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Downloaded from
YTS.MX

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- I have, like,

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some notes on my leaving
speech at Instagram.

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Official YIFY movies site:
YTS.MX

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It says,
"I joined three years ago

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"as the first international
employee based out of London.

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"I couldn't imagine
leaving our community

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"in better hands.

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"I've met
so many amazing people

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"and had the chance
to change lives.

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"Learning to laugh
at yourself, humility,

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"and always thank
the little people."

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Kind of crazy that you have
all these things in here,

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you know,
like a trip down memory lane.

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My name is Hannah Ray.

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I worked at Instagram
as a community manager

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for Europe,
Middle East and Africa.

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I'm Greg Hochmuth.

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I was one of the first
engineers at Instagram.

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My name is Andy Warr.

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I was
the Head of Research there.

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My name is Chris Messina.

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And I am best known

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for inventing the hashtag.

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It's a little hard to see,

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but I've got
a little hashtag tattoo

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right here on my wrist.

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So...yeah.

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Instagram was this place

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where you posted
your best self,

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the digital representation
of you

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that you wanted to portray
to your friends.

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Now follower counts have like
a certain social currency.

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Maybe we weren't quite aware

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that we were kind of
kingmaking in that way.

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I think comes a point

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when you just aren't in
control of it anymore.

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And then it, like,
took on a life of its own.

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- Facebook's Instagram app...

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..can be toxic
for teenagers...

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..and Facebook knows it.

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Reporter: She's the former
Facebook employee

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turned whistleblower,

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whose revelations
are reverberating

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around the world.

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- "The company's leadership

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"knows how to make Facebook
and Instagram safer.

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"They have put their
astronomical profits

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"before people."

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My name is Frances Haugen.

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We're facing one of the
fundamental conflicts

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of our civilization -

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which is are we going
to let algorithms rule us,

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or will people rule
algorithms?

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How do
we increase engagement,

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how do we increase
time spent?

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I didn't feel like
that was the best use

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of people's time.

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We don't fully understand
what the consequences

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of this period will be.

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This is just the beginning.

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And the thing that
I think young people see,

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that maybe people a little
bit older than them don't,

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is how intense
the problems are,

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because teenagers
are killing themselves

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because of Instagram.

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This challenge of, like,

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making Instagram
feel less pressurised

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I think is very difficult,
if not impossible.

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Could we predict?

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I don't even know.

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I don't know how to answer
that question, really.

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I'm gonna go with no...?

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- My name is Lauren Black
and I'm an influencer.

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I have 123,000 followers.

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One of my ex-boyfriends'
sisters

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actually bought me a book for
Christmas about blogging,

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and that was when
I started my Instagram.

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I was posting about fashion,
every day,

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like, what I was wearing,

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like,
outfit of the day posts.

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I went full time about
six months after starting.

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I took a massive risk by,
like, leaving uni

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and not having any savings.

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And I just threw everything
that I had into it.

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Hi! Oh!

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- She loves beautiful ladies.
- Aw, thank you.

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I started posting
IGTV videos.

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And that took me from about
30,000 followers

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to over 100,000 followers.

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It was quite a jump,

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it was something that

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I wasn't really mentally
prepared for.

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I was quite anxious
because every day

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I had to then please

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thousands more
people than usual.

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I was on Instagram
all the time,

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like my screentime
was like 13 hours a day.

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It was, like,
from the moment I woke up

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until the moment
I went to sleep.

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I'd literally
just be scrolling.

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And, like, liking other
people's pictures,

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and, like...yeah,
just scrolling.

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- I'm Manish Raghavan.

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I worked for
the Responsible AI team.

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We served to try to help
other teams within Facebook

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better understand
how to build

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and deploy AI responsibly.

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If you want to understand why
Instagram is the way it is,

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you have to understand how
the algorithms have shaped it

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to be that way.

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They are the result
of people's choices.

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- The goal of any
social media company

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is to make sure that
you spend as much time

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on that platform as possible,

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and engage as much
with content

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on that platform as possible.

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Different algorithms underpin
platforms like Instagram.

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It's a way of ordering
things.

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It's a way of saying
yes or no to something.

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What people often think

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about how social media
feed systems work

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is that
they're one algorithm,

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and that somebody sits down
and writes that algorithm

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and says,
"If you have two photos,

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"one of them is a person
and one of them is a cat,

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"people are more
important than cats,

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"so we're gonna rank
the person above the cat."

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But there is no one algorithm

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that is written down
that determines

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the order in which
you see things

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on your Instagram feed,
on your Facebook News Feed

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or on your Google search.

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The crucial thing about
those algorithms

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is that they use hundreds
of machine learning models.

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The way that the hundreds
of machine learning models

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interact with each other

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is determined by
the overarching metric

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that guides the feed
ranking system.

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In Instagram,

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that overriding metric

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that orients
the machine learning models

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is meaningful
social interactions.

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The meaningful bit cannot
just be about the people

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that are close to you,
like friends and family.

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It can be about stuff
that you're interested in.

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Instagram figures out
who is meaningful to you

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and who tends to engage often
with the content you produce.

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They predict whether
you're likely to like a post,

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whether you're likely
to share a post

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or whether you're likely to
comment underneath the post.

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And so interactions from
the people closer to you

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tend to be prioritised
above interactions

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from people
who are further out

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in that network from you.

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- What Instagram
is looking to do

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is keep you engaged
in some way.

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This is slightly different
from asking

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what do you actually
want to see?

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The algorithms are
the most opaque part

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of this whole system.

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You can see
the user behaviour,

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you can see sort of like
the consequences

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of what happens
as a result of being exposed

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to certain content,

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especially over
and over again.

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But we don't necessarily
understand,

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and some of the companies
don't even understand,

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how content is targeted
to different individuals,

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what choices they made
to go down certain paths.

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And that lack of awareness

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is where
we're the most vulnerable.

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I've always had problems
with food

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since I was a teenager.

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I used to collect 'Vogue'

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and all fashion magazines
anyway.

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So, I already was aspiring

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to be model-like.

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When I started this job,

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I didn't realise, like,

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the impact of looking
and comparing myself

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to other people
had on my mental health.

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And my eating disorder
got worse over the years.

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- I think the thing
that's really important

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for people to understand
is how Instagram

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differs from other
social media platforms.

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Tik Tok is about performance.

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It's about doing fun things
with your friends.

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Snapchat is about faces
and augmented reality.

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You know,
it's not actually you.

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It's you with a mask on.

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Facebook's internal research

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says that Instagram
is about bodies

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and about social comparison.

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You know, it's about seeing

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these little windows into
other people's lives

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and comparing, like,

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what is your life
like to theirs?

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The human brain
is not evolved

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to deal with social media.

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It isn't evolved to look
at a screen all day

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and be able to understand,
let's say,

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that the thing that

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you're seeing on the other
side of the screen

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isn't someone's real life.

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- Everyone that I followed on
Instagram then

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would have been probably
like from sizes four to six.

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And that was kind of what
I was trying to achieve.

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- The algorithms are
looking for the content

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that will lure you in.

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These algorithms are always
looking for the rabbit hole

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that you are most
vulnerable to.

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You can start with quite
innocuous interests,

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you know, you can search
for healthy eating.

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These rabbit holes
normalise the idea

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that you should be
extremely thin

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and is it your fault
if you're not.

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- So, I used to see myself

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as bigger than what I was.

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Yeah, it was kind of
unconsciously...

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..it started getting bad.

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I basically just ignored
when I was hungry.

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And when I did eat,

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it would just be
the tiniest amount.

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I woke up
and I was so busy with work

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that I just put it off
for as long as possible.

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And I feel like
that's kind of like

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the sense of self harm

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of having an eating disorder.

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It's just basically starving
yourself.

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When I look back on
pictures now,

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you can clearly see
that I was ill.

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But when I was in
the middle of it all

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I just didn't really know.

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I think I thought
if I changed myself

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then I would
gain more followers

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and get all these
new opportunities.

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I just created this,

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like, like, vision in my mind
that if I went and did this

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then this would be
the outcome.

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And it just...it was a lie.

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- There were things
that we were aware of

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that we would feed back.

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The hashtag 'thinspo'
has just popped up

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and it should probably
be banned.

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So,
those things would come up

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and then we'd kind of jump
on them

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and quickly figure out, like,

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the best policy
to do that.

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But you have to remember,
that's alongside, like,

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loads of other kind of
firefighting issues

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that were popping up.

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I mean, daily,

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there were, like,
new things coming up

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that I think are just part
of, like, just how huge

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the platform was growing
so quickly.

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At the time I joined,

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Instagram had celebrated
its third birthday.

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So, I remember that month
I was in California training.

260
00:11:27,379 --> 00:11:31,000
And the whole sky was pink.

261
00:11:31,103 --> 00:11:35,344
And it just felt like being
in an Instagram filter.

262
00:11:35,448 --> 00:11:37,965
You know, and then the cab

263
00:11:38,068 --> 00:11:41,482
was going down places
like Valencia and Dogpatch,

264
00:11:41,586 --> 00:11:43,551
and those were names
of filters,

265
00:11:43,655 --> 00:11:44,586
you know, on Instagram.

266
00:11:44,689 --> 00:11:47,793
So, I really felt like
I'd somehow descended into,

267
00:11:47,896 --> 00:11:50,379
you know,
the world of Instagram.

268
00:11:52,275 --> 00:11:55,724
- At the time, we honestly
didn't really have a clue

269
00:11:55,827 --> 00:11:57,827
how big it was,
how much it was growing.

270
00:11:57,931 --> 00:11:59,827
I would go to many concerts.

271
00:11:59,931 --> 00:12:01,827
As people were taking photos

272
00:12:01,931 --> 00:12:03,827
of their time at the show,

273
00:12:03,931 --> 00:12:06,551
I would look over and I would
see on their phone,

274
00:12:06,655 --> 00:12:09,379
"Oh, like, that's Instagram,
that's the filter screen."

275
00:12:09,482 --> 00:12:13,758
- So, I was friends with
the creators of Instagram.

276
00:12:13,862 --> 00:12:19,034
I ended up being invited
to a beta of this product.

277
00:12:19,137 --> 00:12:21,793
We were certainly
plenty naive,

278
00:12:21,896 --> 00:12:23,655
and I think we had ideas

279
00:12:23,758 --> 00:12:25,241
about the world
and about how technology

280
00:12:25,344 --> 00:12:26,517
could improve the world.

281
00:12:26,620 --> 00:12:27,482
Priorities were basically,
like,

282
00:12:27,586 --> 00:12:29,172
make a very simple app

283
00:12:29,275 --> 00:12:32,172
whose main goal is to help
you share a photo,

284
00:12:32,275 --> 00:12:33,655
make it look beautiful.

285
00:12:33,758 --> 00:12:35,413
It did create
this very nice feedback loop

286
00:12:35,517 --> 00:12:36,413
people really enjoyed.

287
00:12:36,517 --> 00:12:37,896
I post the photo,
I get these likes.

288
00:12:38,758 --> 00:12:39,896
- My name is Cole Rise,

289
00:12:40,000 --> 00:12:42,413
and I designed
the original icon

290
00:12:42,517 --> 00:12:44,724
and seven of the filters.

291
00:12:44,827 --> 00:12:47,862
Instagram's brand
was about covering

292
00:12:47,965 --> 00:12:50,172
how bad the cameras were
in the phones of the day.

293
00:12:50,275 --> 00:12:52,931
They were very pixely.

294
00:12:53,034 --> 00:12:55,379
So how do you make
a great photo?

295
00:12:55,482 --> 00:12:57,172
You put a nice,
heavy filter on it

296
00:12:57,275 --> 00:12:58,206
that makes it something else.

297
00:12:58,310 --> 00:13:00,620
It's not supposed to be
true to life.

298
00:13:00,724 --> 00:13:01,931
There was probably, like,

299
00:13:02,034 --> 00:13:04,965
a certain je ne sais quoi
about Instagram

300
00:13:05,068 --> 00:13:06,517
that we would call, like,

301
00:13:06,620 --> 00:13:08,103
the Instagrammy-ness.

302
00:13:08,206 --> 00:13:11,206
The vibe that we had tried
to cultivate and create

303
00:13:11,310 --> 00:13:12,206
on the community team.

304
00:13:12,310 --> 00:13:13,931
I found these postcards.

305
00:13:14,034 --> 00:13:15,103
These are, like...

306
00:13:16,551 --> 00:13:18,206
..the brand values that
we had at the time.

307
00:13:18,310 --> 00:13:19,931
Simplicity matters,

308
00:13:20,034 --> 00:13:23,586
and inspire creativity,

309
00:13:23,689 --> 00:13:26,689
and, my favourite,

310
00:13:26,793 --> 00:13:28,310
community first.

311
00:13:28,413 --> 00:13:31,137
I still say that a lot today,
actually.

312
00:13:31,241 --> 00:13:34,000
- I think so many
of the essence

313
00:13:34,103 --> 00:13:36,379
of how we built the product
were around, like,

314
00:13:36,482 --> 00:13:38,137
what's going to be good
for a person?

315
00:13:38,241 --> 00:13:39,655
Like, what's the next
most important thing

316
00:13:39,758 --> 00:13:40,758
that we can work on

317
00:13:40,862 --> 00:13:43,482
that's going to make
someone's life better?

318
00:13:43,586 --> 00:13:46,724
The biggest team, actually,
at least in my mind,

319
00:13:46,827 --> 00:13:47,793
was the community team,

320
00:13:47,896 --> 00:13:50,137
who were all focused
on looking

321
00:13:50,241 --> 00:13:51,551
at what's happening
on Instagram,

322
00:13:51,655 --> 00:13:53,241
engaging with active users,

323
00:13:53,344 --> 00:13:54,551
starting conversations,

324
00:13:54,655 --> 00:13:55,827
highlighting interesting
users,

325
00:13:55,931 --> 00:13:57,793
picking who was featured
and things like that.

326
00:13:57,896 --> 00:13:59,344
We had a number
of different ways

327
00:13:59,448 --> 00:14:01,275
that we would feature people.

328
00:14:01,379 --> 00:14:03,034
The main Instagram account,

329
00:14:03,137 --> 00:14:05,379
which was just @Instagram.

330
00:14:05,482 --> 00:14:06,551
It was, like,
the most followed account

331
00:14:06,655 --> 00:14:07,655
in the world.

332
00:14:07,758 --> 00:14:09,000
I think it still
has a bigger circulation

333
00:14:09,103 --> 00:14:10,034
than 'The New York Times'.

334
00:14:10,137 --> 00:14:13,379
Like, it was a hugely kind of
impactful real estate

335
00:14:13,482 --> 00:14:15,206
to share someone's story.

336
00:14:15,310 --> 00:14:16,517
And whenever we would share

337
00:14:16,620 --> 00:14:17,724
someone's story on there,

338
00:14:17,827 --> 00:14:19,137
quite often, you would see

339
00:14:19,241 --> 00:14:20,551
their kind of follower count

340
00:14:20,655 --> 00:14:23,965
and everything blow up
for them.

341
00:14:24,068 --> 00:14:26,241
It felt kind of worrying,
you know,

342
00:14:26,344 --> 00:14:30,000
to kind of be making those
editorial decisions.

343
00:14:30,103 --> 00:14:32,620
Partly because of the
huge influence and impact

344
00:14:32,724 --> 00:14:34,206
it could have
on someone's life.

345
00:14:34,310 --> 00:14:36,758
I think we knew we were on,
like,

346
00:14:36,862 --> 00:14:39,068
the cusp of something big
that was happening

347
00:14:39,172 --> 00:14:42,068
and powerful and impactful.

348
00:14:42,172 --> 00:14:45,379
I don't think we were aware,
on the Community Team,

349
00:14:45,482 --> 00:14:49,068
of how big it was gonna get.

350
00:14:49,172 --> 00:14:52,275
- This world that Instagram
had created,

351
00:14:52,379 --> 00:14:55,000
where you could present
your life as more beautiful

352
00:14:55,103 --> 00:14:56,551
and interesting than
it actually was.

353
00:14:56,655 --> 00:14:59,000
Where you could see into

354
00:14:59,103 --> 00:15:02,482
all these really interesting
lives and careers,

355
00:15:02,586 --> 00:15:06,034
and places in the world,
from your phone.

356
00:15:06,137 --> 00:15:08,758
That was so exciting

357
00:15:08,862 --> 00:15:11,344
that it grew so quickly

358
00:15:11,448 --> 00:15:13,586
and caught the attention
of Mark Zuckerberg.

359
00:15:22,241 --> 00:15:23,758
Zuckerberg
wanted to make sure

360
00:15:23,862 --> 00:15:25,413
that he got to Instagram

361
00:15:25,517 --> 00:15:27,448
before
any of his competitors did

362
00:15:27,551 --> 00:15:31,344
and that he made sure
that they joined Facebook.

363
00:15:31,448 --> 00:15:33,793
So he offered them
a billion dollars,

364
00:15:33,896 --> 00:15:36,068
which is more than anyone
had ever paid

365
00:15:36,172 --> 00:15:38,310
for a mobile app before.

366
00:15:38,413 --> 00:15:40,172
- Kevin opens
the conversation and says,

367
00:15:40,275 --> 00:15:42,034
"You know, we've been talking
to Facebook

368
00:15:42,137 --> 00:15:43,689
"over the last few days,

369
00:15:43,793 --> 00:15:46,068
"and they made an offer
to acquire us".

370
00:15:46,172 --> 00:15:48,551
At this moment I think
what goes through my head

371
00:15:48,655 --> 00:15:49,827
and what goes through

372
00:15:49,931 --> 00:15:51,034
everyone else's head,
I believe,

373
00:15:51,137 --> 00:15:52,724
is the next sentence will be,

374
00:15:52,827 --> 00:15:54,310
"And we rejected them".

375
00:15:54,413 --> 00:15:56,206
And then the very next
thing Kevin says is,

376
00:15:56,310 --> 00:15:58,482
"and we accepted
and we signed".

377
00:15:58,586 --> 00:15:59,724
I remember walking back

378
00:15:59,827 --> 00:16:02,379
from that little circle
to our desks again

379
00:16:02,482 --> 00:16:03,965
next to one of my co-workers,

380
00:16:04,068 --> 00:16:05,448
and he just whispers to me,

381
00:16:05,551 --> 00:16:07,655
"This is not how I thought
it was going to end".

382
00:16:07,758 --> 00:16:10,965
And I think
that's what everyone felt.

383
00:16:12,758 --> 00:16:15,448
This idea that, like,
this ride that we're on,

384
00:16:15,551 --> 00:16:17,034
this roller coaster
of being in control

385
00:16:17,137 --> 00:16:18,379
of our own destiny,

386
00:16:18,482 --> 00:16:20,758
growing a small little thing

387
00:16:20,862 --> 00:16:22,344
that we've been
working on our own

388
00:16:22,448 --> 00:16:23,793
was like suddenly over.

389
00:16:23,896 --> 00:16:25,551
Instagram essentially
had to decide,

390
00:16:25,655 --> 00:16:27,965
do we want to go up
against Facebook,

391
00:16:28,068 --> 00:16:29,448
which is this behemoth?

392
00:16:29,551 --> 00:16:32,034
Or is this our time to, one,

393
00:16:32,137 --> 00:16:33,689
get a pretty significant
payout,

394
00:16:33,793 --> 00:16:35,827
and be able to build upon

395
00:16:35,931 --> 00:16:38,896
Facebook's existing
infrastructure, platform,

396
00:16:39,000 --> 00:16:41,137
and then cater to all
of Facebook's users.

397
00:16:41,241 --> 00:16:43,620
But at the time
it was shocking.

398
00:16:43,724 --> 00:16:45,310
It definitely gave me pause

399
00:16:45,413 --> 00:16:47,068
and a moment to be like,
uh...

400
00:16:47,172 --> 00:16:48,344
I don't know
if this is ultimately

401
00:16:48,448 --> 00:16:51,517
going to be the best thing
for this community.

402
00:16:51,620 --> 00:16:54,275
Facebook has tried
over and over and over

403
00:16:54,379 --> 00:16:57,517
to make a product that
will appeal to young people.

404
00:16:57,620 --> 00:17:00,137
They had these labs
that were turning out

405
00:17:00,241 --> 00:17:03,448
new kinds of apps to possibly
create a new hit.

406
00:17:03,551 --> 00:17:05,413
Nothing really worked.

407
00:17:05,517 --> 00:17:07,068
Their main avenue

408
00:17:07,172 --> 00:17:09,310
into the youth audience
is Instagram

409
00:17:09,413 --> 00:17:11,172
and whatever Instagram
can create,

410
00:17:11,275 --> 00:17:14,655
and in order for Facebook
to stay relevant,

411
00:17:14,758 --> 00:17:20,448
Instagram needs to maintain
that...that cache with youth.

412
00:17:20,551 --> 00:17:22,379
There was this
really burning question

413
00:17:22,482 --> 00:17:24,620
from folks
on the Facebook side,

414
00:17:24,724 --> 00:17:26,586
to understand our own growth

415
00:17:26,689 --> 00:17:28,379
in a way that we had
never really been

416
00:17:28,482 --> 00:17:30,793
as eager about
or as specific about.

417
00:17:30,896 --> 00:17:32,551
You know, previously,
success for us meant

418
00:17:32,655 --> 00:17:34,517
that we built a good product,
that, like,

419
00:17:34,620 --> 00:17:37,931
the things we worked on
were doing really well,

420
00:17:38,034 --> 00:17:40,310
that, like, people using them
felt good about them.

421
00:17:40,413 --> 00:17:41,965
Shifting from that mindset

422
00:17:42,068 --> 00:17:45,793
to something where success
is just measured by numbers

423
00:17:45,896 --> 00:17:47,068
in a very plain way.

424
00:17:47,172 --> 00:17:49,689
Over time, that became
much more and more

425
00:17:49,793 --> 00:17:52,275
part of the way things
were done,

426
00:17:52,379 --> 00:17:54,551
things were evaluated,
things were designed.

427
00:18:00,448 --> 00:18:02,965
I definitely noticed a change

428
00:18:03,068 --> 00:18:04,793
when we launched ads,

429
00:18:04,896 --> 00:18:07,965
and when we started
to onboard brands

430
00:18:08,068 --> 00:18:09,275
onto the platform.

431
00:18:09,379 --> 00:18:10,551
Now, looking back,

432
00:18:10,655 --> 00:18:13,586
what I've seen
or what I've realised

433
00:18:13,689 --> 00:18:16,586
is with the launch of ads
and brands on the platform,

434
00:18:16,689 --> 00:18:18,551
this kind of tension
or friction

435
00:18:18,655 --> 00:18:20,517
was created between brands

436
00:18:20,620 --> 00:18:22,758
that were almost trying
to act like individuals,

437
00:18:22,862 --> 00:18:26,724
and individuals that then
start to act like brands.

438
00:18:33,344 --> 00:18:35,000
- When I first started
doing Instagram,

439
00:18:35,103 --> 00:18:36,758
there was no such thing
as influencing.

440
00:18:36,862 --> 00:18:39,068
I come from
a modelling background.

441
00:18:39,172 --> 00:18:41,896
A few years later than that
Instagram came about.

442
00:18:42,000 --> 00:18:43,551
And obviously
you like to take pictures,

443
00:18:43,655 --> 00:18:44,586
it's a picture app.

444
00:18:44,689 --> 00:18:45,931
So, from my modelling
history, I was like,

445
00:18:46,034 --> 00:18:47,103
OK, great, this is for me.

446
00:18:47,206 --> 00:18:49,172
I was very consistent
with Instagram

447
00:18:49,275 --> 00:18:50,379
and I enjoyed it.

448
00:18:50,482 --> 00:18:52,965
Like, you get free meals,
you get to go to restaurants.

449
00:18:53,068 --> 00:18:56,068
I've even got holidays
for promo as they call it.

450
00:18:56,172 --> 00:18:58,448
There's so many Instagram
stylists.

451
00:18:58,551 --> 00:19:00,000
I feel like
unless girls see you working

452
00:19:00,103 --> 00:19:01,172
with a massive influencer...

453
00:19:01,275 --> 00:19:02,275
Stylist:
Don't wanna work with you.

454
00:19:02,379 --> 00:19:03,620
..they don't wanna work
with you

455
00:19:03,724 --> 00:19:05,103
or they don't want
to book your services.

456
00:19:05,206 --> 00:19:06,517
They just want to
go who's popping

457
00:19:06,620 --> 00:19:07,724
because they've gone there.

458
00:19:07,827 --> 00:19:08,827
- I've got some friends
that...

459
00:19:08,931 --> 00:19:10,793
They will go to all these
Instagram people,

460
00:19:10,896 --> 00:19:12,586
and then when the people
mess up their hair,

461
00:19:12,689 --> 00:19:13,724
they will come back to me.

462
00:19:13,827 --> 00:19:14,827
I'm like,
"I'm not doing your hair!"

463
00:19:14,931 --> 00:19:15,827
You better just...

464
00:19:15,931 --> 00:19:17,206
You know
your friend does hair

465
00:19:17,310 --> 00:19:18,758
why didn't you go and meet
your friend before?

466
00:19:18,862 --> 00:19:19,793
Why are you coming to me?

467
00:19:19,896 --> 00:19:20,965
OK, so first of all,

468
00:19:21,068 --> 00:19:23,275
I would like to say
Instagram World is fake.

469
00:19:23,379 --> 00:19:24,517
[laughs]

470
00:19:24,620 --> 00:19:26,275
Instagram's kind of
like a facade.

471
00:19:26,379 --> 00:19:30,344
It's kind of like
made the highlife

472
00:19:30,448 --> 00:19:32,620
look so easily accessible.

473
00:19:32,724 --> 00:19:34,724
At 21,
I'm getting on a private jet.

474
00:19:34,827 --> 00:19:37,448
It's not like that at all.

475
00:19:37,551 --> 00:19:39,689
I remember when people
started getting paid to post,

476
00:19:39,793 --> 00:19:41,310
and that idea

477
00:19:41,413 --> 00:19:44,172
quickly makes what you post
a bit artificial,

478
00:19:44,275 --> 00:19:47,000
where some people are doing,
like, full-on BMW ads

479
00:19:47,103 --> 00:19:49,758
and it's not genuine
to who they are as a person

480
00:19:49,862 --> 00:19:51,103
because I know that person.

481
00:19:51,206 --> 00:19:53,172
They don't drive a BMW.

482
00:19:53,275 --> 00:19:55,482
The core of Instagram,
as I remember,

483
00:19:55,586 --> 00:19:57,827
it was just,
"Here's what's happening."

484
00:19:57,931 --> 00:19:59,965
But if what's happening
is an ad

485
00:20:00,068 --> 00:20:03,137
then there's
an artificiality to it.

486
00:20:05,344 --> 00:20:06,965
Look at bloody COVID-19,

487
00:20:07,068 --> 00:20:09,448
they was paying influencers
to...

488
00:20:09,551 --> 00:20:11,724
Stylist: Yeah, to say that
they're doing it.

489
00:20:11,827 --> 00:20:12,827
[laughs]
They was paying influencers

490
00:20:12,931 --> 00:20:14,241
to promote the vaccine.

491
00:20:14,344 --> 00:20:15,724
What?

492
00:20:15,827 --> 00:20:17,551
Instagram followers
are very important,

493
00:20:17,655 --> 00:20:19,758
especially if you want to be
paid as an influencer.

494
00:20:19,862 --> 00:20:25,655
My long-term goal for how
many followers I want

495
00:20:25,758 --> 00:20:27,137
is probably a billion.

496
00:20:27,241 --> 00:20:28,827
I want a billion followers.

497
00:20:28,931 --> 00:20:31,517
- Now follower counts
have, like,

498
00:20:31,620 --> 00:20:33,344
a certain social currency,

499
00:20:33,448 --> 00:20:36,448
as if it's some kind of
golden ticket

500
00:20:36,551 --> 00:20:39,413
to unlocking the universe.

501
00:20:39,517 --> 00:20:41,068
The more followers we get,

502
00:20:41,172 --> 00:20:43,448
the more comments we get,
the better.

503
00:20:43,551 --> 00:20:45,827
We have also
become growth obsessed,

504
00:20:45,931 --> 00:20:48,827
and it's thanks to Facebook
and Instagram

505
00:20:48,931 --> 00:20:52,000
in the way that they have
let us measure ourselves

506
00:20:52,103 --> 00:20:54,758
that we think that way.

507
00:20:56,241 --> 00:20:58,896
- I decided to get
fake followers.

508
00:20:59,000 --> 00:21:00,482
I can't remember
what the package was.

509
00:21:00,586 --> 00:21:01,689
It wasn't even that much.

510
00:21:01,793 --> 00:21:03,862
I think I paid, like...
Maybe, like, £100.

511
00:21:03,965 --> 00:21:05,413
And it basically was, like,

512
00:21:05,517 --> 00:21:08,137
I got 3,000 likes
on each picture,

513
00:21:08,241 --> 00:21:10,862
and then I think I gained,
like, 10,000 followers,

514
00:21:10,965 --> 00:21:13,206
because it did take me from,
like, 10,000 to 20,000.

515
00:21:13,310 --> 00:21:14,206
But then after that,

516
00:21:14,310 --> 00:21:16,448
it was like why are
all my followers Russian

517
00:21:16,551 --> 00:21:19,034
and why are all these
comments in Russian?

518
00:21:19,137 --> 00:21:20,689
Like, what's going on?

519
00:21:20,793 --> 00:21:22,586
We need to get cracking,

520
00:21:22,689 --> 00:21:24,551
we've got, like, literally
10 minutes - let's go.

521
00:21:31,068 --> 00:21:33,103
- It's not very hard
to get fake followers,

522
00:21:33,206 --> 00:21:35,655
fake likes, etcetera,
on Instagram.

523
00:21:35,758 --> 00:21:37,241
You just, you just need
an internet connection

524
00:21:37,344 --> 00:21:38,689
and a credit card.

525
00:21:38,793 --> 00:21:39,896
I'm Sophie Zhang,

526
00:21:40,000 --> 00:21:41,827
or Zhang Sui Feng
in Mandarin.

527
00:21:41,931 --> 00:21:43,620
I was a data scientist
at Facebook

528
00:21:43,724 --> 00:21:44,793
on what's called

529
00:21:44,896 --> 00:21:45,965
the fake engagement team.

530
00:21:46,068 --> 00:21:48,586
I also conducted work
on Instagram.

531
00:21:50,275 --> 00:21:53,206
Back in late 2019
and early 2020

532
00:21:53,310 --> 00:21:55,068
roughly ten percent
of follows

533
00:21:55,172 --> 00:21:56,931
on Instagram were fake.

534
00:21:57,034 --> 00:21:59,241
This is a very
rough estimate,

535
00:21:59,344 --> 00:22:01,551
but considerably higher
than Facebook.

536
00:22:01,655 --> 00:22:04,034
It creates an environment
of constant doubt

537
00:22:04,137 --> 00:22:06,448
and insecurity
and uncertainty.

538
00:22:08,896 --> 00:22:10,034
- I had to go and block

539
00:22:10,137 --> 00:22:11,827
all these
fake Russian accounts.

540
00:22:11,931 --> 00:22:13,862
Every time they commented
I had to, like, block them.

541
00:22:13,965 --> 00:22:17,034
Lucky I did that
because after I did that,

542
00:22:17,137 --> 00:22:18,379
Instagram had this thing

543
00:22:18,482 --> 00:22:20,034
where they started
shutting down accounts

544
00:22:20,137 --> 00:22:21,620
that had fake followers.

545
00:22:21,724 --> 00:22:23,655
So, you would see, like,
celebrities, for instance.

546
00:22:23,758 --> 00:22:24,724
One of my friends,

547
00:22:24,827 --> 00:22:26,137
their Instagram account
was just, like,

548
00:22:26,241 --> 00:22:27,655
gone the next day,
I was like, what?

549
00:22:27,758 --> 00:22:29,896
I was like, bro,
where's your account?

550
00:22:30,000 --> 00:22:31,310
Let's just do one more.

551
00:22:31,413 --> 00:22:32,758
And he was like,
"Oh, I got hacked",

552
00:22:32,862 --> 00:22:33,758
and everyone knew, no,

553
00:22:33,862 --> 00:22:34,862
Instagram's going around

554
00:22:34,965 --> 00:22:35,965
shutting around
fake accounts.

555
00:22:36,068 --> 00:22:37,137
So that was quite
embarrassing.

556
00:22:37,241 --> 00:22:38,137
But luckily for me,

557
00:22:38,241 --> 00:22:39,551
I'd got rid of my bots
by then.

558
00:22:39,655 --> 00:22:42,758
[laughs] Quite funny.

559
00:22:42,862 --> 00:22:43,896
Stylist:
Girl, go and get changed.

560
00:22:44,000 --> 00:22:45,241
- Go.
- Thank you

561
00:22:46,551 --> 00:22:47,586
I was pretty naive,

562
00:22:47,689 --> 00:22:49,413
because I had no clue
what working for Facebook

563
00:22:49,517 --> 00:22:50,448
would be like.

564
00:22:50,551 --> 00:22:51,586
There is often
a conflict between

565
00:22:51,689 --> 00:22:53,551
the product side
of companies,

566
00:22:53,655 --> 00:22:55,689
whose goal
is to grow the company,

567
00:22:55,793 --> 00:22:57,482
and the integrity side
of companies

568
00:22:57,586 --> 00:22:59,965
whose goal is to protect
the company from harm.

569
00:23:00,068 --> 00:23:01,793
Instagram was
more aggressively focused

570
00:23:01,896 --> 00:23:03,482
on growing than Facebook.

571
00:23:03,586 --> 00:23:06,551
Because Instagram
has more room to grow.

572
00:23:06,655 --> 00:23:08,310
This created a dynamic

573
00:23:08,413 --> 00:23:10,586
in which there
was more resistance

574
00:23:10,689 --> 00:23:12,724
to integrity measures
on Instagram

575
00:23:12,827 --> 00:23:15,655
than I personally saw
on Facebook.

576
00:23:15,758 --> 00:23:18,689
Facebook is a public company,
Instagram is part of it,

577
00:23:18,793 --> 00:23:22,413
and Instagram needs to be the
growth engine for Facebook -

578
00:23:22,517 --> 00:23:25,103
to bring in as many
young people as they can.

579
00:23:25,206 --> 00:23:27,310
And it's becoming more
and more important,

580
00:23:27,413 --> 00:23:30,655
a bigger slice of that
advertising every year.

581
00:23:40,172 --> 00:23:41,965
When Instagram
introduced advertising,

582
00:23:42,068 --> 00:23:43,793
it was obviously better
for people

583
00:23:43,896 --> 00:23:45,965
to spend more time
in the app,

584
00:23:46,068 --> 00:23:48,931
because more time in the app
means you see more ads.

585
00:23:49,034 --> 00:23:51,793
And the single best way
to get you to spend

586
00:23:51,896 --> 00:23:52,827
more time in the app

587
00:23:52,931 --> 00:23:54,413
is to make your feed
more interesting.

588
00:23:54,517 --> 00:23:56,620
One of the kind of trademarks
of Instagram

589
00:23:56,724 --> 00:23:59,068
when I first joined
was that your feed

590
00:23:59,172 --> 00:24:00,896
would be
in chronological order.

591
00:24:01,000 --> 00:24:04,275
But as the platform
became more saturated,

592
00:24:04,379 --> 00:24:06,448
what we were finding was
that more and more people

593
00:24:06,551 --> 00:24:08,655
weren't able to actually see
a lot of the content

594
00:24:08,758 --> 00:24:10,206
that they followed.

595
00:24:10,310 --> 00:24:13,551
It became apparent
that it would make more sense

596
00:24:13,655 --> 00:24:16,586
and actually help users more
to order their feed.

597
00:24:16,689 --> 00:24:17,896
So that was rolled out.

598
00:24:21,241 --> 00:24:24,620
- There was a team
of machine learning engineers

599
00:24:24,724 --> 00:24:28,586
who would evaluate
the algorithm,

600
00:24:28,689 --> 00:24:31,310
and they would compare these
through A/B tests

601
00:24:31,413 --> 00:24:33,689
to see
which was performing better.

602
00:24:33,793 --> 00:24:36,000
There was,
amongst some users,

603
00:24:36,103 --> 00:24:38,448
a negative perception
of this.

604
00:24:38,551 --> 00:24:41,413
However,
if you looked at the metrics,

605
00:24:41,517 --> 00:24:42,655
like our engagement metrics,

606
00:24:42,758 --> 00:24:44,103
like, those were increasing.

607
00:24:44,206 --> 00:24:46,586
Now you can kind of
turn on any time

608
00:24:46,689 --> 00:24:47,655
and get something different,

609
00:24:47,758 --> 00:24:50,103
which I think for your brain,
it's just this, like, candy

610
00:24:50,206 --> 00:24:52,068
that it can't help
but go back for.

611
00:24:52,172 --> 00:24:53,965
It looks like
a logical decision now

612
00:24:54,068 --> 00:24:55,689
looking back, as to like
why Instagram did it

613
00:24:55,793 --> 00:24:56,862
as a business or, like,

614
00:24:56,965 --> 00:24:58,862
why it at the time
it looked good for users.

615
00:24:58,965 --> 00:25:00,758
But it just completely
changed obviously, like,

616
00:25:00,862 --> 00:25:01,862
how it's being used

617
00:25:01,965 --> 00:25:03,275
and what people
get out of it.

618
00:25:03,379 --> 00:25:06,275
And I think
that's impossible to reverse.

619
00:25:06,379 --> 00:25:07,689
There's a vast array
of content

620
00:25:07,793 --> 00:25:09,551
that you may never have
discovered otherwise,

621
00:25:09,655 --> 00:25:11,482
unless the algorithm
recognises

622
00:25:11,586 --> 00:25:13,137
something about
your behaviour.

623
00:25:13,241 --> 00:25:14,137
But at the same time,

624
00:25:14,241 --> 00:25:16,068
depending on the nature
of your interests,

625
00:25:16,172 --> 00:25:17,689
the things that
you might get shown

626
00:25:17,793 --> 00:25:19,586
may or may not lead you
down certain paths.

627
00:25:19,689 --> 00:25:20,862
That can lead to some,
I think,

628
00:25:20,965 --> 00:25:23,586
both, like,
scary places and also ones

629
00:25:23,689 --> 00:25:26,068
that are not super,
I guess, healthy.

630
00:25:32,137 --> 00:25:34,724
- I'm Abby
and I'm 17-years-old.

631
00:25:34,827 --> 00:25:37,000
I live with my mum
and my sister,

632
00:25:37,103 --> 00:25:38,896
and all my dogs.

633
00:25:41,551 --> 00:25:42,896
A good four years,

634
00:25:43,000 --> 00:25:44,655
I've been associated with

635
00:25:44,758 --> 00:25:47,551
these anti-recovery
Instagram communities.

636
00:25:48,758 --> 00:25:50,689
I probably wouldn't have
known what self-harm was

637
00:25:50,793 --> 00:25:52,862
if I didn't look on them
accounts.

638
00:25:58,862 --> 00:26:00,931
I knew how long
I had to stay under water

639
00:26:01,034 --> 00:26:02,172
to drown myself.

640
00:26:02,275 --> 00:26:04,620
I knew how many paracetamol

641
00:26:04,724 --> 00:26:06,206
I'd have to take
to kill myself.

642
00:26:06,310 --> 00:26:08,000
I knew how many minutes
you'd have to have something

643
00:26:08,103 --> 00:26:11,000
around your neck
to...ligature.

644
00:26:14,620 --> 00:26:16,172
You'd get added into groups

645
00:26:16,275 --> 00:26:19,275
and people would tell us
to go and kill myself,

646
00:26:19,379 --> 00:26:21,310
and they'd want to do it
together.

647
00:26:21,413 --> 00:26:23,655
And they would want to come
on a video call

648
00:26:23,758 --> 00:26:24,758
to self-harm together,

649
00:26:24,862 --> 00:26:28,482
which is just...corrupt.

650
00:26:31,034 --> 00:26:33,517
The bullying started,
like, year 7, year 8.

651
00:26:33,620 --> 00:26:35,172
I was bullied all the way
through school

652
00:26:35,275 --> 00:26:36,413
for five years.

653
00:26:36,517 --> 00:26:37,793
So when I was 14,

654
00:26:37,896 --> 00:26:39,620
my school advised that
I study at home,

655
00:26:39,724 --> 00:26:42,586
due to my mental health
deteriorating.

656
00:26:42,689 --> 00:26:45,000
I had so much free time,
like,

657
00:26:45,103 --> 00:26:47,586
I was missing out
six hours a day on education.

658
00:26:47,689 --> 00:26:51,206
So sitting in front
of your phone

659
00:26:51,310 --> 00:26:54,310
for hours and hours a day,

660
00:26:54,413 --> 00:26:56,172
I would make friends
on Instagram.

661
00:26:58,241 --> 00:26:59,344
There'd be these,
like, accounts.

662
00:26:59,448 --> 00:27:01,310
They'd put a sad quote
and they would put it in

663
00:27:01,413 --> 00:27:04,172
with like sad-toned music.

664
00:27:04,275 --> 00:27:06,724
And they have, like,
writing on it

665
00:27:06,827 --> 00:27:07,931
about, like,
how you're feeling.

666
00:27:08,034 --> 00:27:09,758
So, then, you can relate
to some of that,

667
00:27:09,862 --> 00:27:11,344
so you like it and then...

668
00:27:11,448 --> 00:27:12,379
If you let them,

669
00:27:12,482 --> 00:27:14,034
then people often follow you
if you like them.

670
00:27:14,137 --> 00:27:15,551
And then you follow them.

671
00:27:15,655 --> 00:27:18,448
And then you get sucked
into that community.

672
00:27:23,551 --> 00:27:24,724
- The kinds
of problematic content

673
00:27:24,827 --> 00:27:27,103
I remember being surprised by

674
00:27:27,206 --> 00:27:29,586
were actually around things
like self-harm.

675
00:27:29,689 --> 00:27:31,068
Enough for you to be like,
oh, actually,

676
00:27:31,172 --> 00:27:32,206
people are using Instagram

677
00:27:32,310 --> 00:27:34,068
in ways that, like,
aren't, you know,

678
00:27:34,172 --> 00:27:35,448
the sort of, like,
nice vision

679
00:27:35,551 --> 00:27:37,758
that we have for what it
could be and should be.

680
00:27:37,862 --> 00:27:39,413
I mean, just from
the very earliest days

681
00:27:39,517 --> 00:27:40,793
there was a way to report

682
00:27:40,896 --> 00:27:42,137
offensive content
in the app.

683
00:27:42,241 --> 00:27:43,517
You could just tap any photo
and say,

684
00:27:43,620 --> 00:27:44,551
"Hey, I don't like this,

685
00:27:44,655 --> 00:27:45,758
"this is not...this
is not good."

686
00:27:45,862 --> 00:27:47,862
And then we would actually
have to review it.

687
00:27:47,965 --> 00:27:49,310
We were actually
a really tiny team.

688
00:27:49,413 --> 00:27:50,896
We would have to, like,
look at the photos,

689
00:27:51,000 --> 00:27:53,068
which was never fun,
block accounts.

690
00:27:53,172 --> 00:27:55,206
So there was a little bit
of hunting through

691
00:27:55,310 --> 00:27:56,931
and just like being proactive
and reactive

692
00:27:57,034 --> 00:27:58,413
to the stuff that
was happening.

693
00:28:02,344 --> 00:28:03,586
Dealing with
problematic content

694
00:28:03,689 --> 00:28:05,310
was something that Facebook

695
00:28:05,413 --> 00:28:07,793
was able to help
quite a bit with, actually.

696
00:28:07,896 --> 00:28:08,931
They've been running,
you know,

697
00:28:09,034 --> 00:28:10,482
a huge platform
for many more years,

698
00:28:10,586 --> 00:28:14,000
and have had to learn
and deal with

699
00:28:14,103 --> 00:28:15,379
those problems
in much bigger numbers

700
00:28:15,482 --> 00:28:16,689
than we ever had.

701
00:28:16,793 --> 00:28:20,172
I remember that was actually
one of the big benefits

702
00:28:20,275 --> 00:28:21,862
that, like,
we saw looking at Facebook.

703
00:28:21,965 --> 00:28:23,137
Being, like, "Oh, wow."

704
00:28:23,241 --> 00:28:24,275
Like, they can actually

705
00:28:24,379 --> 00:28:25,931
really take this off
our shoulders.

706
00:28:26,034 --> 00:28:29,275
By offloading all of that
community moderation

707
00:28:29,379 --> 00:28:30,689
to Facebook,

708
00:28:30,793 --> 00:28:32,862
Instagram detached themselves

709
00:28:32,965 --> 00:28:35,000
from one of the most
important aspects

710
00:28:35,103 --> 00:28:38,206
of making sure that
their platform was healthy.

711
00:28:38,310 --> 00:28:39,413
Facebook's priority

712
00:28:39,517 --> 00:28:41,310
is to have as few humans

713
00:28:41,413 --> 00:28:43,517
involved in that process
as possible.

714
00:28:43,620 --> 00:28:45,724
And to prioritise the issues

715
00:28:45,827 --> 00:28:48,172
that are getting the most
public attention,

716
00:28:48,275 --> 00:28:50,655
which are the issues mostly
facing Facebook,

717
00:28:50,758 --> 00:28:52,068
not the issues
facing Instagram.

718
00:28:52,172 --> 00:28:54,379
Content moderation happens

719
00:28:54,482 --> 00:28:56,034
in a combination
of different ways.

720
00:28:56,137 --> 00:28:59,448
Some content moderation is
what's called proactive,

721
00:28:59,551 --> 00:29:03,068
where when content gets
posted to the platform,

722
00:29:03,172 --> 00:29:04,724
it gets flagged by an
algorithm that says,

723
00:29:04,827 --> 00:29:06,000
hey, this looks suspicious.

724
00:29:06,103 --> 00:29:08,517
Either it's going to be
removed from the platform

725
00:29:08,620 --> 00:29:09,931
or it'll be sent, perhaps,

726
00:29:10,034 --> 00:29:12,310
to some human
to review it and say,

727
00:29:12,413 --> 00:29:13,379
"Is this actually
a problem?"

728
00:29:13,482 --> 00:29:15,862
But algorithms are
not perfect, right?

729
00:29:15,965 --> 00:29:19,137
Algorithms often struggle
to take into account

730
00:29:19,241 --> 00:29:20,827
social nuances
that might determine

731
00:29:20,931 --> 00:29:22,413
whether something
is problematic or not.

732
00:29:22,517 --> 00:29:27,206
Even if you know your AI
for detecting harmful content

733
00:29:27,310 --> 00:29:28,862
is 99 percent accurate,

734
00:29:28,965 --> 00:29:31,034
if people are posting
a million bad things a day,

735
00:29:31,137 --> 00:29:32,517
which is probably
a vast underestimate,

736
00:29:32,620 --> 00:29:34,655
getting one percent
of them wrong

737
00:29:34,758 --> 00:29:36,689
means 10,000 pieces
of harmful content

738
00:29:36,793 --> 00:29:38,103
are coming through
the platform every day.

739
00:29:38,206 --> 00:29:40,275
And people are going to be
exposed to that.

740
00:29:42,896 --> 00:29:44,137
I'm just packing my things

741
00:29:44,241 --> 00:29:47,068
to go back to placement.

742
00:29:47,172 --> 00:29:49,241
I stay at home on
the weekend.

743
00:29:49,344 --> 00:29:52,241
And then I stay there
for the rest of the week

744
00:29:52,344 --> 00:29:53,793
with like two staff,

745
00:29:53,896 --> 00:29:55,793
'cause I've been poorly.

746
00:29:55,896 --> 00:29:58,379
So I've got their support
through the week.

747
00:30:04,931 --> 00:30:06,379
End of year 10, year 11,

748
00:30:06,482 --> 00:30:08,482
I started really wanting
to hurt myself, and I would.

749
00:30:08,586 --> 00:30:11,517
But I think apart from that,
then,

750
00:30:11,620 --> 00:30:13,896
like, before then
I didn't really want to,

751
00:30:14,000 --> 00:30:17,275
and I was just doing it
because on Instagram

752
00:30:17,379 --> 00:30:18,896
it's glamourised.

753
00:30:19,000 --> 00:30:20,862
And it's meant to be, like,
people make it look good.

754
00:30:20,965 --> 00:30:23,137
Like everything on
Instagram's glamourised,

755
00:30:23,241 --> 00:30:24,310
whether
it's the positive life

756
00:30:24,413 --> 00:30:25,896
and going shopping,

757
00:30:26,000 --> 00:30:28,862
having loads of money,
or self-harm.

758
00:30:34,103 --> 00:30:35,068
- We found her phone

759
00:30:35,172 --> 00:30:36,620
and we got her password
and stuff and then

760
00:30:36,724 --> 00:30:39,275
when we looked into it,
saw, like, the full extent

761
00:30:39,379 --> 00:30:40,551
to it and messages.

762
00:30:40,655 --> 00:30:42,620
"Aw, Abby, cut the cake,
cut the cake, go on",

763
00:30:42,724 --> 00:30:44,310
referencing to her self-harm.

764
00:30:44,413 --> 00:30:45,517
It was upsetting.

765
00:30:45,620 --> 00:30:47,448
Especially as well
'cause they're vulnerable.

766
00:30:47,551 --> 00:30:49,034
And they've been through
stuff like that,

767
00:30:49,137 --> 00:30:50,482
and having to see
what the effect

768
00:30:50,586 --> 00:30:51,758
it has on them as well.

769
00:30:51,862 --> 00:30:54,034
'Cause it's not just Abby
who has that.

770
00:30:54,137 --> 00:30:55,862
It's quite a lot
of other people.

771
00:30:57,379 --> 00:30:59,137
- I was quite shocked.

772
00:30:59,241 --> 00:31:01,172
Naively, I was just thinking

773
00:31:01,275 --> 00:31:04,586
that Abby was quite
innocently on things.

774
00:31:05,655 --> 00:31:06,931
- Later on,
I could see, like,

775
00:31:07,034 --> 00:31:08,275
she was just always
on her phone

776
00:31:08,379 --> 00:31:09,517
and when she had her phone

777
00:31:09,620 --> 00:31:11,793
she seemed to be
more heightened.

778
00:31:11,896 --> 00:31:13,896
So that's when we came
to realise, ah,

779
00:31:14,000 --> 00:31:16,551
it's her phone
that's doing it.

780
00:31:18,551 --> 00:31:19,689
- You might have a low day,

781
00:31:19,793 --> 00:31:20,965
a single low day,

782
00:31:21,068 --> 00:31:23,655
and you might go and search
for something on Instagram,

783
00:31:23,758 --> 00:31:25,310
that you might not
otherwise search for.

784
00:31:25,413 --> 00:31:27,758
Suddenly, the algorithm
has a little seed

785
00:31:27,862 --> 00:31:29,310
it can start to grow.

786
00:31:29,413 --> 00:31:33,793
And because that topic
is so intense, you know,

787
00:31:33,896 --> 00:31:36,413
as they show you more of it,
you engage with it more.

788
00:31:36,517 --> 00:31:37,551
A little tiny glimmer

789
00:31:37,655 --> 00:31:40,068
and Instagram will pull you
in that direction.

790
00:31:41,965 --> 00:31:43,931
- A machine learning model
predicts stuff,

791
00:31:44,034 --> 00:31:46,896
and in particular,
they predict behaviour.

792
00:31:48,310 --> 00:31:50,448
Like think about
the risk of using prediction

793
00:31:50,551 --> 00:31:52,000
to rank things in terms of

794
00:31:52,103 --> 00:31:54,275
a physical public square.

795
00:31:54,379 --> 00:31:56,655
The whole square is
controlled by one company.

796
00:31:56,758 --> 00:31:58,896
There are thousands
of possible routes

797
00:31:59,000 --> 00:32:00,517
you can take through
that square.

798
00:32:00,620 --> 00:32:02,896
And when you come into
the square,

799
00:32:03,000 --> 00:32:04,310
the first thing that happens
is you're handed

800
00:32:04,413 --> 00:32:05,551
a particular leaflet,

801
00:32:05,655 --> 00:32:07,758
and then how you react
to that leaflet

802
00:32:07,862 --> 00:32:11,034
determines which leaflet
you're handed next.

803
00:32:11,137 --> 00:32:12,965
Once you start down
a particular route

804
00:32:13,068 --> 00:32:14,551
through that square,

805
00:32:14,655 --> 00:32:16,379
the leaflets that you see
are going to be

806
00:32:16,482 --> 00:32:17,689
more and more related
to each other.

807
00:32:17,793 --> 00:32:18,827
And that might be
a good thing.

808
00:32:18,931 --> 00:32:20,827
It might be that
you get shown a cat leaflet

809
00:32:20,931 --> 00:32:22,206
and you really like
that cat leaflet,

810
00:32:22,310 --> 00:32:24,344
so then you get shown
more cat leaflets.

811
00:32:24,448 --> 00:32:27,724
But it might also be
a dangerous thing...

812
00:32:28,862 --> 00:32:30,275
..that again,
you find intriguing,

813
00:32:30,379 --> 00:32:32,931
and then you're shown more
of the same leaflet.

814
00:32:33,034 --> 00:32:35,310
And that's the route you then
take through the square.

815
00:32:36,620 --> 00:32:37,862
What that means

816
00:32:37,965 --> 00:32:40,275
is that you have
to have the determination

817
00:32:40,379 --> 00:32:43,586
to give the ranking model

818
00:32:43,689 --> 00:32:47,862
the same signals consistently
over time

819
00:32:47,965 --> 00:32:50,206
that you are not in fact
interested in that thing

820
00:32:50,310 --> 00:32:51,620
that you were
interested before.

821
00:32:51,724 --> 00:32:52,655
And it'll test to see

822
00:32:52,758 --> 00:32:54,137
if you're still
not interested in them.

823
00:32:54,241 --> 00:32:55,862
And if you say, actually,
I am interested,

824
00:32:55,965 --> 00:32:58,172
then it'll start showing
that to you again.

825
00:32:58,275 --> 00:33:00,931
Fundamentally
we're habitual beings,

826
00:33:01,034 --> 00:33:03,862
so it takes real will
and resolve

827
00:33:03,965 --> 00:33:06,931
to break
the self-reinforcing dynamic

828
00:33:07,034 --> 00:33:09,344
of using prediction
to rank things.

829
00:33:09,448 --> 00:33:10,620
It's not impossible,

830
00:33:10,724 --> 00:33:14,137
but it asks a real, like,
test of human psychology.

831
00:33:15,620 --> 00:33:18,655
Abby: Betty? No.

832
00:33:21,724 --> 00:33:23,862
- Have you got everything?
- Yeah.

833
00:33:23,965 --> 00:33:26,827
- It's hard to manage,
it's a big problem.

834
00:33:26,931 --> 00:33:30,206
Abby can get very distressed,
you know,

835
00:33:30,310 --> 00:33:32,241
she's been in hospital
for three months.

836
00:33:32,344 --> 00:33:35,034
And it is very, very hard.

837
00:33:37,137 --> 00:33:38,655
I think there must be a way

838
00:33:38,758 --> 00:33:41,103
that Instagram
can monitor things

839
00:33:41,206 --> 00:33:42,482
that are happening on there.

840
00:33:42,586 --> 00:33:44,310
They must know

841
00:33:44,413 --> 00:33:46,862
and possibly turn
a blind eye...

842
00:33:48,068 --> 00:33:49,448
Have you got all your things?

843
00:33:49,551 --> 00:33:51,137
- Abby: Yeah.
- Yeah?

844
00:33:51,241 --> 00:33:52,724
..because it's happening
every day.

845
00:33:52,827 --> 00:33:55,344
It's happening every day
to everyday kids.

846
00:33:55,448 --> 00:33:58,241
And, you know, we are very
lucky Abby is still here.

847
00:33:58,344 --> 00:34:00,000
Give us a hug.

848
00:34:00,103 --> 00:34:01,896
Right. I'll see you
through the week,

849
00:34:02,000 --> 00:34:03,448
- darling.
- Alright.

850
00:34:04,758 --> 00:34:06,137
- It's just the thought
of everything

851
00:34:06,241 --> 00:34:07,965
that she's been through,
you know.

852
00:34:09,413 --> 00:34:11,413
A lot of the people on there,
Abby doesn't even know.

853
00:34:11,517 --> 00:34:13,172
She's never met them.

854
00:34:15,241 --> 00:34:17,310
Yeah, I mean she is,
she's a strong girl,

855
00:34:17,413 --> 00:34:19,482
and she will get there.

856
00:34:24,517 --> 00:34:25,862
- One of the hardest things

857
00:34:25,965 --> 00:34:28,137
when it comes
to moderating Instagram

858
00:34:28,241 --> 00:34:30,655
is the visual nature
of the product.

859
00:34:30,758 --> 00:34:34,413
The company simply
hasn't figured out well

860
00:34:34,517 --> 00:34:38,689
how to understand the
dark corners of Instagram,

861
00:34:38,793 --> 00:34:40,896
that are harder to look for

862
00:34:41,000 --> 00:34:42,862
if you don't know
what you're looking for.

863
00:34:42,965 --> 00:34:45,655
The hashtag communities
that exist.

864
00:34:45,758 --> 00:34:47,103
If you don't know
the right hashtag

865
00:34:47,206 --> 00:34:48,689
you might never find them.

866
00:34:48,793 --> 00:34:51,068
So, it's very easy
for somebody

867
00:34:51,172 --> 00:34:53,137
to be doing something
that is harmful

868
00:34:53,241 --> 00:34:55,137
and not coming
to the attention

869
00:34:55,241 --> 00:34:58,310
of anyone
in Menlo Park, California.

870
00:34:58,413 --> 00:34:59,655
- The people
that were building

871
00:34:59,758 --> 00:35:01,379
a lot of the social
technologies were,

872
00:35:01,482 --> 00:35:03,724
I don't want say
similar to me,

873
00:35:03,827 --> 00:35:06,862
but they were probably more
similar to me than different.

874
00:35:06,965 --> 00:35:08,482
And what I mean by
that is that we were,

875
00:35:08,586 --> 00:35:10,275
one,
interested in technology.

876
00:35:10,379 --> 00:35:13,827
Two, we were pretty literate
and educated.

877
00:35:13,931 --> 00:35:18,310
And we...I thought that

878
00:35:18,413 --> 00:35:20,206
by bringing this technology
to the world...

879
00:35:22,413 --> 00:35:24,379
..a lot of things would just
sort of sort themselves out.

880
00:35:24,482 --> 00:35:27,448
I'm sure that there
was some vague awareness,

881
00:35:27,551 --> 00:35:29,551
perhaps, about that risk

882
00:35:29,655 --> 00:35:31,862
in the early days
of social media.

883
00:35:31,965 --> 00:35:32,965
In some ways,

884
00:35:33,068 --> 00:35:34,034
I don't want to say

885
00:35:34,137 --> 00:35:35,586
we were, like,
blinded by ambition,

886
00:35:35,689 --> 00:35:36,862
but blinded by the desire

887
00:35:36,965 --> 00:35:38,827
to just kind of get
this stuff out there

888
00:35:38,931 --> 00:35:39,965
and then we'd sort it out.

889
00:35:40,068 --> 00:35:41,413
Part of this was
a selection bias.

890
00:35:41,517 --> 00:35:42,931
We were seeing people
having a great time

891
00:35:43,034 --> 00:35:44,517
and using these things
for good.

892
00:35:44,620 --> 00:35:46,620
And I think that, you know,
at least for me,

893
00:35:46,724 --> 00:35:48,103
propelled me
to continue to believe

894
00:35:48,206 --> 00:35:51,482
that bringing more access to
more people was a net good

895
00:35:51,586 --> 00:35:53,000
as opposed to just saying,

896
00:35:53,103 --> 00:35:54,724
"OK, you know what?
Humans aren't ready for this.

897
00:35:54,827 --> 00:35:56,241
"Let's give it up."

898
00:36:04,620 --> 00:36:05,862
What was really interesting

899
00:36:05,965 --> 00:36:09,344
about the way Instagram
solved its problems

900
00:36:09,448 --> 00:36:12,689
is they focused
on the biggest users first.

901
00:36:12,793 --> 00:36:15,896
People like Taylor Swift
and Ariana Grande,

902
00:36:16,000 --> 00:36:18,448
they had
such big follower counts

903
00:36:18,551 --> 00:36:22,482
that they also got
a bigger dose of the issues.

904
00:36:22,586 --> 00:36:26,310
Taylor Swift was embroiled
in a controversy

905
00:36:26,413 --> 00:36:28,931
and people were posting
a lot of snakes on her page

906
00:36:29,034 --> 00:36:30,241
and she hated it.

907
00:36:30,344 --> 00:36:32,206
She didn't want
to have a platform

908
00:36:32,310 --> 00:36:34,310
that was just full
of harassment

909
00:36:34,413 --> 00:36:35,827
every time she logged on.

910
00:36:35,931 --> 00:36:37,586
And so that year,

911
00:36:37,689 --> 00:36:42,586
Instagram decided to allow
muting of any words or emoji

912
00:36:42,689 --> 00:36:44,137
that you don't want to see.

913
00:36:50,206 --> 00:36:52,517
Hiding the words
in your comments

914
00:36:52,620 --> 00:36:53,724
that make you sad.

915
00:36:53,827 --> 00:36:55,965
Blocking certain people
from following you.

916
00:36:56,068 --> 00:36:59,068
Making sure that you can't
see likes on those posts.

917
00:36:59,172 --> 00:37:02,827
Well, hiding it
doesn't make it go away.

918
00:37:02,931 --> 00:37:04,275
You are still in this world

919
00:37:04,379 --> 00:37:06,896
where everyone's being
compared to everyone else,

920
00:37:07,000 --> 00:37:10,862
and that is by its very
nature anxiety-inducing.

921
00:37:10,965 --> 00:37:12,206
What happens for some adults,

922
00:37:12,310 --> 00:37:13,482
for some kids,

923
00:37:13,586 --> 00:37:15,931
is that they self-soothe

924
00:37:16,034 --> 00:37:18,344
by scrolling on Instagram.

925
00:37:18,448 --> 00:37:21,586
The only problem is if your
self-soothing technique,

926
00:37:21,689 --> 00:37:23,896
you know,
sitting and scrolling,

927
00:37:24,000 --> 00:37:26,310
is exposing you
to more of the content

928
00:37:26,413 --> 00:37:28,862
that is making you sick,

929
00:37:28,965 --> 00:37:31,379
that's not a good coping
mechanism.

930
00:37:43,344 --> 00:37:44,724
- Having an eating disorder,

931
00:37:44,827 --> 00:37:46,379
it's really easy for you

932
00:37:46,482 --> 00:37:48,241
to fall into...um,

933
00:37:48,344 --> 00:37:50,482
it's kind of like
a trigger hole.

934
00:37:50,586 --> 00:37:52,896
Once I see one thing
that's triggering,

935
00:37:53,000 --> 00:37:55,310
it's kind of easy to then go
and find things

936
00:37:55,413 --> 00:37:56,482
that are also triggering,

937
00:37:56,586 --> 00:37:59,034
just because that part
of your brain likes it.

938
00:38:00,034 --> 00:38:03,413
I get food pictures pop up

939
00:38:03,517 --> 00:38:07,517
and they've got
calorie counts on each side.

940
00:38:07,620 --> 00:38:10,172
And it will say, like,
which one is more healthy

941
00:38:10,275 --> 00:38:13,793
or how you can swap out
different foods

942
00:38:13,896 --> 00:38:16,862
so that your calorie count
is lower.

943
00:38:16,965 --> 00:38:18,689
Being in a trigger hole

944
00:38:18,793 --> 00:38:20,310
can have, like,
serious effects

945
00:38:20,413 --> 00:38:23,413
on what happens
next in your life.

946
00:38:23,517 --> 00:38:25,000
Like, I might see something

947
00:38:25,103 --> 00:38:26,931
and then go
and not eat dinner.

948
00:38:28,172 --> 00:38:29,965
- In a sense,
there is a feedback loop.

949
00:38:30,068 --> 00:38:31,448
The algorithm shows
you some things

950
00:38:31,551 --> 00:38:33,034
that it thinks you're likely
to interact with.

951
00:38:33,137 --> 00:38:34,448
You may interact
with those things,

952
00:38:34,551 --> 00:38:36,517
and then it'll try to show
you more of those things

953
00:38:36,620 --> 00:38:37,620
as you interact
with it more.

954
00:38:37,724 --> 00:38:40,379
That feedback loop is
reasonably well understood.

955
00:38:40,482 --> 00:38:41,793
I think the aspect of it

956
00:38:41,896 --> 00:38:43,344
that's a little harder
to understand

957
00:38:43,448 --> 00:38:46,965
is they will actually change
your own behaviour over time

958
00:38:47,068 --> 00:38:48,827
by showing you
certain things.

959
00:38:48,931 --> 00:38:51,448
- If I'm scrolling
13 hours a day,

960
00:38:51,551 --> 00:38:54,137
it kind of...no wonder

961
00:38:54,241 --> 00:38:57,793
that it had a negative effect
on my mental health.

962
00:38:57,896 --> 00:39:00,931
All the images would be
quite highly edited.

963
00:39:01,034 --> 00:39:02,379
I was, like, comparing myself

964
00:39:02,482 --> 00:39:05,758
to this false person
that I was looking at,

965
00:39:05,862 --> 00:39:09,758
and not really realising that
that's what I was doing.

966
00:39:09,862 --> 00:39:12,172
I always used to use
filters on Instagram,

967
00:39:12,275 --> 00:39:14,827
and I didn't realise how
damaging they were.

968
00:39:14,931 --> 00:39:16,758
But I always used to put,
like,

969
00:39:16,862 --> 00:39:18,172
my pictures in Facetune

970
00:39:18,275 --> 00:39:20,620
and, like,
make my waist smaller

971
00:39:20,724 --> 00:39:22,034
than what it was.

972
00:39:22,137 --> 00:39:24,586
The underlying goal
has always been the same.

973
00:39:24,689 --> 00:39:26,000
How do I look best?

974
00:39:26,103 --> 00:39:29,000
And maybe we need fewer,
you know,

975
00:39:29,103 --> 00:39:30,689
contrast filters
and saturation filters

976
00:39:30,793 --> 00:39:31,689
and all this stuff.

977
00:39:31,793 --> 00:39:33,068
And, oh,
take away my freckles

978
00:39:33,172 --> 00:39:35,275
or take away my, like,
wrinkles or something.

979
00:39:35,379 --> 00:39:38,275
And how do you guarantee,
like, a selfie to look good?

980
00:39:38,379 --> 00:39:41,586
That was a problem we had
to try and solve.

981
00:39:41,689 --> 00:39:43,206
Making sure that, yeah,

982
00:39:43,310 --> 00:39:46,896
when you took a photo,
your skin looked good,

983
00:39:47,000 --> 00:39:48,862
so all the blemishes go away.

984
00:39:53,931 --> 00:39:56,758
Oh, wow. Um...

985
00:39:56,862 --> 00:39:58,068
So, I have a two-year-old,

986
00:39:58,172 --> 00:40:01,448
in 16 years when she's 18...

987
00:40:01,551 --> 00:40:03,586
As a parent, I want to
educate my daughter to say,

988
00:40:03,689 --> 00:40:04,689
"You know what, it's OK.

989
00:40:04,793 --> 00:40:08,172
"Beauty is up to you
to define, to decide.

990
00:40:08,275 --> 00:40:12,103
"It's not something that
is defined by someone else."

991
00:40:12,206 --> 00:40:14,034
You make people aware that
there is a filter.

992
00:40:14,137 --> 00:40:15,448
That's good,

993
00:40:15,551 --> 00:40:18,103
because they know that
there's some sense of,

994
00:40:18,206 --> 00:40:19,827
like,
this image has been doctored.

995
00:40:19,931 --> 00:40:21,482
I think
it's our responsibility

996
00:40:21,586 --> 00:40:24,103
to...to tell people that.

997
00:40:25,862 --> 00:40:27,103
- During COVID,

998
00:40:27,206 --> 00:40:29,344
I made friends with
a neighbour...

999
00:40:30,482 --> 00:40:32,172
..and she'd been through

1000
00:40:32,275 --> 00:40:33,931
eating disorder
recovery before,

1001
00:40:34,034 --> 00:40:35,344
she'd been an inpatient.

1002
00:40:35,448 --> 00:40:37,655
And she said, like,

1003
00:40:37,758 --> 00:40:40,379
"You're actually ill," like,

1004
00:40:40,482 --> 00:40:42,724
"You're ill,
you need to get help".

1005
00:40:44,413 --> 00:40:46,965
Something just clicked
and I was like...

1006
00:40:49,172 --> 00:40:51,517
"Yeah, I think actually,
you're right."

1007
00:40:51,620 --> 00:40:55,000
And, yeah,
I then got help from there.

1008
00:41:00,586 --> 00:41:03,827
Right, I'm filming now
and I'm not stopping it.

1009
00:41:03,931 --> 00:41:06,275
I've stopped this video
about 100 times.

1010
00:41:07,517 --> 00:41:10,551
Hi everyone,
welcome back to my IGTV.

1011
00:41:10,655 --> 00:41:11,896
So, this week

1012
00:41:12,000 --> 00:41:14,000
is Eating Disorder
Awareness Week,

1013
00:41:14,103 --> 00:41:15,448
if you didn't know already.

1014
00:41:15,551 --> 00:41:18,655
The content I post now
is a lot more uplifting,

1015
00:41:18,758 --> 00:41:20,310
a lot more positive,

1016
00:41:20,413 --> 00:41:22,931
kind of still having
that fashion element.

1017
00:41:23,034 --> 00:41:25,206
but I also now talk
about healing.

1018
00:41:28,379 --> 00:41:29,275
Interviewer:
When you look back

1019
00:41:29,379 --> 00:41:30,862
at your content from then,
like,

1020
00:41:30,965 --> 00:41:33,103
what do you think about
that girl?

1021
00:41:34,689 --> 00:41:36,034
- Um...

1022
00:41:36,137 --> 00:41:37,931
I feel like I have, like,

1023
00:41:38,034 --> 00:41:40,000
quite a lot of compassion
for that girl.

1024
00:41:40,103 --> 00:41:41,172
Because I feel like she was,
like,

1025
00:41:41,275 --> 00:41:45,206
striving to achieve this
level of, like, perfection

1026
00:41:45,310 --> 00:41:47,931
that just was never
going to happen.

1027
00:41:48,034 --> 00:41:51,586
But she also, like,
worked so hard to, like,

1028
00:41:51,689 --> 00:41:53,758
get to where she was.

1029
00:41:53,862 --> 00:41:55,586
I'm getting upset.

1030
00:42:01,724 --> 00:42:03,000
[sniffles] Yeah...

1031
00:42:07,931 --> 00:42:11,000
When I look back at that
girl I just think...

1032
00:42:12,655 --> 00:42:16,103
..I just wish that someone
would have been, like,

1033
00:42:16,206 --> 00:42:18,448
"Hey, it's OK," like,

1034
00:42:18,551 --> 00:42:20,413
"there's something
wrong here,

1035
00:42:20,517 --> 00:42:22,034
"but it's all going
to be OK",

1036
00:42:22,137 --> 00:42:23,137
you know?

1037
00:42:30,379 --> 00:42:31,862
- I don't know
if it's an unusual thing

1038
00:42:31,965 --> 00:42:34,275
about the nature of work
as an influencer.

1039
00:42:34,379 --> 00:42:37,620
But there are no built-in
protections.

1040
00:42:37,724 --> 00:42:39,793
You're competing with
literally millions of people

1041
00:42:39,896 --> 00:42:41,413
on a scale that most humans

1042
00:42:41,517 --> 00:42:43,000
have never had
to confront before.

1043
00:42:43,103 --> 00:42:45,862
Imagine constructing
your world

1044
00:42:45,965 --> 00:42:48,206
such that you create things
that happen

1045
00:42:48,310 --> 00:42:50,068
so you can take photos
of them

1046
00:42:50,172 --> 00:42:51,758
in order for them
to get likes.

1047
00:42:51,862 --> 00:42:53,206
So then you can get
the validation

1048
00:42:53,310 --> 00:42:55,896
to stay at a certain rung
on a ladder.

1049
00:42:56,000 --> 00:42:57,379
That if you stop doing that,

1050
00:42:57,482 --> 00:42:59,241
then you lose all
of your self-worth,

1051
00:42:59,344 --> 00:43:01,068
and you'll start
to question your value.

1052
00:43:01,172 --> 00:43:03,482
It's a really tough place
to be in.

1053
00:43:03,586 --> 00:43:05,344
It's in the very structure
of Instagram

1054
00:43:05,448 --> 00:43:07,379
that these problems
have come about.

1055
00:43:07,482 --> 00:43:10,000
And so
if you don't change that,

1056
00:43:10,103 --> 00:43:12,655
you really can't change
the nature

1057
00:43:12,758 --> 00:43:14,206
of how people feel about
being compared

1058
00:43:14,310 --> 00:43:15,793
to others all the time.

1059
00:43:22,793 --> 00:43:23,793
- My name's Callum,

1060
00:43:23,896 --> 00:43:25,827
I work for the Centre for
Countering Digital Hate

1061
00:43:25,931 --> 00:43:27,310
as its Head of Research.

1062
00:43:27,413 --> 00:43:30,620
We've investigated a range
of social media platforms.

1063
00:43:30,724 --> 00:43:31,896
We look at how their
algorithms work

1064
00:43:32,000 --> 00:43:34,310
and what sort of content
that they promote,

1065
00:43:34,413 --> 00:43:35,620
and whether they're profiting
from things

1066
00:43:35,724 --> 00:43:36,758
that they shouldn't be.

1067
00:43:36,862 --> 00:43:38,551
A big part of
Instagram's business model

1068
00:43:38,655 --> 00:43:40,758
is that it has
an understanding

1069
00:43:40,862 --> 00:43:42,103
of what users are
interested in.

1070
00:43:42,206 --> 00:43:43,482
And what it says
to advertisers

1071
00:43:43,586 --> 00:43:45,379
is put your advertising
on our platform

1072
00:43:45,482 --> 00:43:47,620
and we'll make sure
it's shown to people

1073
00:43:47,724 --> 00:43:50,620
who are most likely
to engage with this.

1074
00:43:51,896 --> 00:43:53,344
We set up an account
to investigate

1075
00:43:53,448 --> 00:43:55,034
what's been called bigorexia,

1076
00:43:55,137 --> 00:43:56,965
and that's primarily men
who become obsessed

1077
00:43:57,068 --> 00:43:59,034
with becoming
very big and muscular,

1078
00:43:59,137 --> 00:44:01,310
obsessed with bodybuilding.

1079
00:44:01,413 --> 00:44:03,482
What we found
was that the algorithm

1080
00:44:03,586 --> 00:44:06,448
would push bodybuilding
content very, very hard

1081
00:44:06,551 --> 00:44:08,896
to accounts that began
to follow that content.

1082
00:44:09,000 --> 00:44:11,689
To the extent that the
Explore page on Instagram,

1083
00:44:11,793 --> 00:44:15,448
80 percent of the posts on
there recommended to you

1084
00:44:15,551 --> 00:44:19,344
would feature pretty extreme
bodybuilding physiques.

1085
00:44:20,689 --> 00:44:23,241
This has been likened
to a form of body dysmorphia,

1086
00:44:23,344 --> 00:44:25,724
and increasingly
is thought to be harmful.

1087
00:44:25,827 --> 00:44:28,896
And so the signs
that the algorithm

1088
00:44:29,000 --> 00:44:30,689
is pushing men towards
that content

1089
00:44:30,793 --> 00:44:32,275
and is encouraging them
to see

1090
00:44:32,379 --> 00:44:34,655
this pretty
extraordinary body shape

1091
00:44:34,758 --> 00:44:38,068
as ordinary, normal
and easily attainable.

1092
00:44:38,172 --> 00:44:41,413
It was getting adverts
for health supplements,

1093
00:44:41,517 --> 00:44:45,068
for diet plans,
for workout plans.

1094
00:44:45,172 --> 00:44:47,448
So none of which
is harmful in itself,

1095
00:44:47,551 --> 00:44:49,413
but it is another example
of how Instagram

1096
00:44:49,517 --> 00:44:51,517
turns that time spent
on the platform

1097
00:44:51,620 --> 00:44:54,620
looking at this content into
money through advertising.

1098
00:44:54,724 --> 00:44:56,931
If you're Instagram,
strategically,

1099
00:44:57,034 --> 00:44:59,551
the ordinary user
doesn't matter

1100
00:44:59,655 --> 00:45:02,413
as much as the advertiser.

1101
00:45:02,517 --> 00:45:06,068
Unless you're thinking
about them en masse.

1102
00:45:06,172 --> 00:45:07,827
They need more ordinary users

1103
00:45:07,931 --> 00:45:09,275
spending time on Instagram

1104
00:45:09,379 --> 00:45:12,482
to be the ones buying
the products.

1105
00:45:12,586 --> 00:45:14,482
I mean,
the most effective ads

1106
00:45:14,586 --> 00:45:15,827
and brand marketing

1107
00:45:15,931 --> 00:45:18,413
is content that makes
you feel something,

1108
00:45:18,517 --> 00:45:20,482
that causes a reaction
or a response.

1109
00:45:20,586 --> 00:45:22,206
Instagram was one
of the first platforms

1110
00:45:22,310 --> 00:45:24,379
where I think
that creator class

1111
00:45:24,482 --> 00:45:26,827
really realised that
the best ads

1112
00:45:26,931 --> 00:45:28,655
are ads that don't feel
like ads at all.

1113
00:45:32,517 --> 00:45:35,241
- So my natural body type
is very slim.

1114
00:45:35,344 --> 00:45:38,620
And when I was younger
skinny girls were in.

1115
00:45:38,724 --> 00:45:41,448
But when you came
to Instagram now

1116
00:45:41,551 --> 00:45:43,344
the curvy girl was cool.

1117
00:45:43,448 --> 00:45:46,724
And then with the whole
advertising of,

1118
00:45:46,827 --> 00:45:50,172
oh, Brazilian butt lift,
BBL, you can do this,

1119
00:45:50,275 --> 00:45:51,517
you can do that.

1120
00:45:51,620 --> 00:45:53,379
And if you don't know
what a BBL is,

1121
00:45:53,482 --> 00:45:56,793
they transfer fat from
other areas of your body

1122
00:45:56,896 --> 00:45:58,413
and they pull it
into your bum

1123
00:45:58,517 --> 00:45:59,931
and then they sculpt you.

1124
00:46:00,034 --> 00:46:01,344
I was thinking,

1125
00:46:01,448 --> 00:46:03,931
OK, curvy girls are in.

1126
00:46:04,034 --> 00:46:05,517
If I'm curvier I'm going
to get more followers.

1127
00:46:05,620 --> 00:46:07,379
If I get more followers
I'm going to get more money.

1128
00:46:07,482 --> 00:46:08,344
If I get more money

1129
00:46:08,448 --> 00:46:10,793
that's a better future
for my children.

1130
00:46:15,620 --> 00:46:18,275
I'm Chenade Laroy
and I'm out here in Istanbul,

1131
00:46:18,379 --> 00:46:21,724
and I've just had
my BBL surgery,

1132
00:46:21,827 --> 00:46:23,344
hence why
I'm a little bit stiff.

1133
00:46:23,448 --> 00:46:27,896
I got my BBL surgery done
by a company.

1134
00:46:28,000 --> 00:46:30,344
They expected from me
that I post stories

1135
00:46:30,448 --> 00:46:32,931
and post my results
of before and after.

1136
00:46:33,034 --> 00:46:34,448
In return for that,

1137
00:46:34,551 --> 00:46:37,482
they would give me
a reduced rate.

1138
00:46:37,586 --> 00:46:42,068
It turned out to be something
I wouldn't do again.

1139
00:46:42,172 --> 00:46:44,827
- Hi. How are you, babe?
- Woman: Hello!

1140
00:46:46,724 --> 00:46:48,206
- How are you?
- Great, thanks.

1141
00:46:48,310 --> 00:46:49,862
Get some water if you like,
some biscuits.

1142
00:46:49,965 --> 00:46:51,241
Yeah,
definitely need some water.

1143
00:46:51,344 --> 00:46:52,896
After my surgery,
when I came back to England,

1144
00:46:53,000 --> 00:46:54,000
my body was perfect.

1145
00:46:54,103 --> 00:46:56,379
And it was only when I was
having my massages done,

1146
00:46:56,482 --> 00:46:58,103
one of the masseuses
was like,

1147
00:46:58,206 --> 00:47:00,000
"I think you still have
fluid left inside you."

1148
00:47:08,793 --> 00:47:09,827
Can you see like here?

1149
00:47:09,931 --> 00:47:12,034
It looks like I've got,
like, a small baby.

1150
00:47:12,137 --> 00:47:14,172
[laughs]

1151
00:47:14,275 --> 00:47:16,931
And the thing is, like,
people knew me on Instagram,

1152
00:47:17,034 --> 00:47:18,655
'cause I've always been into
my health and fitness.

1153
00:47:18,758 --> 00:47:20,448
I've always had a six pack.

1154
00:47:20,551 --> 00:47:22,862
I did go onto my Instagram,
put up a whole post.

1155
00:47:22,965 --> 00:47:24,931
I had a negative experience,

1156
00:47:25,034 --> 00:47:27,758
so I owe it to my audience
to be honest and say,

1157
00:47:27,862 --> 00:47:29,517
"This is what happened
to me."

1158
00:47:29,620 --> 00:47:32,275
You need to not fall into
the hype like I did.

1159
00:47:32,379 --> 00:47:36,517
You need to actually think
about the whole process.

1160
00:47:36,620 --> 00:47:38,379
It's one of the most
dangerous procedures,

1161
00:47:38,482 --> 00:47:39,931
and obviously, like,
I have two children.

1162
00:47:40,034 --> 00:47:42,034
It's very irresponsible
of me,

1163
00:47:42,137 --> 00:47:43,827
especially being a mum.

1164
00:47:43,931 --> 00:47:45,172
But if I'm honest,

1165
00:47:45,275 --> 00:47:47,344
I feel like I probably still
would've done it.

1166
00:47:47,448 --> 00:47:49,206
It's the advertising.

1167
00:47:49,310 --> 00:47:50,241
And like,

1168
00:47:50,344 --> 00:47:52,068
"Oh, but he looks good,
and her body looks good."

1169
00:47:52,172 --> 00:47:53,724
And this is why, like,
for me,

1170
00:47:53,827 --> 00:47:55,241
I had to go through
my Instagram

1171
00:47:55,344 --> 00:47:57,517
and filter who I follow.

1172
00:48:20,620 --> 00:48:21,827
When it comes
to the algorithm

1173
00:48:21,931 --> 00:48:23,724
that's where safety
has to be paramount,

1174
00:48:23,827 --> 00:48:25,034
because that's where
the platforms

1175
00:48:25,137 --> 00:48:28,931
take an active role in
presenting content to users

1176
00:48:29,034 --> 00:48:30,344
and it can cause harm
to them.

1177
00:48:37,896 --> 00:48:40,172
Yes, influencers
have a responsibility

1178
00:48:40,275 --> 00:48:41,827
to their public,
to their audience,

1179
00:48:41,931 --> 00:48:43,310
especially
if they're younger people.

1180
00:48:43,413 --> 00:48:45,137
However, the government

1181
00:48:45,241 --> 00:48:47,241
and the people
that actually run Instagram,

1182
00:48:47,344 --> 00:48:49,620
that's where the
responsibility really falls.

1183
00:48:49,724 --> 00:48:51,344
If something
is that detrimental,

1184
00:48:51,448 --> 00:48:53,241
you have the algorithms,
you have the numbers.

1185
00:48:53,344 --> 00:48:55,724
You're seeing everything
from the top.

1186
00:48:55,827 --> 00:48:58,689
They have to control it.
They have to figure out.

1187
00:49:14,896 --> 00:49:15,827
It's not the case

1188
00:49:15,931 --> 00:49:18,206
that social media companies
like Instagram

1189
00:49:18,310 --> 00:49:20,034
are just not thinking
about all the ways

1190
00:49:20,137 --> 00:49:22,793
in which their content could
harm people - they are.

1191
00:49:22,896 --> 00:49:25,206
They write rules which
are publicly available,

1192
00:49:25,310 --> 00:49:26,655
and on the basis
of those rules,

1193
00:49:26,758 --> 00:49:30,310
content is completely removed
by people from the site.

1194
00:49:30,413 --> 00:49:31,689
But the other way
they're thinking

1195
00:49:31,793 --> 00:49:34,034
about reducing content
that's harmful to people

1196
00:49:34,137 --> 00:49:35,965
is by training machine
learning models

1197
00:49:36,068 --> 00:49:38,310
to predict
what kinds of content

1198
00:49:38,413 --> 00:49:40,241
meet certain definitions,

1199
00:49:40,344 --> 00:49:44,965
and then demote that
on people's Instagram feeds.

1200
00:49:45,068 --> 00:49:46,586
But the crucial question
about that -

1201
00:49:46,689 --> 00:49:48,965
and this is a question
for society -

1202
00:49:49,068 --> 00:49:51,586
is who should get to decide?

1203
00:49:51,689 --> 00:49:52,827
What are the concepts

1204
00:49:52,931 --> 00:49:54,827
that we should train machine
learning models

1205
00:49:54,931 --> 00:49:57,275
to demote content
on the basis of?

1206
00:49:57,379 --> 00:49:59,379
Should that be
the companies themselves?

1207
00:49:59,482 --> 00:50:02,103
Should it be legislators
or regulators?

1208
00:50:02,206 --> 00:50:05,034
And how should we know
what those concepts are?

1209
00:50:05,137 --> 00:50:06,034
'Cause right now,

1210
00:50:06,137 --> 00:50:08,068
we don't know all that
much about them.

1211
00:50:21,482 --> 00:50:22,896
- What's going on, Abby?

1212
00:50:26,034 --> 00:50:28,379
Have a think
of 10 different things

1213
00:50:28,482 --> 00:50:31,000
that are important
or special about you

1214
00:50:31,103 --> 00:50:34,931
that nobody would know
about unless you told them.

1215
00:50:35,034 --> 00:50:36,137
I'm living at home now,

1216
00:50:36,241 --> 00:50:38,482
so I've moved from
my placement.

1217
00:50:38,586 --> 00:50:42,068
I didn't have my phone from
my first placement.

1218
00:50:42,172 --> 00:50:45,482
I'd say about 14, 15 months,
I didn't have my phone for.

1219
00:50:45,586 --> 00:50:47,586
They knew what was going on
with social media,

1220
00:50:47,689 --> 00:50:48,827
stuff like that,
so it was like,

1221
00:50:48,931 --> 00:50:50,137
"No, we're taking
your phone off you,

1222
00:50:50,241 --> 00:50:53,206
"um, because it isn't
making you any better,

1223
00:50:53,310 --> 00:50:54,655
"it's just making you worse".

1224
00:50:55,862 --> 00:50:57,379
Not having access
to them groups

1225
00:50:57,482 --> 00:50:58,758
as such was very good,

1226
00:50:58,862 --> 00:51:00,241
like,
still now I'm very grateful

1227
00:51:00,344 --> 00:51:01,517
that I didn't have my phone.

1228
00:51:01,620 --> 00:51:03,206
I'm not in them
groups anymore.

1229
00:51:03,310 --> 00:51:04,551
If I get added, I'll leave.

1230
00:51:04,655 --> 00:51:07,241
And then look at her face
when she turns.

1231
00:51:07,344 --> 00:51:10,103
- With Abby's phone and that
it is a bit of a concern,

1232
00:51:10,206 --> 00:51:11,448
'cause you don't know
whose on there,

1233
00:51:11,551 --> 00:51:12,655
who she's messaging.

1234
00:51:12,758 --> 00:51:14,068
So it makes you
quite worried,

1235
00:51:14,172 --> 00:51:17,344
what she's doing by herself
and on her phone.

1236
00:51:26,586 --> 00:51:27,862
- As soon as you open
Instagram

1237
00:51:27,965 --> 00:51:29,068
it's the feed page you see

1238
00:51:29,172 --> 00:51:31,068
and not the group chats.

1239
00:51:31,172 --> 00:51:33,275
I went on Instagram,
like, about two weeks ago

1240
00:51:33,379 --> 00:51:37,379
and there was someone
posting, like,

1241
00:51:37,482 --> 00:51:40,172
a few screen recordings
of these videos -

1242
00:51:40,275 --> 00:51:43,068
people committing suicide
who'd videoed their suicides.

1243
00:51:44,344 --> 00:51:47,068
I don't know how them
videos were uploaded.

1244
00:51:47,172 --> 00:51:48,896
I didn't really look into it,

1245
00:51:49,000 --> 00:51:51,206
'cause I was so traumatised.

1246
00:51:51,310 --> 00:51:53,413
And one of them there
was this woman

1247
00:51:53,517 --> 00:51:54,827
and she was hanging herself

1248
00:51:54,931 --> 00:51:56,310
and she was crying
and all this.

1249
00:51:57,724 --> 00:51:59,103
It's getting out of hand.

1250
00:51:59,206 --> 00:52:00,931
When I first went on
the communities

1251
00:52:01,034 --> 00:52:03,103
it was like, yeah,
people posting pictures

1252
00:52:03,206 --> 00:52:05,655
of self-harm and that
but now it's, like...

1253
00:52:06,724 --> 00:52:08,103
I mean,
that is bad in itself,

1254
00:52:08,206 --> 00:52:09,586
but now it's like extremes

1255
00:52:09,689 --> 00:52:12,068
and it's just getting,
spiralling out of control.

1256
00:52:12,172 --> 00:52:14,413
And I think people
can't control

1257
00:52:14,517 --> 00:52:15,586
what people put on anymore,

1258
00:52:15,689 --> 00:52:18,034
because they didn't stop it
in the first place.

1259
00:52:18,137 --> 00:52:21,103
- Obviously, no social media
would be the best solution,

1260
00:52:21,206 --> 00:52:24,275
but you can't take somebody's
phone off them forever,

1261
00:52:24,379 --> 00:52:25,758
their social media
off them forever.

1262
00:52:25,862 --> 00:52:28,310
So I think certain guidelines
need to be put in place

1263
00:52:28,413 --> 00:52:31,413
to stop this harm
towards people.

1264
00:52:47,931 --> 00:52:49,827
I don't think they really put
a lot of safeguards in place,

1265
00:52:49,931 --> 00:52:52,379
so all it would be
is sensitive warning

1266
00:52:52,482 --> 00:52:53,482
on this video.

1267
00:52:53,586 --> 00:52:55,103
All you have to do
is click yes,

1268
00:52:55,206 --> 00:52:56,103
do you know what I mean?

1269
00:52:56,206 --> 00:52:58,034
It's not...it just
shouldn't be up there,

1270
00:52:58,137 --> 00:53:01,034
that video should
not be on social media.

1271
00:53:03,000 --> 00:53:04,724
- I think
we're starting to have

1272
00:53:04,827 --> 00:53:06,275
a reckoning as a society

1273
00:53:06,379 --> 00:53:10,586
for the power
that Instagram holds

1274
00:53:10,689 --> 00:53:15,241
over young people and over,
really, all of us.

1275
00:53:15,344 --> 00:53:17,137
In the last few years,

1276
00:53:17,241 --> 00:53:18,413
employees have realised

1277
00:53:18,517 --> 00:53:20,862
that the power
that this company holds

1278
00:53:20,965 --> 00:53:25,000
is simply too large,
too important to keep secret.

1279
00:53:33,068 --> 00:53:35,137
- I worked at Facebook
for approximately two years,

1280
00:53:35,241 --> 00:53:38,896
starting in June of 2019.

1281
00:53:39,000 --> 00:53:41,068
And it really struck me,

1282
00:53:41,172 --> 00:53:42,275
when I worked at Facebook,

1283
00:53:42,379 --> 00:53:44,068
that there were a number
of systemic problems

1284
00:53:44,172 --> 00:53:45,379
that I didn't believe

1285
00:53:45,482 --> 00:53:47,000
Facebook could solve
on its own.

1286
00:53:55,034 --> 00:53:56,482
Facebook's research says

1287
00:53:56,586 --> 00:53:58,000
that in the United States

1288
00:53:58,103 --> 00:53:59,517
six percent of teenagers

1289
00:53:59,620 --> 00:54:00,793
who thought about

1290
00:54:00,896 --> 00:54:01,931
suicidal ideation said that

1291
00:54:02,034 --> 00:54:03,517
it was driven by Instagram,

1292
00:54:03,620 --> 00:54:05,482
and 13 percent in the UK.

1293
00:54:07,241 --> 00:54:08,137
Instagram makes

1294
00:54:08,241 --> 00:54:09,517
body image issues worse

1295
00:54:09,620 --> 00:54:11,103
in one in three teen girls.

1296
00:54:33,551 --> 00:54:35,655
The documents describe
an addict's narrative.

1297
00:54:35,758 --> 00:54:37,344
No, I don't feel good
when I use this.

1298
00:54:37,448 --> 00:54:38,724
I can't stop.

1299
00:54:38,827 --> 00:54:40,344
I want to stop.

1300
00:54:40,448 --> 00:54:42,965
If I leave,
I'll be ostracised.

1301
00:54:43,068 --> 00:54:44,586
And when they go
to their parents

1302
00:54:44,689 --> 00:54:46,137
and talk about
these problems,

1303
00:54:46,241 --> 00:54:50,000
because their parents never
lived this experience,

1304
00:54:50,103 --> 00:54:54,344
Facebook's own documents say
kids are suffering alone.

1305
00:54:54,448 --> 00:54:55,896
At some point I realised

1306
00:54:56,000 --> 00:54:58,103
that the only way
these problems

1307
00:54:58,206 --> 00:54:59,241
were going to be solved

1308
00:54:59,344 --> 00:55:01,413
was if we stepped out
of the frame.

1309
00:55:01,517 --> 00:55:03,758
Facebook is trying to solve
these problems in private.

1310
00:55:03,862 --> 00:55:05,482
And that's part of why
I came forward.

1311
00:55:05,586 --> 00:55:07,655
We have to solve these
problems together.

1312
00:55:07,758 --> 00:55:09,862
Facebook and Instagram have
a responsibility

1313
00:55:09,965 --> 00:55:12,137
to better understand
the impacts

1314
00:55:12,241 --> 00:55:13,551
that they're having on
the world.

1315
00:55:13,655 --> 00:55:15,724
But, in my mind,
that's not enough.

1316
00:55:15,827 --> 00:55:19,379
What really needs
to be part of the solution

1317
00:55:19,482 --> 00:55:21,586
is a much broader
conversation with regulators,

1318
00:55:21,689 --> 00:55:22,862
with the public,

1319
00:55:22,965 --> 00:55:26,034
in terms of can we actually
envision a world

1320
00:55:26,137 --> 00:55:28,172
where Facebook
isn't just left alone

1321
00:55:28,275 --> 00:55:31,034
to do whatever it wants
to its platforms?

1322
00:55:31,137 --> 00:55:32,586
But there's actually some way

1323
00:55:32,689 --> 00:55:34,206
that we have some
transparency

1324
00:55:34,310 --> 00:55:35,241
into what they're doing.

1325
00:55:35,344 --> 00:55:36,620
And I think people are
starting to realise that,

1326
00:55:36,724 --> 00:55:39,517
actually, there's a way that
this could be done better.

1327
00:55:47,344 --> 00:55:49,689
- I'm literally a completely
different person.

1328
00:55:49,793 --> 00:55:51,862
Every single thing
is different about me now

1329
00:55:51,965 --> 00:55:54,655
because I've been through
so much therapy.

1330
00:55:54,758 --> 00:55:57,034
My whole life has changed.

1331
00:56:00,655 --> 00:56:05,793
I've decided more recently to
not edit any of my content.

1332
00:56:05,896 --> 00:56:07,068
So...

1333
00:56:07,172 --> 00:56:08,827
Oh, this is cute.

1334
00:56:08,931 --> 00:56:11,689
..I just have it straight
from my iPhone camera

1335
00:56:11,793 --> 00:56:13,689
to Instagram,

1336
00:56:13,793 --> 00:56:15,137
not being touched.

1337
00:56:15,241 --> 00:56:18,172
I don't want to add
to the problem,

1338
00:56:18,275 --> 00:56:21,482
that is probably never
going to go away,

1339
00:56:21,586 --> 00:56:27,206
by showing people
this false image of myself.

1340
00:56:28,655 --> 00:56:30,827
I feel a lot happier
and healthier.

1341
00:56:30,931 --> 00:56:33,586
Like,
I literally always smile...

1342
00:56:33,689 --> 00:56:35,344
[laughs]

1343
00:56:35,448 --> 00:56:38,344
..which I never really did
before.

1344
00:56:38,448 --> 00:56:41,137
- I hope that we will be able
to find ways

1345
00:56:41,241 --> 00:56:43,068
to feel interconnected
in a positive way

1346
00:56:43,172 --> 00:56:45,379
that benefits society
at large.

1347
00:56:45,482 --> 00:56:47,275
And I think that
there are ways

1348
00:56:47,379 --> 00:56:49,241
that social media platforms
can do that.

1349
00:56:49,344 --> 00:56:51,655
But they do need to change.

1350
00:56:53,448 --> 00:56:54,931
- Now I'm in college.

1351
00:56:55,034 --> 00:56:57,344
I'm doing my level three
Health and Social Care,

1352
00:56:57,448 --> 00:56:59,172
so I can become
a Mental Health nurse.

1353
00:56:59,275 --> 00:57:01,241
I think people need
to take responsibility

1354
00:57:01,344 --> 00:57:02,344
for what they're posting

1355
00:57:02,448 --> 00:57:04,758
and acknowledge
how it can impact others.

1356
00:57:04,862 --> 00:57:07,413
Instagram could try
and monitor this

1357
00:57:07,517 --> 00:57:08,827
a lot more closely

1358
00:57:08,931 --> 00:57:10,620
and try
and tackle this problem

1359
00:57:10,724 --> 00:57:12,379
as soon as possible.

1360
00:57:12,482 --> 00:57:16,241
I don't know, like,
who is responsible.

1361
00:57:16,344 --> 00:57:18,655
I do think it will take us
a while to kind of look back

1362
00:57:18,758 --> 00:57:19,931
and kind of figure that out.

1363
00:57:20,034 --> 00:57:21,517
Um, am I responsible?

1364
00:57:21,620 --> 00:57:22,586
Of course, I am.

1365
00:57:22,689 --> 00:57:25,310
I was part
of designing features

1366
00:57:25,413 --> 00:57:27,344
and building features
that are now used

1367
00:57:27,448 --> 00:57:28,620
in the way they are.

1368
00:57:28,724 --> 00:57:32,896
I can't completely disconnect
from having worked on it.

1369
00:57:33,000 --> 00:57:34,275
I still love Instagram.

1370
00:57:34,379 --> 00:57:35,241
And I really hope

1371
00:57:35,344 --> 00:57:36,689
that it's able
to sort of figure out

1372
00:57:36,793 --> 00:57:37,758
how to navigate this space

1373
00:57:37,862 --> 00:57:39,965
and get back to what
it wanted to be.

1374
00:57:40,068 --> 00:57:42,413
But I can't say that
I'm holding my breath

1375
00:57:42,517 --> 00:57:43,448
for that to happen.

1376
00:57:43,551 --> 00:57:44,827
The only way Facebook
will change

1377
00:57:44,931 --> 00:57:46,275
is if they're forced
to change.

1378
00:57:46,379 --> 00:57:48,482
Companies don't change
until the cost of changing

1379
00:57:48,586 --> 00:57:51,275
is less than the cost
of staying the same.

1380
00:57:51,379 --> 00:57:54,448
And so we need to stand up
and demand better things.

1381
00:57:54,551 --> 00:57:56,482
We need to demand the
Instagram that we deserve,

1382
00:57:56,586 --> 00:57:58,448
not the one that Facebook
is giving us today.

1383
00:57:58,551 --> 00:58:01,620
Captioned by Ai-Media
ai-media.tv