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(FLASH BULB POPS AND WHINES)
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(DRAMATIC MUSIC)
(UNSETTLING MUSIC)
-(RAIN PATTERS) -(DISTURBING MUSIC)
(THUNDER RUMBLES)
(SPARSE MUSIC)
SILVESTER: We have an awful fascination with the dark twins,
evil and tragedy.
It is what makes us slow and stare at an accident scene,
prepared to be horrified at what we see,
and yet we still look.
(SIRENS WAIL, HORNS HONK)
And it is what makes us wonder what makes a serial killer,
that rare body that walks among us,
hiding in plain sight.
(UNSETTLING MUSIC)
(INDISTINCT POLICE RADIO CHATTER)
MAN: But I couldn't sleep a wink, because, um...
..the reality is, you know, he'd gone again
and...and, uh, we'd missed our opportunity and...
..it was...it was just gut-wrenching.
Could you just hold that up?
The offender was a quiet loner named Paul Charles Denyer.
The signs were there
that Denyer was a potential psychopath...
That's the way you operate it.
..if anyone had bothered to look.
-(SOLEMN PIANO MUSIC) -(SEAGULLS SQUAWK)
It was 1993,
long before social media dominated
the communications landscape,
and by any definition, Melbourne was blessed
with a relatively low crime rate.
But in the bayside suburb of Frankston,
that changed in just six weeks,
when three women -
Elizabeth Stevens,
young mother Debbie Fream
and schoolgirl Natalie Russell -
were stalked and murdered in the dead of winter.
(THUNDER RUMBLES, RAIN PATTERS)
The serial killer forced a large slice of Melbourne
into virtual lockdown
and left a homicide task force fighting the clock.
Yeah, look, I was on call on 11 June 1993,
running a team.
And we got the call, and no different to any other job.
We've got a body of a young female
in a place called Lloyd Park,
which is about 3km, um, east of Frankston.
Um, she's in a culvert.
She's, um, dressed.
(SIREN WAILS)
And it was absolutely pouring
and so we were behind the eight ball
before we even started.
(THUNDER BOOMS)
(UNSETTLING MUSIC)
(FLASH BULB POPS)
It was just like a satanic killing
because of the...
..the wounds to the torso concerned us,
the very significant injuries to the throat.
Um, that, uh...
It was, I suppose, you could say
a stage of an overkill.
And that tells you a story
that there is no way known this woman is going to survive
because she would've been able to identify the offender.
So you read these things into it.
(GRIM MUSIC)
(INDISTINCT CHATTER)
MAN: Very quickly you could tell with the first murder
that, um, Elizabeth Stevens,
it was unusual
and certainly, with the marks on her body,
there was something astray.
So the Homicide squad took that on immediately.
When I saw the... the marks on the body,
uh, they were unusual
and there is a history of that type of behaviour
with serial killers,
so I was immediately alert to
the potential for something worse to come.
-(TRAM BELL RINGS) -(GRIM MUSIC)
MAN: We had that many suspects,
it was really a difficult process to try and filter down
as to who or someone we should look at.
And we looked at plenty of individuals
and invested lots of time
in what ended up being red herrings
but you don't know it at the time
and you've got to follow the trail.
And we had a mannequin we dressed as the same clothing,
um, had a face depicted on the mannequin,
and we had leaflets, we did roadblocks
to try and put her on that bus.
This was well before CCTV was in vogue that we have today.
We certainly knew she was at the TAFE college.
From that point, blank.
Then came the issue with a missing persons report
of Debbie Fream.
Um, and it wasn't until her body was found,
um, near a farmland
just out of Frankston.
And once I went to that scene,
you could see that she'd been fully clothed.
Uh, throat was cut savagely - same as Elizabeth Stevens.
She had one or two branches covering her,
and then you knew.
-(DOGS BARK) -(MOURNFUL MUSIC)
REPORTER: Detectives have been told
she was driving erratically.
She appeared to be in a distressed state
and was flashing the headlights of the car
to, uh...presumably to attract attention.
The second murder, everyone started to fear that,
"Do we have a serial murder in the town?"
And questions in the media started sparking that.
BEZZINA: But the issue then was
of keeping calm within the community,
of not going out and declaring that.
-(UNSETTLING MUSIC) -(THUNDER RUMBLES)
WILSON: He, uh...he struck when
there was extremely heavy... heavy rain happening,
lightning and thunder and, um...
And as we eventually found out, the reason he did that
was it offered him a cloak of opportunity
to strike when no-one would hear anything,
no-one would hear anyone screaming
because of the rain and the... and the extreme weather.
-(UNSETTLING MUSIC) -(THUNDER RUMBLES)
SILVESTER: Debbie Fream lived with her boyfriend, Garry Blair,
in Kananook Avenue, Seaford.
On July 8, 1993,
she drove down the road to the local milk bar
to buy eggs, milk and a chocolate bar.
She was out of the car for little more than a minute.
Her son, Jake, was 12 days old.
I remember the public identified Debbie Fream's car
that had been dumped in Frankston,
and that was our first breakthrough,
as far as I was concerned.
And that's when we knew that the offender
must live within walking distance of that car.
We had blood in the car
and it had been driven back.
There are, uh, perhaps some similarities,
uh, in the two recent murders.
And we wanted to deal with the crime scene
where the car was found and the car itself.
But at that stage,
Peter took the view that, uh,
we've got real problems here with this guy
and we need to get, um,
a really strong investigation focus on it.
(HAUNTING MUSIC)
But the community could read about it -
two women abducted
within a matter of weeks of each other,
unassociated.
WOMAN: We're sick and tired of these attacks.
The fact that you can't even go down to your local milk bar
without being attacked is now very serious in this area.
I'm certainly not saying that there is a serial killer loose.
What I am saying is that there are similarities
between the murder of... in Frankston
and the murder at Langwarrin.
And because of that,
people shouldn't treat them in isolation.
I would like to see as many local residents as we can
get to the meeting
because there'll be authorities there
that can tell us exactly what to do for our own protection.
The mood in Frankston at the time
was, um...
..everyone was in fear.
Um...you know, we... we didn't really know
exactly what was going on.
REPORTER: Detectives revealed their latest lead
in the hunt for Debbie Fream's killer
in the wake of last night's huge turnout
to a community crisis meeting at Seaford.
Dozens of people were turned away
when the local community centre reached capacity.
But on the night that Debbie Fream disappeared,
he observed a man washing blood from his hands and face
in the Seaford area.
(UNSETTLING MUSIC)
And they were really quick - relatively quick.
One after the other.
So there was a real sense,
especially after the second one,
"What's gonna happen next?"
And there are times when things occur
that are beyond your control.
And yet you can see
a community becoming agitated.
And that's what started to occur then.
You started to see a community concerned.
Not turning on itself,
but concerned and worried and wanting resolution.
I know my wife was concerned
to go, um, anywhere by herself.
Um, it was the topic of everyone's conversation
in a coffee shop or at home.
So that fear quickly developed.
The media were...
I don't like to use the word 'frenzied',
but there was a lot of activity in Frankston
about, um, the potential that this guy could strike again.
It was difficult to, uh, take over the control
of another team's murder,
but, um, we had to work our way through that,
and we did.
BEZZINA: Offenders are lazy.
So we made a decision to do a 2km square doorknock
from where that car radiated from.
The big plan was to call in all the resources
from the other crime squads
to come in and assist us with a doorknock
and account for every individual, teenager upwards.
And they tend to, um...
..gravitate to the areas they are living in.
And so it is, um, reasonable
to think that or suspect
they may be living not too far
from where the first incident occurred
and, um, may even be living closer to the second incident
and so on.
(INDISTINCT POLICE RADIO CHATTER)
WILSON: The fear in the community,
the resources that we had to redirect
from all over the state for Operation Reassurance
so that we were doubling and tripling the patrols
in the streets,
we were sending out messages to the community
about making sure young women,
that they're being careful, they're being vigilant,
if there's no need to go out, then don't.
Obviously, women, um, travelling alone
or, uh...have got to take precautions
in relation to, um, their activities
in the Frankston area at this present point in time.
You know, don't be left in isolated situations.
Like, that sort of messaging, as you would know,
it certainly puts a lot of pressure on a community,
right up to government.
REPORTER: Dubbed 'Operation Reassurance',
there will be boosted patrols around the clock.
The helicopter will make regular sweeps,
the Mounted Branch will tour the streets.
The Transit Patrol will ride the trains.
They say it's not good enough
that people are hiding in their homes in fear.
BEZZINA: We had a chap.
We did a doorknock on this particular house.
He opened the door.
He was covered in blood and told us to fuck off.
Got a warrant, searched him,
ended up he was a self-mutilator.
(UNSETTLING MUSIC)
MAN: We identified a suspect,
who had moved out of Debbie Fream's street,
um, the night, uh, she was murdered,
with a horrific history.
So... And had taken off.
So we thought, uh,
he's gotta be worth a good look.
We found out he was at Corryong
and I went up to Corryong with Charlie Bezzina and Mark Wolf,
and while we were up there,
unfortunately, Natalie Russell was murdered.
MAN: So on the night Natalie Russell was reported missing,
I went to the football at the MCG
and I...I didn't get home until about midnight.
And I was met at the front door by my wife.
And, um...and she told me that a young girl had gone missing
and that my people had been trying to locate me all night.
Of course, this predated mobile phones.
(SOLEMN MUSIC)
(SIREN WAILS)
RANKIN: Then that evening, a sergeant doing a search
locates the body of Natalie Russell,
uh, through a cut wire in the fence
off this track in the golf course.
So I got into my car and drove into the office.
And, um, yeah...
I started getting phone calls from people saying,
"Is she with you?"
And I was like, "No,"
um, "I was expecting her to call me," or something.
And, um, then I started to panic
once I sort of...
'Cause it was very unusual for her.
She was always very careful to, um, you know,
not let people worry about her
especially in the current situation that was in Frankston.
SILVESTER: The victim was identified
by Dr Darren Russell...
..Natalie's brother.
WILSON: We fast-forward then
to the body being found Friday night.
The next day, the Saturday,
we were running a major operation in Frankston
involving 200 detectives,
where we were gonna doorknock an area of Frankston
with a profile,
trying to flush out who this might be.
We were going to catch up that night.
I think that was her plan that night.
Um, she was... uh, for some reason,
going home earlier, walking home.
I think the plan was to get picked up by her mum.
But she was going home and walked down that track
and, um...
Yeah, we were planning on meeting up
and probably meeting with other friends
and, yeah...
(HAUNTING VOCAL MUSIC)
RANKIN: I thought we had two weeks to resolve it
because, like, if it wasn't school holiday time
parents would've been terrified
about sending their kids to school.
So I thought, in my own mind,
that for the community's sake,
we really had two weeks to resolve it.
(RAIN PATTERS, THUNDER BOOMS)
And want of a better word,
it's the chase that you're involved in,
is you're building the evidence and the clues from one body
at a crime scene
to eventually making an arrest.
And, you know, there was a lot of pressure
being brought on the investigators to catch this guy.
You could've thrown a match and the place would've exploded.
And there was... there was outrage,
but more importantly,
there was this genuine, genuine fear
and the police were doing everything they could
to identify a suspect and to make the arrest.
Uh, but it wasn't an easy time for the community down there.
Isn't it about time that the government decided
to bring back capital punishment?
(PEOPLE CHEER)
(MOUTHS WORDS)
I think with the investigators,
there's pressure on them to... to get a result
and get a result as soon as possible.
But my job is to try and take that pressure off them
and manage that and manage what might happen in the future
and let them focus on what actually happened
and what they need to deal with.
So on the Saturday morning, um,
we had a couple of known serious sex offenders and suspects,
uh, so myself and a team, we quickly went...
..visited a couple of houses.
We seized some clothing from a couple of addresses.
And then we set up, at 10am,
we set up an information caravan in Skye Road,
right at the bottom of the laneway
where Natalie was murdered.
And then it was shortly after 3 o'clock,
Rod Wilson come to the caravan
and, um...
..he produced, um, some reports that had come in,
uh, one of course from the, uh...
..the young postal officer that had noticed the car
and there were the two other sightings
just prior to Natalie's murder
at the Langwarrin Fauna and Flora Reserve.
And also there was another sighting
at the Kananook railway station.
Of course, I wasn't to know it at the time,
but we had him inside 24 hours.
SILVESTER: Postie Vicky Collins was on her delivery round
when she saw a driver trying to hide
inside a parked yellow sedan.
It was 3:05pm and Denyer was about to murder Natalie Russell.
She stopped at a house to ring police.
It would be the first time
police could place Denyer at the crime scene.
He was then the number one suspect.
Whilst I was at the Frankston Police Station,
I was alerted to the fact that
these young cops had checked that vehicle yesterday.
"Hey, boss, we checked the car
"not far from there on Skye Road,"
and that's when it all evolved.
-(GRIM MUSIC) -(CAMERA CLICKS)
(INDISTINCT POLICE RADIO CHATTER)
WILSON: And it happened to be right opposite the track
where we assumed Natalie had walked at the time
she was...she went missing.
So it was the golden nugget of information
that we'd...we'd looked at... we looked for
and then we then started concentrating on
who this guy was
and it just went from there.
And there was one of those moments.
I looked at Rod and I just knew.
I said...
.."This is him."
(RAIN PATTERS, THUNDER RUMBLES)
We decided then,
um, that myself and Mick Hughes would go down.
Uh, just the two of us.
Although, we had reinforcements not too far away
because if it's him, you know,
we've gotta be extremely careful of how we approach him.
Not many people around.
I was doorknocking
and I was literally speaking to, um, the resident,
just asking if they'd seen anything.
And it was interesting - out of the corner of my right eye,
I saw a car going at a really fast rate of knots.
(SIREN WAILS)
And I could see my crew in there,
so the Frankston detectives, in the car.
And they must've seen me.
I don't know how, 'cause they were travelling too quick,
heading somewhere.
Um, and they pulled up the brakes, backed back
and yelled out to me to jump in the car.
(UNSETTLING MUSIC)
WILSON: Uh, we went to the door.
Um, it was just a small flat in, uh...in Frankston
where he was living.
Um, we went inside. He invited us in.
Uh, we just said we were following up on the doorknock.
He said, "Come in."
He offered me a cigarette.
Um...
He was just too effusive about us being there
and...and it was just a little unnatural.
And then we invited him back to the police station, um,
all under pol... under caution, of course.
And again, I'll warn you that you're not obliged
to say or do anything unless you wish to,
and anything you say or do may be given in evidence.
He was very, very comfortable in coming back
and wanting to help.
He was so enthusiastic about the opportunity
to play the game, to be important again,
to come down and be the centre of me asking him questions
about his movements
over the last, you know, five or six weeks.
I intend to interview you
in relation to the death
of Natalie Russell.
Um, before continuing, I must inform you
that you're not obliged to say or do anything,
but anything you say or do may be given in evidence.
-Do you understand that? -Yeah.
You know, sometimes, when you've worked homicide for a long time
you just get a bit of a gut feeling about, um, individuals.
O'LOUGHLIN: I think there's nothing better than video.
You actually can see demeanour.
You can see how people respond to questions,
whether it's an obvious sort of lie
or, um...
"Can you account for your movements over...
.."since the... the Russell murder?"
May.
Police say, from May, you haven't worked since then.
I think that's right, yeah.
SILVESTER: You're on the fly. You don't know much about him.
No.
Just, uh, stopping there for a moment.
What sort of car do you have?
Uh, 1974 Toyota Corona. Corona Mark II.
Corona Mark II? What colour is that?
Uh, yellowish cream. Cream yellow.
Right. What's the registration number?
(LAUGHS)
Denyer had started on a path
of what he termed 'hunting'.
(DOGS BARK IN DISTANCE)
This was real.
(UNSETTLING MUSIC)
MAN: One of the things that I've discovered
in looking at serial killers
is that their biographies are typically quite vague
about their childhood.
But in fact, if you rely on the evidence
of other people,
you see this pattern of childhood trauma
and, um, absolutely unrelenting brutality
that they're subjected to.
And I guess, if you think about it,
if you bought a puppy and you got it at eight weeks
and you brutalised it every day,
you wouldn't really be terribly surprised,
uh, if it turned out to be a very angry dog.
-(GRIM MUSIC) -(CAMERA CLICKS)
I've seen the vehicle today.
It has no registration plates.
That's correct.
Why is that?
'Cause it's currently unregistered.
But he was... you know, he was ready
'cause he... he knew we were coming.
He'd prepared himself to explain his movements.
Uh, car started to overheat on the way home,
so I pulled over into a little car park area
next to a flora reserve.
WILSON: Mm-hm.
Uh...
I checked the water. Topped it up.
What time do you think you would've actually broken down
in Skye Road, opposite the golf course there?
Now, you would've turned left into Skye Road
and you parked on the left-hand side of the road?
-Yeah. -Just normally parked?
Yeah, just up against the kerb.
Up against the kerb. Alright. So what did you do then?
You got the bonnet up at this stage?
Yeah, got the bonnet up.
I checked my toolbox to see if I had, you know,
a proper screwdriver to do it up with...
-To do what up with? -The hose clamp.
I put the hose back on, but I wanted to do the hose clamp.
-To make it a bit tighter? -Yeah. So it wouldn't come off.
At that stage, when you're in Skye Road,
how far from home were you?
About a 25-minute walk.
(UNSETTLING MUSIC)
(MOURNFUL PIANO MUSIC)
LIMBRICK: Natalie was a...
She was a really intelligent young woman.
Um...
She...she loved writing.
She...she was interested in journalism.
Um, she...she used to like
wearing purple and black clothes,
you know, she...
I think people would've called her a Goth.
You know, she had very dark hair
and, um, dark eyes and, uh... and, um...
But...and she had a really, uh, funny sense of humour,
a quirky sense of humour,
which everyone loved about her.
(CAMERA CLICKS)
Had you become aware that a girl
was found murdered in Frankston...
Yeah, I've heard a lot about it.
Her body was found in Frankston yester...uh, today.
-Today being Saturday. -Yeah.
When did you first become aware of that?
Well, I saw some police cars and everything
when I was driving up Skye Road this morning at 8:30.
WILSON: Sorry, you saw SES workers and all that.
DENYER: Mmm.
-WILSON: In Skye Road. -DENYER: Yeah.
They had some white tape across the walkway.
I saw you.
-I'm sorry - you saw me? -Yeah, I saw you.
And I saw, uh...the other guy I was talking to in there.
I saw youse...you guys standing next to a van.
Oh, yeah? What sort of van?
White one. Like a caravan.
-Big van. -Oh, yeah.
A lot of them are rat cunning
and they might appear not to be
the brightest person in the world,
but they're rat cunning
when it comes to trying to cover their tracks
or set up an alibi or whatever.
They get a lot of that from television, of course.
Can you just detail to me
what clothing you had on yesterday
when you were in Skye Road?
Yesterday.
Yesterday, I had, uh, black pants.
Right.
I had black shoes.
What sort of black pants?
-Tracksuit pants. -Right.
I had a black pair of Aerosport runners.
Right. What size foot are you?
-10. -Right.
Oh, 10, 11.
-(UNEASY MUSIC) -(MUD SQUELCHES)
WILSON: He was able to recount his movements
down to the nth degree
about where he was on a particular night,
where he'd had dinner, what he...you know, etc, etc.
Now, I don't know about you, John,
but I can barely remember what I did two days ago.
If the police came along and looked at your car...
I would have seen them, yeah.
You would have seen that, wouldn't you?
Course. (LAUGHS)
You would've taken particular attention
if the police had come along.
Yeah, I would've been worried
about the car being unregistered.
WILSON: Yeah.
What time do you think you were...
..got from the park, assuming you drove directly,
to the time that you noticed that the...temperature rising
and pulled up your car
in, um, Skye...Road?
(GRIM MUSIC)
WILSON: I think what we found was,
the day after he'd killed Natalie Russell,
he was out and about again.
I think he was actually actively looking
for opportunities to kill again.
He was narrowing the time frames
or the time between, um, each person he killed,
'cause he was getting away with it
and he was becoming far more brazen.
When your car was parked in Skye Road,
um, it was checked by the police.
-Right. -Um...
-Were you aware of that? -(CAMERA CLICKS)
No.
You're not aware of that?
Well, when a friend of mine told me
they heard my name over a scanner yesterday.
Sorry?
Friend of mine told me... I spoke to her this morning.
She said she heard my name mentioned and my address
and details of my car mentioned over a police scanner.
WILSON: How did she come to hear
your name over the scanner?
She's got a scanner, has she?
-A friend of hers has. -Who's that?
I don't know. She didn't say.
She was sitting in the car with them
and, you know, heard my name over a scanner.
When did your name come over the scanner?
Yesterday.
Probably when you said, when the police checked my car.
-Probably then, yeah. -I see. Wow.
What struck me was... his recall.
"Elizabeth Stevens was found dead on this day."
"Jeez, that day I was down there."
He put himself in every location.
He put himself at every murder scene.
"And you know I was in Skye Road
"because you've told me you checked my car."
So, you know, on we went from there.
But there was a long way to go, long way.
It's all about proving it.
So you saw me this morning. You saw a van set up.
You knew that 12 o'clock,
from what the other girl had told you,
that your car had been mentioned
and your name and that read out over the...over the, uh...
..over the scanner or something.
-Yeah. -With the details of your car.
You saw a caravan set up,
but you didn't think it'd be relevant to say
that you had your car parked there,
knowing that the police had checked it.
Well, I thought, you know,
if the police, you know, checked my car out sitting there...
WILSON: Mm.
..it'd be, you know, routine for them to come and see me.
So you expected the police to come and see you?
Yeah, I just thought, you know,
you guys would come around, yeah.
One of my lads, Darren O'Loughlin,
uh, he...he was tasked to sit with Denyer
during the course of the...
..during the course of the evening
while Rod and his team were moving in and out,
making inquiries and following up things
and looking at what had been recovered
from his address and...
O'LOUGHLIN: He asked what my thoughts were
about the murders.
And I said, "Look, I'm not involved
"in the investigation at all.
"I've got no idea what evidence they have,
"what they're doing,"
um, along those sort of lines.
What I did say is that, um,
"Whoever's committing these crimes
"is influenced by a demon.
"They're pure evil."
And...and that caused him to stop and think
and say, "I used to go to church."
And I said, "Oh, OK. Which church?"
And he said, "Seaford."
I said, "Who's the pastor?"
He said, "Pastor Peter Nicholls."
And I was a bit shocked
because it was just a coincidence
or a set of unusual facts
that I had just started a marriage course with my wife
in Pastor Peter Nicholls's home
at the same time.
And so I didn't say anything
because the last thing you want to do
is give away your personal, um, details.
The...the thing that stuck in my mind,
he said,
"They," the Church, "see me as a wolf
"in sheep's clothing."
I noticed a number of cuts on your fingers.
Yeah.
Can you just, um, put your hands...
..flat on the desk here
so that, um...
Just right up here.
He now saw that every headline and every news bulletin
led with, um,
"There's a serial killer on the loose."
It just gave him a sense of importance
that he was the... he was the subject
of what everybody was talking about
and it made him feel important.
On his finger here,
he had a large chunk of skin missing.
-WILSON: You've got a cut here. -DENYER: Hmm.
-WILSON: See here? -DENYER: Yep.
-And you've got a cut here. -DENYER: Yep.
WILSON: When did they occur?
DENYER: I'm not quite sure when they occurred.
OK, so at the same time,
there's obviously a live post-mortem being...
..uh, is occurring simultaneous to the interview.
Probably just over an inch long.
It's on the middle finger of your left hand.
If you can just show it that way so we can see it a bit clearer.
See how it's about, um, oh, about a quarter of an inch wide,
would you agree?
And it has an irregular sort of edge.
You filled the radiator, I take it?
Yeah.
How did you get that injury?
I...I got it when I was fiddling around with some wires
down on the alternator.
-It's... -When?
When I was at home.
I was topping up the water when I was at home.
I didn't really feel it at first 'cause it was so quick.
But, I mean, that's a fairly deep...
How are you saying it occurred?
Well, the fan spins this way,
so if I'm standing at the front of the car...
WILSON: Yeah.
Like here. Fan spins that way.
-The alternator sits there. -Yeah.
And there's some wires running down underneath.
WILSON: If we just show up your right thumb,
just round to the camera here...
..see that...that cut there?
-You have a look at it. -Yeah.
WILSON: It's a straight, long cut.
DENYER: Yeah.
WILSON: And it's probably, what, about an...
What would you say?
Two inches long?
Deep at the top?
How did you do that?
I think I did it when I was sharpening a knife at home.
-Sharpening a knife at home? -Yeah.
A Wiltshire.
See, you've got another... another, um...
..another cut just to the... just near it.
(EERIE SOUNDSCAPE)
WILSON: You see what I mean?
It's... See, it's...it's...
They appear to me to be fairly recent.
DENYER: Yeah, or a couple of days, I think.
And in...in this case,
um, with Natalie,
it...it was a moment that,
uh, when we did discover the piece of skin,
which is now well documented,
that it was almost a disbelief.
Um, it was in a position, in a place,
where we could've easily missed it.
(EERIE SOUNDSCAPE)
-WILSON: Telling the truth? -DENYER: Yeah!
WILSON: Absolutely telling the truth?
DENYER: Yeah, I'm telling you. I mean...
You couldn't have cut your thumb that way
'cause the sharp edge is underneath.
And again, when I challenge you on that,
I don't think you're telling the truth about that.
Well, I am.
SILVESTER: He sort of looked up at you and stopped
and it was almost the 'gotcha' moment, where...
It was a realisation, certainly from him,
for the first time, I said...
..there was an indication that I didn't believe him.
'Cause the rest of the time, I was,
as I said, non-confrontational,
"tell your story," and no challenge.
But that was a challenge
because that was clearly
a reaction to a lie.
And he knew it and I knew it at that moment.
It required a high level of skill
to keep that process going
and slowly introduce doubt
into Denyer's mind.
HUGHES: You can get sidetracked too easily,
so you've gotta keep an open mind
and you've gotta make sure those around you
keep you focused on...
(FLASH BULB POPS)
.."This is just another suspect."
Look, it was interesting to see the mechanics.
You know, it's, um, one of those things.
Because we were doing the interview
at the Frankston Police Station,
and we'd all be out in the corridor looking at the monitor.
Didn't ask for a solicitor.
Was happy to answer questions.
Um, and as it went along,
uh, he put himself at every scene.
And, significantly, when Rod asked him
about the injuries to his hand, had an answer for that.
What was his car doing there? He was looking for water.
Car overheated.
"I injured my hand on a fan belt."
Had an answer for everything. Went on and on.
Um, it was really one of those times where, uh...
..that you really felt like that we did a job
and we did an important job
and it was just an incredible relief
to actually have someone in custody
that they really believed that was him.
(UNSETTLING MUSIC)
WILSON: Do you recall...
..the, um...
..another murder prior to...
Yeah, I read...
..Natalie Russell being found today?
-Debbie Fream? -Yeah.
Yeah, I...
(GRIM MUSIC)
That caused a lot of publicity.
WILSON: Right.
(TAPE REWINDS)
That caused a lot of publicity.
I know how they died.
-How did they die? -Two of them died.
-Well... -Who?
Elizabeth Stevens had her throat cut.
And the other girl, Debbie Fream,
had multiple stab wounds, so...
..to her body and upper body up here.
-How do you know that? -Oh, I heard it on the telly.
(POIGNANT MUSIC)
BEZZINA: And the whole process and relationships start with...
..with families of the deceased people
and the relationships you build with them.
And you sit with them in the court
two years, three years later.
Then you sit with them in the inquest.
For them, the world changed.
It could never be, for many of them,
the safe place that it had previously been.
(POIGNANT CHORAL MUSIC)
You indicated with your hand multiple stab wounds
and you stabbed towards your neck here.
Yeah, oh, I said the neck, upper body.
I mean, this is your upper body here, isn't it?
-WILSON: Right. -I mean...
Could've been just here, though.
Could've been just in the shoulder. Might... You know.
It might've been in the back of the neck.
-You indicated right here. -Don't know.
Well, why did you indicate that area?
I was just pointing to that area, that's all.
Well, why did you point to that area?
(LAUGHS NERVOUSLY) I don't know. Just...
SILVESTER: Serial killers, police and psychologists say,
travel in their own orbit.
What else do you know about it?
What motivates them varies from case to case.
But what they share is a lack of remorse.
SILVESTER: How do you do that?
Um, you've seen...
..the bodies of the victims.
You've seen the extreme trauma
of the relatives.
And you have this person telling you these things matter-of-fact
and you can't...
Do you feel any emotion or...
Um, the...the only emotion that I feel
is that the endgame is the only thing that matters.
Getting this guy to court, getting him convicted,
getting him off the streets
is the only goal we have.
Just...Mr Wilson asked you
before just in relation to the injuries
and you...you mentioned some injuries on Debbie Fream.
-Is that correct? -Mmm.
-That you read in the paper? -Yeah.
What other injuries did you read about,
apart from the multiple stab wounds?
That was all.
If we were to blow that investigation
because we felt frustrated
or did something that, you know...that would jeopardise
that in any way,
then...then you couldn't live with yourself.
Any other injuries that you were told about or you read about?
Oh, yeah, about the... noughts and crosses, yeah.
Or anything else in relation to the other girl?
-The Stevens girl? -Nah.
So, you know, you are playing a bit of a game.
You are... you feel sadness and...
..you know, especially for the families.
But at the end of the day, it's all about getting him convicted.
And if it means being his best friend,
then that's what you do.
Do you know what day it was when she allegedly went missing?
Thursday night, wasn't it? Yeah, Thursday night.
Do you know what date that was? Do you know what the...
No, I don't remember what date it was.
If I told you that she went missing
on a Thursday night on 8th July...
8th, yeah. You told me that earlier. 8th.
Do you...
Are you able to tell me
your movements on that night?
Yep.
Uh...
I was up at my brother's place during the day.
2:30 or something, between 2:30 and 3:30.
I was there for a while.
So you were up at your brother's place? This is on the Thursday?
-Mm. -Yeah?
Well, that day I was...
The only thing I remember about that day
is I was out the front of my place having a cigarette...
SILVESTER: This lack of guilt means they can plan
each crime without emotion
and conceal their double life from plain sight.
To their few associates, they may seem strange,
but hardly capable of cold-blooded murder.
You know, we're talking six weeks ago
and he remembered that he'd got on the bus
and he remembered that he'd gone to his mother-in-law's...
..or his girlfriend's mother's for dinner that night.
You know, he remembered such detail that it...
You know, it beggared belief.
If we look at the, um...
These three particular people
that have been murdered, Paul,
yesterday your car was parked opposite the location
where the body of Natalie Russell was found
and you were in the vicinity around the time.
(LEAVES RUSTLE)
Oh, I don't know if I was in the vicinity.
Well, OK, and I'll withdraw that.
You were certainly in the area
of where her body was discovered.
Yeah.
On the night that Debbie Fream disappeared,
you walked over to Kananook railway station,
missed the train and walked back.
Are you saying that is the only night
you missed the train to pick Sharon up?
I've missed it a couple of times before that.
Wherever you went,
people were talking about it in conversation.
You'd be standing in a coffee shop waiting for a coffee
and someone would be talking about Paul Denyer or his arrest.
And on the night...
..Elizabeth Stevens disappeared,
you walked in a very close proximity to Lloyd Park
on your way to pick up this battery?
Mm-hm.
Do you think that's fairly coincidental?
Yeah, it is.
-All the circumstances? -Yeah.
Why did you pick a storm
to go for a two-hour walk to have a look at a battery?
I don't know. I just felt like walking up there that night.
Well, I suggest to you that's a lie.
-What do you say to that? -I don't reckon it's a lie.
I suggest to you you did not
go to your parents' place that night.
I did.
Have you ever carried a knife?
I've carried a knife a couple of times
when I've walked down to meet my girlfriend
at night at the station.
Why did you carry a knife?
'Cause we had a bit of trouble
with some local kids down in Lloyd Park.
What sort of knife were you carrying?
A Swiss... Like a Swiss Army knife with a corkscrew on it.
Uh, red handle.
And where would you carry that?
Oh, down me sock.
-Down in your sock? -Mm.
Why not in your pocket?
Oh, 'cause I had me keys and me smokes in me pocket
and it's too bulgy.
-So you put it in your sock? -Yeah.
Any other knives you've carried on you?
No, not that I can recall.
Well, can you think about that?
WILSON: His level of offending
had started when he was quite young.
I think he had issues in his childhood
with his younger siblings.
He'd ripped the throats out of a number of their toys.
That had progressed to killing...
..cutting the throats of rabbits,
to cutting the throats of goats,
to stalking people,
to...to approaching people in supermarkets with knives,
to his attempt to abduct someone...
..to killing.
And they do so without any apparent remorse
and it seems to help them
get a sense of control over their environment,
which they seek
and, of course, that later manifests itself
in terrible ways.
The night that you walked to Kananook railway station,
the night that Debbie Fream disappeared,
were you armed with a knife that night?
-No, no. -Why not?
Oh, just forgot to take it with me before I left.
Or I forgot to remember to take it or something. I don't know.
WILSON: But you were going to the railway station
on your own at night.
Mm.
WILSON: But you didn't that night?
-DENYER: I didn't. -You forgot?
I just didn't think of taking it. That's all.
(THUNDER RUMBLES)
(THUNDER CRACKS)
Are you responsible for the deaths of any of these women?
No.
Interestingly enough, when you see the interview,
we have to get permission
to do what we call a forensic procedure,
and that permission was asked for,
that we wanted a hair, blood sample, medical examination,
and hadn't we got his permission,
we'd have to then sit down, do a 15-, 20-, 30-page affidavit
to show to a magistrate or judge
that he was a significant suspect.
But we didn't have to go down that path.
Alright, Paul, do you agree the time is now 12:40am?
Yes.
Now, um...
..you realise that you are not obliged to say or do anything
unless you wish to, but whatever you do say...
And they were just talking casually,
waiting, biding time
until the medical doctor arrived
to take blood samples and other, um...
..medical examinations.
Again, you're not obliged to give a sample of your hair
as has been explained to you
in relation to your blood and fingerprints.
Um, will you give us a sample of your hair?
-Yeah. -Alright, then.
And, um, I was praying.
My prayers were in my mind, under my breath,
for the truth to come out.
That's what the community wanted. That's what was right.
And mid-sentence, between the detective and, um...
..himself,
he just turned to face me.
He says, "That man there gets in my head,"
like, harsh tone.
Demeanour had changed.
Wasn't that calm, collected,
devoid-of-emotion Paul Denyer you see in the interview.
It was the only time that I felt
that you actually got to see
the evil that the girls had experienced.
SILVESTER: It took Wilson more than 1,500 questions
to break Denyer's story.
The breakthrough came at 4am,
37 hours after his latest and final murder.
I believe the Homicide squad detectives left the room,
getting him a coffee.
He said, "I did it."
I said, "Did what?"
"I committed the murders. I committed all three."
I did wear a crucifix
and, um, he must have seen that.
I said, "OK, hold that thought,"
took him back into the room
and, um, a Homicide squad detective was nearby.
I said, "He's admitted the offences,"
and they said, "Stay there. Don't move.
"Shut the door," and they disappeared.
Then someone came back down
and said, "Darren, you're now doing the interview,"
and I went, "OK."
You told Detective O'Loughlin
that you were responsible for the murders
of the three women.
Is that correct?
Before we go any further, um, Paul...
RANKIN: Young Darren O'Loughlin, he walked into the muster room
and he was ashen
and he looked out the window
and I remember looking at him and thinking,
you know, "He's really... He's had a tough day."
It was very, very difficult
sitting through what he just sat through
and you could see it in his face.
He was just very quiet.
I held her hand to make it look like...
..you know, a couple, I suppose,
so we wouldn't arouse any suspicion.
We walked past two people on the footpath,
a guy and a girl, and they just didn't take any notice.
She didn't even scream out or anything?
No.
(THUNDER RUMBLES)
I threw her on the ground
and stuck my foot over her neck.
Right. Why did you do that?
-Oh, to finish it off. -Right.
As...as a policeman, you...
..are not shocked by too many things
because, unfortunately, you see the worst of human behaviour,
you've, unfortunately, gone to some horrific crime scenes.
So, um...
But there were moments in that interview
that certainly sat me back in my seat,
and...and I felt all of us were in that position
in the way he described some of the ways he murdered a woman.
Um...
Just wanted to take a life
because I felt my life had been taken many times.
By whom?
I think that there is considerable evidence about him
that there may be, um, a pattern
that you see in a lot of serial killers
of a traumatic background.
There wasn't a lot of evidence
and he hasn't, as I understand, talked very much about it,
but there's enough for me to suspect
that he had a traumatic upbringing
and that many of the things that happened to him
sowed the seeds of what happened later on.
DENYER: I broke into her place and killed all of her cats.
WILSON: Why'd you do that for?
DENYER: I went there to kill her,
but she wasn't home.
You went to Donna's flat on Claude Street to kill her?
-Yeah. -And she wasn't home?
No, she wasn't home.
So you broke in and... What did you do?
I killed her cats.
-How many of them? -Three.
-How did you kill her cats? -Stabbed them.
When would you say
that you first had a feeling, this aggression,
when you were walking around here?
When did you first start to feel like you had to kill?
I like to think about it this way.
You've got genetics and personality
which load and point the gun
and it's the environment that fires it.
(SOMBRE MUSIC)
I started choking her with my hands
and, uh, she passed out after a while.
BEZZINA: Everything started falling into place.
The...the trauma, the fear that she would've gone through,
it all hits home to you.
DENYER: The blade broke off.
WILSON: Where would the blade be?
DENYER: In the same spot.
WILSON: Did you break the blade off?
DENYER: Well, it bent when I was stabbing her.
The blade went, "Zoom!"
And then I broke the rest of it off
and carried it in my pocket
till I got to there when I dumped it.
Which side of the road were you on when you dumped it?
-(SPEAKS INDISTINCTLY) -There.
(KNOCK AT DOOR)
Can you just get that? Thank you.
Indicate for us.
The blade's about that long. The handle's about that long.
It's a folding blade.
-Oh, yeah, like a folding knife? -Mm, a pocket knife.
SILVESTER: Elizabeth Stevens was 10 houses from home
when Denyer dragged her down a side street
and into a park to die.
WILSON: Were you angry?
Happy. Sad. Angry.
Many things.
Mixed sort of emotions at the time? Yeah.
Did... (COUGHS)
There was no emotion or no remorse or no regret.
It was just... It was chilling.
I told her to shut up or else I'd blow her head off.
Yeah.
Told her to kiss the end of the gun. (SCOFFS)
-Did she do that? -No.
Did you feel any sexual urge towards her...
..at any stage?
I did when I saw her walking,
but when I grabbed her, it cut off.
It cut off? Alright.
Just... (CLICKS TONGUE)
I grabbed her neck and pushed it up like that.
Three or four.
Did you ever strike her in any way?
-Punch her or anything? -I might have.
You may have?
It was an astonishing interview.
Um...
I've never seen an offender
who's committed such serious offences
not downplay in any way the dreadful things that he did.
Most of your classic psychopaths
have no remorse and they have no empathy.
What they love is attention.
So this is almost like, um,
a boastful, triumphant moment.
"Look, I'm important.
"I'm successful in what it is that I set out to do.
"Give me some units of recognition."
-And... -Beg your pardon?
I hate 'em.
Those particular girls or women in general?
It just wasn't...
Look, the murder wasn't normal.
The...the crime wasn't normal.
It was abhorrent in every sense.
But the way he described to take a life
really sat me back in my seat.
(MUTED AUDIO)
Like, every day, it was just going up, boiling up
till I got to that stage.
Was that the same night as the Deborah Fream incident?
A couple of hours before, something like that.
Right. What were you armed with at that stage?
Knife, bit of rope.
I mean, that bit of cord, strap.
And, uh, a gun.
WILSON: And what happened?
(SIGHS) I walked up behind her,
grabbed her with me left hand around her mouth.
WILSON: Mm-hm.
Stuck the gun on her head here.
Mm-hm.
And, um...
..she started talking Spanish or something.
And, um, I spoke back in Spanish.
Do you speak Spanish?
-No, only a few words. -Oh, yeah.
-Um... -What did you say back to her?
'Pistola'. Pistol.
Right. OK.
And, um, she screamed a bit
and then bit me on the finger here.
Oh, right.
Um...
I wrestled her. She ran out on the road, but no-one stopped.
I grabbed her by the hair
and dragged her back towards the park
and, um, I said,
"Shut up or I'll blow your fuckin' head off."
Right.
And she said, "OK, OK,"
or, "Sí, sí," in Spanish or something.
And then...
(CHUCKLES) And then she stood up
and went against her word
and ran out on the road again
and I just took off into the park.
And Denyer was determined that night
and had a strong urge to kill that night
and she was a very lucky girl to get away.
Sometime after that, there was a second death
of a girl by the name of Deborah Fream.
Can you relate to me how that came about?
While she was in the milk bar I walked to the car
and, um...and checked the driver's door - it was unlocked.
Right.
So I opened the door, put my hand through
and unlocked the back door.
Right.
Then I hopped in the car
and crouched down behind the seat
and pulled out the gun that I had.
(EERIE MUSIC)
I startled her just as she was doing that turn
and she kept going straight into the wall of the milk bar.
I told her to, you know, shut up
or I'd blow her head off and all of that shit.
(SOMBRE MUSIC)
WILSON: What did you do then?
Then I was gonna strangle her,
but I didn't want her to see the cord go over first.
Were you behind her at this point?
Yeah, standing behind her.
RANKIN: Denyer just, um...
..just made a very frank confession
and as horrifying as it was to hear, um,
what he told us, of course,
was supported by all the evidence
that had been recovered at the crime scenes.
WILSON: What are you looking for?
Oh, just looking at the tread.
Why's that?
Uh...
I melted them...melted them down
so you wouldn't be able to trace my shoes.
I'm assuming that he would have quite disordered thinking
and he would almost lose contact with reality sometime.
So a lot of the things that he thought,
a lot of the things that he did
make absolutely no sense to us.
What you have to understand
is that there are delusions and there are hallucinations.
Delusions are odd beliefs, fixed beliefs
which bear no resemblance to reality.
So a lot of the things that they do
might make sense to them,
but it makes no sense to us at the time.
How did you feel after it?
Like the temperature gauge was coming down.
In here.
What do you mean?
I was going up to boiling point
and then afterwards it just came down
till it was stopped and level and then climbed up again.
You're referring to what type of feeling?
Hate, anger.
He was officially charged
with the murders and the attempted abduction.
And the elation I couldn't explain.
Um, we'd stitched it up.
(FLASH WHIRRS)
(BULB POPS)
(MOURNFUL MUSIC)
SILVESTER: As he would later tell police,
"I've always wanted to kill since I was 14.
"I've been stalking women since I was 17,
"waiting for that opportunity,
"waiting for the sign."
We all decided to go to the pub at about 7:00 in the morning.
I think we had one beer.
WILSON: That's the green jacket
you were wearing on the night of...
DENYER: Yeah, Elizabeth Stevens.
Elizabeth Stevens. The green army jacket?
DENYER: Yeah.
-O'LOUGHLIN: This one? -DENYER: That's the one.
50 days straight without a break
'cause we knew the pressure was on
and we had to have answers for the community.
They were looking to us. We can't look behind us.
It was us. The buck stops with us.
We had to stop the killing.
The...the damage continues.
It's been my experience
that, um, marriages break up,
people grieve in very different ways
and they...they can't
ever forget or come to terms.
The notion of closure is really...
..is really totally irrelevant in these areas.
(BLOWS)
The way you operate it...
-(BANG) -And that just shoots a...
-It shoots a... -A ball bearing or something?
Yeah, that's got a hole in it.
Was that the weapon you used to, um...
When you first approached Elizabeth Stevens?
Yeah, that's...that's the one.
And the same with Deborah Fream?
Yep.
Same as the woman at Seaford railway station?
Yep.
The knife that was used to, uh...
..you used on Debbie Fream, you said you put into...
-In the ceiling up there. -Into the ceiling up there?
So if you can just move over and indicate that.
-There. -Was it there or that one?
That one and I pushed it across with a bit of wire.
So it's actually behind...
-It's in the middle there. -Right.
When were you in this jumper, sorry?
-Uh... -The night of Debbie Fream?
Debbie Fream. Yeah, that's the one.
OK.
Alright.
RANKIN: The relief when he was apprehended
was just...was just incredible.
I don't think there's been too many criminals
in the history of Victoria...
..that have terrified a community like Paul Denyer did.
(MOURNFUL MUSIC)
WILSON: And Paul Denyer would later say in the interview
that as he had finished murdering Natalie Russell,
he was walking back to the car
and he saw the police at the vehicle...
..and he put his bloodstained hands into his pocket
and walked the other way.
(EERIE MUSIC)
SILVESTER: If police hadn't logged the car at the time,
Denyer would not have been placed at the crime scene
and would have been free to kill again.
Sometimes it's the little things.
And you said something about the knife
used to...on Natalie Russell?
Yeah, I left it in there.
WILSON: Alright, I believe... I believe the knife's
been collected out of there and has been taken by Forensics.
-But you put it in there... -Yeah, I left it in there.
-..at some stage on the Friday? -Yeah.
Just located the handle of the, um...
Just put it up here and I'll just...
That's the one you made?
DENYER: Yeah, that's kind of... That's the thickest.
-And was that taped with tape? -Yeah.
And you just got that from down on the ground there?
Yeah.
-This is the grey jumper? -Yep.
-When did you have this one on? -Yesterday.
Yesterday.
Did this have blood on it at some stage?
-Yeah, it would have. -OK.
And, sure, you can see a monster
in the way he cold-heartedly
and without pity
provided admissions to those murders.
But as I said before, the rage was suppressed,
the anger was suppressed.
Um, in no way, shape or form
I felt that you saw
the characteristics of the viciousness,
the violent, abhorrent crimes
that was committed against those women.
-You took her through this hole? -Yeah.
Right, and, uh...
I dragged her through here.
But I was determined not to become...defeated by it.
I'd made that decision to overcome it and move forward,
but, you know, in saying that, it's, uh...
..it's just as hard for me now to talk about this
as it was 30 years ago.
You know, you sort of think that it gets easier, but it doesn't.
You just learn to deal with it.
Um...
But, you know, it hurts still.
WILSON: The scene where he killed Natalie Russell,
he had other lairs cut into the golf course,
into the tea-tree area,
and one of those was where he buried Deborah Fream's purse
with her ID in it, just like a trophy.
(INDISTINCT CHATTER)
Eventually he found it and he pulled the purse out
and he pulled the licence out, "Deborah Fream!"
WILSON: So that's the location where you buried the purse?
-DENYER: Yeah. -And who's that purse belong to?
Debbie Fream. Her ID is buried around here somewhere.
Is her ID not in the purse?
You burnt them, did you?
-Did you burn those? -Yeah.
-Where did you burn those? -Here.
Put them in.
DENYER: That's it.
(SPEAKS INDISTINCTLY)
SILVESTER: There are certain facts about Denyer's crimes
that no matter how hard you try, you just can't forget.
How he walked on the grass so his footsteps would be silenced
as he stalked Elizabeth Stevens.
How he held the terrified girl's hand
as if they were boyfriend and girlfriend
in some obscene pantomime.
How he crept into the back seat of Debbie Fream's car,
then sprung up so quickly
she lost control while performing a U-turn
and clipped into the side of a building,
and she drove head-on at another car
to try and raise the alarm
only for Denyer to wrestle the wheel from her.
How he made her drive through countless streets in the dark
until he found his preferred murder site.
How he cut two lairs on the track between golf courses
and crouched in his car, waiting for a woman,
any woman, to walk past.
How when he grabbed Natalie Russell,
she must have known it was the serial killer
and how she begged for her life.
And how Denyer would later tell police
he found that disgusting.
(SOMBRE MUSIC)
Denyer, who had terrorised Frankston for weeks,
left in a cage, secured in handcuffs.
The killing spree was over.
MAN: Die, you scumbag!
(PEOPLE SHOUT INDISTINCTLY)
(MOURNFUL MUSIC)
SILVESTER: Denyer hunted his victims.
He showed them no mercy.
He did his crimes beyond reasonable doubt.
SILVESTER: You sentenced Denyer to life, no minimum?
-Yes, I did. -And...?
Well, the Court of Appeal said that that was, uh...
..excessive in the circumstances.
I remember when he was sentencing Denyer
his voice broke
and, um, I think when...
That was unusual for me certainly,
sitting in the Supreme Court
and seeing a judge displaying such emotion
sentencing a criminal.
And I thought about who the real victims were.
Of course there were the young women who were killed
and their families and those around their families
and those who'd been involved
in...in this hunt for the killer.
But there were also many thousands
of women and others out there
who had for a period of time lived with this fear.
He...he made a comment that has stuck with me for years
and it was along the lines of,
"You are the reason
"people quicken their step on the way home
"and the reason a parent looks anxiously at the clock
"because their child is running late."
LIMBRICK: Uh, when he was reading out
the details of what happened,
that was such a shock to me
that, um, I was totally unprepared for it
and, yeah, I sort of...
I think I blacked out a bit and, um, left.
Precedent dictates that if a person pleads guilty,
they must get a discount.
I say change precedent. Change it.
He got natural life for each one for 30 years minimum.
Now next year he's up for parole.
REPORTER: For the family and friends of Natalie Russell,
this is the latest painful step
in a journey that started 28 years ago.
It's just something you don't get over. It's...
You learn to get out of bed every morning
and put one foot in front of the other,
but it's there in front of you all the time.
She was a vibrant, happy, intelligent girl
and the places she would've gone...
She was my girlfriend.
What we are asking the government to do...
..is to make sure that Paul Denyer stays locked up forever.
Yeah, there's not a woman in Frankston
that doesn't check her back seat before she gets in the car.
The only...the only thing that gave us any consolation
was the fact that he was locked up
and couldn't do this to any other family.
And guess what.
The government now have to legislate...
And I hope that they do.
They need to legislate to keep this animal
in jail where he belongs
because he's never gonna be fixed,
he's programmed that way,
and we need to keep the community safe.
SILVESTER: While in prison,
Denyer claimed he was transitioning
and for a period of time
wanted to be referred to as 'Paula'.
At one point, he suggested his crimes
were due to the fact that he hated women
because he wanted to be one.
All of this is totally irrelevant to what he did.
It's not an excuse. It's not a reason.
He was fully aware of what he was doing.
He went out to murder.
Now in prison,
he's returned to 'Paul' Denyer.
If ever I've seen a person...
..who doesn't deserve freedom, it's Paul Denyer.
He'll never...
..he'll never not be a risk to the community.
Never.
We have to be sure 100%
that Paul Charles Denyer is no longer a risk to women.
No-one can give that guarantee.
The conclusion is inevitable.
Denyer must remain in prison
until he is so infirmed he can't be a risk
or he's dead -
the very sentence Frank Vincent gave him in the first place.