in,

1657
01:25:45,938 --> 01:25:48,690
decreasing supply
and big demand.

1658
01:25:48,732 --> 01:25:50,567
So, I think the funds
are important.

1659
01:25:50,609 --> 01:25:53,946
I think they're jumping in,
which should kind of give you

1660
01:25:53,987 --> 01:25:58,075
a little bit of a look
into the future that the prices will continue to rise.

1661
01:25:58,116 --> 01:26:01,161
GEOFF: There's been
a lot of recent innovation in the sports card world

1662
01:26:01,203 --> 01:26:04,331
around the idea
of making it easier

1663
01:26:04,373 --> 01:26:07,501
for people to come in
and invest in sports cards.

1664
01:26:07,543 --> 01:26:11,004
One of those innovations
has been fractional ownership.

1665
01:26:11,046 --> 01:26:16,593
That's where groups will buy
large dollar cards, really, really high-end cards,

1666
01:26:16,635 --> 01:26:19,054
but then,
sell little fractions,

1667
01:26:19,096 --> 01:26:21,890
shares of that card
to a wide audience

1668
01:26:21,932 --> 01:26:27,229
so people can buy
into a really expensive card on a really small budget.

1669
01:26:27,271 --> 01:26:29,857
You've got people lending money
on your collection,

1670
01:26:29,898 --> 01:26:31,567
which I think
is a big opportunity

1671
01:26:31,608 --> 01:26:33,819
'cause now it allows people
bigger buying power.

1672
01:26:33,861 --> 01:26:36,655
I mean, you can borrow money
on your house, you can borrow money on your assets,

1673
01:26:36,697 --> 01:26:38,949
but you haven't been able
to borrow money on cards.

1674
01:26:38,991 --> 01:26:40,826
So, I think
that's a big opportunity.

1675
01:26:40,868 --> 01:26:44,580
and a great way for people
to have more buying power.

1676
01:26:44,621 --> 01:26:47,541
But, you know, you've got
AI coming in as far as helping,

1677
01:26:47,583 --> 01:26:51,295
you know, PSA grade
or AI grading companies.

1678
01:26:51,336 --> 01:26:53,130
You just have
so much technology,

1679
01:26:53,172 --> 01:26:55,465
so much money
that's coming out of the hobby,

1680
01:26:55,507 --> 01:26:58,635
that it's... um, I think
it'll only help it grow.

1681
01:26:58,677 --> 01:27:00,429
There are some really
interesting companies

1682
01:27:00,470 --> 01:27:01,930
in the fractional
ownership space.

1683
01:27:01,972 --> 01:27:03,765
My favorite is a company
called Dibbs

1684
01:27:03,807 --> 01:27:05,726
because they're attempting
to create

1685
01:27:05,767 --> 01:27:09,396
a real-time stock markets,
for cards,

1686
01:27:09,438 --> 01:27:13,358
by using fractional ownership,
so you can buy and sell

1687
01:27:13,400 --> 01:27:16,445
little shares
of really high-end expensive cards.

1688
01:27:16,486 --> 01:27:21,116
But you can do it in real-time,
just like a stock market type of experience.

1689
01:27:21,158 --> 01:27:24,870
It's unheard of. Ten years ago,
you could never buy shares of a baseball card.

1690
01:27:24,912 --> 01:27:26,955
It's absolutely
absurd and ridiculous.

1691
01:27:26,997 --> 01:27:30,375
All these people
from Wall Street,

1692
01:27:30,417 --> 01:27:33,337
once they saw my card
sell for $4 million,

1693
01:27:33,378 --> 01:27:35,839
their money motivated,
so they got into the card industry.

1694
01:27:35,881 --> 01:27:38,342
So, now what did they do?
They brought the mentality

1695
01:27:38,383 --> 01:27:41,512
of the stock market
and Wall Street to the card industry.

1696
01:27:41,553 --> 01:27:43,222
So, someone will buy a card.

1697
01:27:43,263 --> 01:27:46,725
Let's say they'll buy
a Michael Jordan rookie for $100,000

1698
01:27:46,767 --> 01:27:48,894
and they'll sell 20 shares
to the public

1699
01:27:49,811 --> 01:27:51,230
at 20,000 apiece.

1700
01:27:51,271 --> 01:27:53,106
So, all these people
that could never afford a card,

1701
01:27:53,148 --> 01:27:55,400
can own a piece of history.

1702
01:27:55,442 --> 01:27:58,028
They collect all this money,
raise capital,

1703
01:27:58,070 --> 01:28:01,114
over-inflate the price,
sell at an auction house,

1704
01:28:01,156 --> 01:28:03,617
have their friend buy it
and boom,

1705
01:28:03,659 --> 01:28:06,537
the card goes up
by 200% to 300%.

1706
01:28:06,578 --> 01:28:09,164
They get... The people
get paid back, their investments back,

1707
01:28:09,206 --> 01:28:12,709
and they do it
over and over again until one day they pull the plug

1708
01:28:12,751 --> 01:28:15,420
and the whole market collapses
like a domino effect.

1709
01:28:15,462 --> 01:28:19,633
So, these are all
artificially inflated prices because you're getting one card,

1710
01:28:19,675 --> 01:28:21,301
and you're selling shares of it,

1711
01:28:21,343 --> 01:28:26,223
ten, twenty, thirty people
chipping in money to buy the card.

1712
01:28:26,265 --> 01:28:29,643
They over-inflate the price.
You can't sell shares of a card.

1713
01:28:29,685 --> 01:28:32,521
It's absolutely ridiculous
and that's why you can see all these cards

1714
01:28:32,563 --> 01:28:37,609
go up to $800,000, $900,000
that were $50,000 for years and years and years straight.

1715
01:28:37,651 --> 01:28:41,613
So, just like the stock market,
it's going to collapse one day

1716
01:28:41,655 --> 01:28:43,991
and when it collapses,
it's going to collapse really, really big.

1717
01:28:44,032 --> 01:28:46,535
I think we all have

1718
01:28:46,577 --> 01:28:51,248
some of that in us
that want to own something

1719
01:28:51,290 --> 01:28:55,210
that is important to us
rather than just have a picture of it.

1720
01:28:55,252 --> 01:28:57,838
That's why, beyond the cards,

1721
01:28:59,423 --> 01:29:01,800
you know, I'm a collector
of NFTs.

1722
01:29:01,842 --> 01:29:04,928
Beyond the NFT,
what's behind the NFT?

1723
01:29:04,970 --> 01:29:07,848
It's the rarity.
And it's the fact that it's...

1724
01:29:09,433 --> 01:29:12,728
it's authenticated,
that it has a contract

1725
01:29:12,769 --> 01:29:15,189
that the market has dictated.

1726
01:29:15,230 --> 01:29:17,399
And that's the same thing
with the card.

1727
01:29:17,441 --> 01:29:19,860
That's like the same way
you explain

1728
01:29:19,902 --> 01:29:23,071
to someone
that doesn't understand sports cards, why it's valuable.

1729
01:29:23,113 --> 01:29:25,532
Because the market
has dictated its value.

1730
01:29:25,574 --> 01:29:29,328
MAN 1: Initially, to launch
our NFTs and our blockchain platform,

1731
01:29:29,369 --> 01:29:33,832
we were offering
a physical card that would come with the digital card,

1732
01:29:33,874 --> 01:29:37,711
and we did this
because we wanted our card junkies to come in

1733
01:29:37,753 --> 01:29:39,796
and figure out
what the blockchain is

1734
01:29:39,838 --> 01:29:43,800
and buy blockchain products
to get hold of that... that card product.

1735
01:29:43,842 --> 01:29:47,971
As digital cards
have become more valuable and more in demand,

1736
01:29:48,013 --> 01:29:51,934
we're now looking at doing
just digital cards and selling them on their own.

1737
01:29:51,975 --> 01:29:55,312
JASON: We spent, you know,
the last two or three years

1738
01:29:55,354 --> 01:29:58,732
thinking about
how we incorporate blockchain into the trading card space,

1739
01:29:58,774 --> 01:30:00,192
and we were
the first manufacturer

1740
01:30:00,234 --> 01:30:02,110
to introduce
blockchain trading cards.

1741
01:30:02,152 --> 01:30:04,613
When we launched blockchain
in January of 2020,

1742
01:30:04,655 --> 01:30:07,824
we tied it to a physical card,
so that, you know,

1743
01:30:07,866 --> 01:30:11,537
the collector could understand
the value of what a physical card was

1744
01:30:11,578 --> 01:30:14,706
and then knowing that
they had that non-fungible token

1745
01:30:14,748 --> 01:30:18,627
that was tied to blockchain
as a digital asset to accompany that card,

1746
01:30:18,669 --> 01:30:21,964
really kind of created
another level of value within the space.

1747
01:30:22,005 --> 01:30:25,133
Even though they didn't know
what blockchain meant at the time.

1748
01:30:25,175 --> 01:30:28,971
Now, 15 months later,
in 2021, March of 2021,

1749
01:30:29,012 --> 01:30:34,476
everyone knows what an NFT is
or a non-fungible token that lives on the blockchain,

1750
01:30:34,518 --> 01:30:37,938
and we've been there
for the last 16 months.

1751
01:30:37,980 --> 01:30:42,484
Now, back in the 1980s,
we saw a huge boom in sports card popularity,

1752
01:30:42,526 --> 01:30:44,236
similar to what
we're seeing today.

1753
01:30:44,278 --> 01:30:48,615
But then that was followed
by a total crash in the 1990s

1754
01:30:48,657 --> 01:30:50,951
and there are people out there
that are worried that

1755
01:30:50,993 --> 01:30:53,370
we might be facing that
same crash again today.

1756
01:30:53,412 --> 01:30:57,249
RICH LAYTON: Everybody gets
nervous of that. When their 20-dollar cards

1757
01:30:57,291 --> 01:31:00,127
became five-dollar cards
in the '90s,

1758
01:31:00,169 --> 01:31:02,421
or even a dollar cards
for that matter,

1759
01:31:02,462 --> 01:31:05,382
and their $100-boxes
became $50-boxes.

1760
01:31:05,424 --> 01:31:11,889
Um, I think there's new measures
in place that will prevent a lot of that from happening.

1761
01:31:11,930 --> 01:31:13,974
WARSOP: The reason
for the crash in the past

1762
01:31:14,016 --> 01:31:16,435
was because people thought
cards were rare,

1763
01:31:16,476 --> 01:31:17,811
when actually
they were mass-produced.

1764
01:31:17,853 --> 01:31:19,146
That's no longer the case.

1765
01:31:19,188 --> 01:31:21,481
In recent years,
in modern day trading cards,

1766
01:31:21,523 --> 01:31:23,567
you know exactly
what it is you're buying,

1767
01:31:23,609 --> 01:31:26,111
how many of that card
is on the market.

1768
01:31:26,153 --> 01:31:29,489
And that numbering system
hasn't changed over the last three or four years.

1769
01:31:29,531 --> 01:31:31,992
So, the values
will always remain there.

1770
01:31:32,034 --> 01:31:34,119
The only thing
that can impact the card values

1771
01:31:34,161 --> 01:31:36,997
are whether a player
performs on the court or not.

1772
01:31:37,039 --> 01:31:39,082
Since 2015, um,

1773
01:31:39,124 --> 01:31:41,460
every year we said
there's no way it can get bigger.

1774
01:31:41,502 --> 01:31:43,295
There's no way it can get
better than what it was,

1775
01:31:43,337 --> 01:31:45,923
and it's exceeded
and exceeded and exceeded.

1776
01:31:45,964 --> 01:31:47,508
We're here in 2021,

1777
01:31:47,549 --> 01:31:51,094
um, and I don't think
it's anywhere close to being done.

1778
01:31:51,136 --> 01:31:53,639
With the new people
coming into the industry,

1779
01:31:53,680 --> 01:31:56,141
with more and more money
being invested back into this,

1780
01:31:56,183 --> 01:31:58,560
with the international growth
of this market,

1781
01:31:58,602 --> 01:32:00,270
there's not a crash coming soon.

1782
01:32:00,312 --> 01:32:04,566
The market is healthy,
the market is early on, um,

1783
01:32:04,608 --> 01:32:06,401
and we're expecting
big things coming up.

1784
01:32:06,443 --> 01:32:09,947
I've heard a lot of different
varying opinions on a market crash coming.

1785
01:32:09,988 --> 01:32:12,741
I do not believe there is
any type of crash coming.

1786
01:32:12,783 --> 01:32:15,077
Will there be a stabilization?
There has to be.

1787
01:32:15,118 --> 01:32:19,248
Base cards
are very over-inundated and submitted,

1788
01:32:19,289 --> 01:32:22,209
and once the larger companies
are able to get them back,

1789
01:32:22,251 --> 01:32:25,420
I think we'll see a correction
of the base cards and silvers that are,

1790
01:32:25,462 --> 01:32:27,172
you know, mass produced.

1791
01:32:27,214 --> 01:32:29,258
I don't think
your numbered cards are ever going to go anywhere.

1792
01:32:29,299 --> 01:32:30,926
I think they're going to
continue to hold their value.

1793
01:32:30,968 --> 01:32:34,304
Crash? I'm not... I don't like
that word, it just doesn't...

1794
01:32:34,346 --> 01:32:35,806
I don't like that word

1795
01:32:35,848 --> 01:32:40,394
because... things go
up and down. That is life.

1796
01:32:40,435 --> 01:32:43,397
Things go up.
And, of course, it goes down.

1797
01:32:43,438 --> 01:32:47,651
And then, guess what?
It goes back up and then it goes down.

1798
01:32:47,693 --> 01:32:50,654
I mean,
I'm not in it like a stock.

1799
01:32:50,696 --> 01:32:53,407
So, if it goes down,
I'm still in it.

1800
01:32:53,448 --> 01:32:55,951
I'm not like, "Okay, I'm done,
I'm out, I'm already in. "

1801
01:32:55,993 --> 01:33:00,330
In 2021, people were
talking about an impending sports card crash.

1802
01:33:00,372 --> 01:33:03,584
But the hobby was still
untapped internationally.

1803
01:33:03,625 --> 01:33:07,421
What happens
when every continent joins the party?

1804
01:33:07,462 --> 01:33:09,256
We're just getting started!

1805
01:33:10,841 --> 01:33:12,801
[UPBEAT TECHNO MUSIC PLAYING]