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[peaceful music playing]

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Downloaded from
YTS.MX

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Official YIFY movies site:
YTS.MX

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[suspenseful music playing]

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[narrator] Georges and Suzie
were almost breathless
with anticipation

6
00:00:59,692 --> 00:01:03,821
as they approached
the expansive entryway
to the museum.

7
00:01:03,862 --> 00:01:08,158
At home in Paris,
Georges and Suzie lived
a conservative life,

8
00:01:08,200 --> 00:01:10,202
ostensibly.

9
00:01:10,244 --> 00:01:12,580
But they had a double life.

10
00:01:16,166 --> 00:01:17,793
Highly acquisitive by nature,

11
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both were thrill seekers
of a particular variety.

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00:01:23,340 --> 00:01:25,676
Rather than seeking
stimulation from activities

13
00:01:25,718 --> 00:01:30,055
such as sky-diving,
hang-gliding
or Russian roulette,

14
00:01:30,097 --> 00:01:32,516
they satisfied
their psychological need

15
00:01:32,558 --> 00:01:37,104
by jeopardizing their freedom
in a succession of larcenies.

16
00:01:39,607 --> 00:01:43,944
They saw themselves as masters
of victimless crimes.

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00:01:46,155 --> 00:01:49,074
This was not
their first undertaking,

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00:01:49,116 --> 00:01:52,661
but it was
their most ambitious, by far.

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00:01:59,585 --> 00:02:01,337
My God, this is like
a confession.

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[woman] Yeah, if it
speaks to you, read it.

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What?

22
00:02:04,715 --> 00:02:06,216
It's a con--
It's unbelievable.

23
00:02:06,258 --> 00:02:07,676
It is a confession.

24
00:02:07,718 --> 00:02:09,637
[woman giggles]

25
00:02:09,678 --> 00:02:10,930
"Thrill Seekers."

26
00:02:10,971 --> 00:02:14,058
Mild little thrill seekers.

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[woman]

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"They saw themselves as masters
of victimless crimes."

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[intense music playing]

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♪ I came to last ♪

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♪ I came to heal it all ♪

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♪ And swindle the best ♪

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♪ On my call they all fall ♪

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♪ Then spring to confess ♪

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00:02:54,181 --> 00:02:58,811
♪ Round here
it's all for the taking ♪

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00:03:00,854 --> 00:03:03,190
♪ Light up my face ♪

37
00:03:03,232 --> 00:03:06,318
♪ Straighten my tie ♪

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♪ Jump off the page ♪

39
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♪ See your hope whizzing by ♪

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♪ But they all like ♪

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♪ That I fed a lie ♪

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♪ They all just sit there
without a care ♪

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♪ And kiss
that wealth goodbye ♪

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All right, so where
should we start?

45
00:03:54,909 --> 00:03:56,619
The big room.

46
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Got a pretty nice collection
of some "Playboy" memorabilia.

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-This is, um, Dansk Mesa.
-And this is all American West.

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-Yeah, this
is a brochure for it.
-Ooh.

49
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Some great hand-signed prints.

50
00:04:24,230 --> 00:04:25,981
-Is it signed?
-No.

51
00:04:26,023 --> 00:04:27,900
-No?
-Might be under
the frame, though.

52
00:04:27,942 --> 00:04:29,985
Okay.

53
00:04:30,027 --> 00:04:31,487
That one's kind of cool, too.

54
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I didn't like it at first,
but...

55
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almost has that...

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[man 2] Feels like
a hotel piece.

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00:04:38,369 --> 00:04:40,746
[man 1] Yeah, hotel art,
exactly.

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[man 3] Some pretty decent stuff
so far.

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-[man 1] It's a much cleaner...
-[man 2] It is much cleaner.

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...much cleaner estate
than the Alter house.

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And the art is better.
[chuckles]

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[man 1] Yeah.
Well, for the most part.

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-For the most part.
-Except for one.
-[men laugh]

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I think you're only
allowed one...

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one find like that
in a lifetime.

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-[man 2] That's enough.
-Yeah.

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[Buck Burns] When we do estates,
walking into a home,

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you do realize you're walking
into somebody's personal life,

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00:05:14,697 --> 00:05:17,157
so you go in there
with that energy.

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00:05:20,202 --> 00:05:23,289
Walking into
the Alters' estate, uh...

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it was kind of like
a time capsule.

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[Dave Van Auker]
The house was strange.

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00:05:32,089 --> 00:05:34,675
The yard was strange.

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There were tiled pyramids
and obelisks in the yard.

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There were
these very strange pillars

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that formed a circle

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that had busts on top of them,

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and it was Shakespeare,
it was Moliere,

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it was Beethoven,
it was different philosophers,

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00:05:52,401 --> 00:05:56,238
different musicians,
artists, composers.

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It was a very creepy feeling.

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In the house, there weren't
a lot of pictures of the kids.

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There were a lot of pictures
of the couple, Jerry and Rita.

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00:06:08,667 --> 00:06:12,421
It was just Jerry and Rita,
Jerry and Rita, Jerry and Rita.

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00:06:12,463 --> 00:06:14,715
You definitely got the sense
that these were kind of

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really cool, hip, beatniky
people who are really with it.

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You know, he was a sax player.

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It looked like she modeled.

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These people
were world travelers.

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[Buck] One room was full
of just the African stuff.

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There was a lot,
you know, shelves of it.

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[Dave] And there
were some spears

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and nice sharp, pointy objects.

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And then, in the hallways
and bedrooms

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were the most hideous paintings
you've ever seen,

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and there were,
I believe, 75 of them.

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[Buck] Yeah, all the paintings

98
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that, I guess, Mr. Alter did.

99
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So strange.

100
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And they were everywhere,
including the bathroom.

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It was very just surreal.

102
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[Dave] Handling their objects...

103
00:07:04,515 --> 00:07:06,976
like some of the stuff
that Jerry had written,

104
00:07:07,017 --> 00:07:08,769
some really strange poetry...

105
00:07:08,811 --> 00:07:13,566
you had this real sense that
they were each other's world.

106
00:07:13,607 --> 00:07:15,067
[camera shutter clicks]

107
00:07:19,113 --> 00:07:21,407
We all three were
walking down the hallway

108
00:07:21,448 --> 00:07:24,034
and Rick went
into the first bedroom,

109
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Buck went into
the second bedroom,

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and I turned and went
into the master bedroom.

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And there was
a mid-century dresser

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that a door was off of
and setting on the floor,

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and so I got down
on my knees

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and I, you know,
kind of shut the door

115
00:07:37,590 --> 00:07:41,260
and reached to pick up
the dresser door.

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And when I did that,
I kind of glanced up

117
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and I saw the painting
that was behind the door.

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And it caught my eye because
it was very mid-century.

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It was kind of, you know, cool.

120
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I called across the hall

121
00:08:08,537 --> 00:08:10,789
to my partner Buck and I said,

122
00:08:10,831 --> 00:08:13,709
"Hey, come over
and take a look at this,
see if you like it."

123
00:08:13,751 --> 00:08:16,295
And... because
we own a guesthouse,
and we thought, you know,

124
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this would be a cool piece
to hang in there.

125
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Horrible frame. [chuckles]

126
00:08:21,175 --> 00:08:22,760
I called it a Walmart frame.

127
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Truthfully,
probably the ugliest painting

128
00:08:27,723 --> 00:08:29,099
I've ever seen in my life.

129
00:08:29,141 --> 00:08:32,144
I would have left it behind
the bedroom door in the house.

130
00:08:32,186 --> 00:08:34,355
[chuckles]

131
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Said, "Oh, okay,
then we'll take that."

132
00:08:35,981 --> 00:08:39,652
I brought it down
in the back seat
of my pickup truck.

133
00:08:39,693 --> 00:08:41,111
Then it went on top

134
00:08:41,153 --> 00:08:44,406
of all of the spears
and jaggedy, you know, items.

135
00:08:44,448 --> 00:08:46,533
And, um, we drove it

136
00:08:46,575 --> 00:08:47,618
back here into town.

137
00:08:47,660 --> 00:08:50,913
We took it off and we
brought it into the store.

138
00:08:50,955 --> 00:08:54,541
It had probably been
in the store maybe ten minutes

139
00:08:54,583 --> 00:08:56,710
and a gentleman walked
in the door

140
00:08:56,752 --> 00:08:58,837
and I heard him say to Buck,

141
00:08:58,879 --> 00:09:00,047
"Is this real?"

142
00:09:02,591 --> 00:09:06,136
I just saw it
standing on the floor there.

143
00:09:06,178 --> 00:09:08,555
I noticed that it said
"de Kooning" at the bottom,

144
00:09:08,597 --> 00:09:11,600
and I was familiar
with de Kooning.

145
00:09:11,642 --> 00:09:14,478
James said, "I'm pretty sure
this is real,

146
00:09:14,520 --> 00:09:17,022
and I'm interested
in buying it if it is."

147
00:09:17,064 --> 00:09:21,527
And I offered Dave
$200,000 for it.

148
00:09:21,569 --> 00:09:24,905
And, of course,
I'm thinking he's kidding,
so I go, "Sold!"

149
00:09:24,947 --> 00:09:28,867
And he walks around
the corner to the desk
and he says, "I'm serious."

150
00:09:28,909 --> 00:09:32,204
I had some... some money
in the bank at the time.

151
00:09:32,246 --> 00:09:34,456
Could have afforded that,
let's put it that way.

152
00:09:34,498 --> 00:09:36,292
He said it could be
worth $200,000,

153
00:09:36,333 --> 00:09:37,751
it could be worth $2 million.

154
00:09:37,793 --> 00:09:41,171
He said, "But you need
to find out, but I
definitely want it."

155
00:09:41,213 --> 00:09:42,506
Since I live in my van,

156
00:09:42,548 --> 00:09:45,301
I keep most of my stuff
in my storage unit.

157
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Probably would have gone
in my storage unit.

158
00:09:49,430 --> 00:09:51,098
We all just kind of look
at each other and say,

159
00:09:51,140 --> 00:09:54,184
you know,
"This is just too weird.
Something's up here."

160
00:09:54,226 --> 00:09:57,897
I kept looking on Google for it,
and four pages deep in Google,

161
00:09:57,938 --> 00:10:01,692
I came across
the "Arizona Republic" article.

162
00:10:03,944 --> 00:10:05,905
It wasn't a heist you'd see
in a Hollywood movie,

163
00:10:05,946 --> 00:10:09,575
but it certainly gained
some notoriety as one of
Tucson's biggest mysteries.

164
00:10:09,617 --> 00:10:14,246
It's been 30 years
since two thieves made off
with a priceless piece of art

165
00:10:14,288 --> 00:10:16,540
from the University of Arizona's
Museum of Art.

166
00:10:16,582 --> 00:10:17,917
This is where
William de Kooning's

167
00:10:17,958 --> 00:10:19,960
"Woman-Ochre" sat 30 years ago,

168
00:10:20,002 --> 00:10:21,712
before it was
cut out of its frame

169
00:10:21,754 --> 00:10:24,506
and simply walked
out the front door.

170
00:10:27,801 --> 00:10:30,012
[peaceful music playing]

171
00:10:37,061 --> 00:10:39,313
[woman] De Kooning is
a towering presence

172
00:10:39,355 --> 00:10:40,814
and he has
a wonderful story.

173
00:10:40,856 --> 00:10:43,734
He stowed away,
came to America,

174
00:10:43,776 --> 00:10:45,402
suffered for decades,

175
00:10:45,444 --> 00:10:46,904
lived on the edge,

176
00:10:46,946 --> 00:10:50,950
and then had
this almost surreal success.

177
00:10:50,991 --> 00:10:54,870
He has a beautiful, forceful,
but elusive brush stroke,

178
00:10:54,912 --> 00:10:57,456
that always has
a sort of kink in it,

179
00:10:57,498 --> 00:11:00,334
as if it's scooting off
in some new direction,

180
00:11:00,376 --> 00:11:02,044
like it's saying goodbye.

181
00:11:05,381 --> 00:11:08,676
He had made one of the best
fancy-pants styles,

182
00:11:08,717 --> 00:11:10,719
his black-and-whites
of the late '40s,

183
00:11:10,761 --> 00:11:12,221
abstract paintings.

184
00:11:12,263 --> 00:11:13,681
So then he moved from there

185
00:11:13,722 --> 00:11:18,519
to this rude, squawky
women series.

186
00:11:23,440 --> 00:11:26,485
[Annalyn Swan]
"Beauty is petulant," he said.

187
00:11:26,527 --> 00:11:29,613
"I like the grotesque,
it's more joyous."

188
00:11:31,615 --> 00:11:34,952
[Annalyn]
De Kooning's 1953 show
with the six big women,

189
00:11:34,994 --> 00:11:37,913
major, major breakthrough.

190
00:11:37,955 --> 00:11:39,290
People woke up.

191
00:11:39,331 --> 00:11:40,499
"Life" magazine realized

192
00:11:40,541 --> 00:11:43,127
we have this homegrown
American art scene,

193
00:11:43,168 --> 00:11:45,337
and it just took off from there.

194
00:11:47,214 --> 00:11:51,719
He became one of the first rock
stars of the American scene.

195
00:11:51,760 --> 00:11:53,304
Then he did another cycle
of paintings,

196
00:11:53,345 --> 00:11:55,931
and that's
where "Woman-Ochre" is.

197
00:11:58,350 --> 00:11:59,810
"Woman-Ochre" was donated

198
00:11:59,852 --> 00:12:05,232
to the University of Arizona
Museum of Art in the early '60s.

199
00:12:05,274 --> 00:12:07,318
The University of Arizona
Museum of Art

200
00:12:07,359 --> 00:12:10,112
was off to one corner
in the campus.

201
00:12:10,154 --> 00:12:12,364
It was not
a gigantic collection,

202
00:12:12,406 --> 00:12:15,159
but it was a really good one.

203
00:12:15,200 --> 00:12:18,662
It was a really great
snapshot in time

204
00:12:18,704 --> 00:12:21,040
of postwar American art.

205
00:12:23,042 --> 00:12:26,879
The "Woman-Ochre"
was sort of the soul

206
00:12:26,921 --> 00:12:29,173
of the museum, that painting.

207
00:12:29,214 --> 00:12:33,510
To have a woman painting here
is very, very special.

208
00:12:49,235 --> 00:12:51,904
These are my working notes

209
00:12:51,946 --> 00:12:53,530
that I've had over the years.

210
00:12:53,572 --> 00:12:55,950
Uh, and...

211
00:12:55,991 --> 00:12:59,161
things that I will refer
back to every once in a while.

212
00:12:59,203 --> 00:13:03,290
Police reports, articles,
handwritten notes, et cetera.

213
00:13:03,332 --> 00:13:05,793
Just things that help me
with the investigation

214
00:13:05,834 --> 00:13:07,836
over the years.

215
00:13:07,878 --> 00:13:11,882
There are specific cases
that each officer

216
00:13:11,924 --> 00:13:13,634
in their career just...

217
00:13:15,886 --> 00:13:18,430
is there for
all of their career,

218
00:13:18,472 --> 00:13:20,099
you know, that they think about.

219
00:13:20,140 --> 00:13:22,518
"What could we have
done better that day?"

220
00:13:22,559 --> 00:13:25,771
"Is there anything
we could have done more of?"

221
00:13:28,607 --> 00:13:30,985
It was the day
after Thanksgiving,

222
00:13:31,026 --> 00:13:34,822
and the campus is pretty much
closed on those days,

223
00:13:34,863 --> 00:13:37,575
however the art museum
is open.

224
00:13:41,996 --> 00:13:46,166
Now, remember,
this was 36 years ago.

225
00:13:46,208 --> 00:13:47,251
[chuckles]

226
00:13:47,293 --> 00:13:51,380
So my memory may be
a little bit rusty.

227
00:13:51,422 --> 00:13:54,258
But I got there
and I was surprised

228
00:13:54,300 --> 00:13:59,722
because there were two people
sitting on the concrete bench

229
00:13:59,763 --> 00:14:01,599
as I approached.

230
00:14:07,271 --> 00:14:08,647
Good morning, John.

231
00:14:08,689 --> 00:14:11,901
What about them?

232
00:14:11,942 --> 00:14:14,904
Sure. We can open up.

233
00:14:32,212 --> 00:14:33,923
[straining]

234
00:14:48,771 --> 00:14:50,272
[door closes]

235
00:14:51,607 --> 00:14:53,359
Go, go, go!

236
00:14:59,949 --> 00:15:02,785
Hi, miss,
I just wanted to ask you

237
00:15:02,826 --> 00:15:04,453
about this painting here.

238
00:15:05,871 --> 00:15:07,623
[water flushing]

239
00:15:09,333 --> 00:15:10,793
Oh.

240
00:15:15,214 --> 00:15:16,423
[cutter rattles]

241
00:15:18,217 --> 00:15:19,551
Excuse me.

242
00:15:19,593 --> 00:15:23,013
Ah, actually, I'm going
to bring you this way...

243
00:15:39,989 --> 00:15:41,115
Okay.

244
00:15:41,156 --> 00:15:43,492
Well, thank you so much.
[laughs]

245
00:15:52,376 --> 00:15:53,586
Did you see that?

246
00:15:59,967 --> 00:16:01,802
Come on, honey!

247
00:16:04,680 --> 00:16:05,973
What are you doing?

248
00:16:14,565 --> 00:16:16,483
Holy shit.

249
00:16:22,156 --> 00:16:24,575
It's a mystery,
an unsolved case,

250
00:16:24,617 --> 00:16:28,704
that has
the folks working here asking,
"Where is the 'Woman-Ochre'"?

251
00:16:28,746 --> 00:16:30,581
Authorities still don't know
who took it.

252
00:16:30,623 --> 00:16:33,000
[reporter] The mystery:
who stole the painting?

253
00:16:35,169 --> 00:16:37,171
After 30 years of doing
these investigations,

254
00:16:37,212 --> 00:16:41,050
I've discovered that there's
basically three types
of thieves.

255
00:16:42,927 --> 00:16:45,846
The first type is
the theft of opportunity.

256
00:16:45,888 --> 00:16:48,349
That's a person
who basically shoplifts.

257
00:16:48,390 --> 00:16:50,601
He goes in,
sees something he likes,

258
00:16:50,643 --> 00:16:53,687
sees an opportunity to steal it,
he takes it.

259
00:16:53,729 --> 00:16:57,775
Most of the collection couldn't
be stolen, it was too big.

260
00:16:57,816 --> 00:17:00,736
This was something you could
cut out and you could roll up

261
00:17:00,778 --> 00:17:02,112
and you could abscond with.

262
00:17:02,154 --> 00:17:05,866
The second is the individuals
who are doing it for money.

263
00:17:05,908 --> 00:17:08,160
That's the largest grouping,
by the way.

264
00:17:08,202 --> 00:17:10,746
They see these crazy numbers
coming out of auction houses.

265
00:17:10,788 --> 00:17:13,832
You know, they think,
"Well, if I can make $5 million
on doing an art theft,

266
00:17:13,874 --> 00:17:15,042
I would do that."

267
00:17:15,084 --> 00:17:16,669
Then there's
the third kind of art thief,

268
00:17:16,710 --> 00:17:18,837
and that's the art thief
who steals for themselves.

269
00:17:18,879 --> 00:17:20,130
They're very rare.

270
00:17:20,172 --> 00:17:23,634
You have somebody that might
fixate on a particular piece,

271
00:17:23,676 --> 00:17:25,719
and they just have to have it.

272
00:17:25,761 --> 00:17:28,722
They feel like,
since they care about it,

273
00:17:28,764 --> 00:17:30,683
they're entitled to have
these pieces.

274
00:17:30,724 --> 00:17:32,184
And those are
the most dangerous,

275
00:17:32,226 --> 00:17:33,936
and they're
the hardest to capture.

276
00:17:33,978 --> 00:17:36,438
And the reason for that is
they don't steal for money,

277
00:17:36,480 --> 00:17:39,525
nor do they steal because
it just happens to be there.

278
00:17:39,567 --> 00:17:42,361
They think about it,
they steal these materials,

279
00:17:42,403 --> 00:17:45,364
they hide them, they keep them
for their eyes only,

280
00:17:45,406 --> 00:17:47,157
and those things go away
for many years

281
00:17:47,199 --> 00:17:48,325
before they come back.

282
00:17:48,367 --> 00:17:50,452
[Bob Cauthorn] "Woman-Ochre"
was a striking painting.

283
00:17:50,494 --> 00:17:53,956
It was more provocative
than most of them.
It really was in your face.

284
00:17:53,998 --> 00:17:57,585
That's what got everybody
so worked up about
the women series to begin with,

285
00:17:57,626 --> 00:17:59,295
that de Kooning punches you.

286
00:17:59,336 --> 00:18:02,673
If you got the right psychology,
you go after that painting,

287
00:18:02,715 --> 00:18:04,758
you take it, you make it yours,
you know?

288
00:18:04,800 --> 00:18:08,053
Uh, those are absolutely
things that could have happened.

289
00:18:11,974 --> 00:18:15,019
But a dominant theory was,
is that it was a contract job,

290
00:18:15,060 --> 00:18:18,480
and that it was a collector
who needed a de Kooning
specifically.

291
00:18:18,522 --> 00:18:20,649
This was your chance to get it
if you wanted a de Kooning.

292
00:18:20,691 --> 00:18:23,319
[clicks tongue] Go for it
right now, really fast.

293
00:18:23,360 --> 00:18:25,321
Day after Thanksgiving.

294
00:18:25,362 --> 00:18:26,655
Slow day.

295
00:18:26,697 --> 00:18:28,616
Sleepy southwest.

296
00:18:32,494 --> 00:18:34,747
I was out doing
Christmas shopping.

297
00:18:34,788 --> 00:18:37,249
What else do you do
the day after Thanksgiving?

298
00:18:37,291 --> 00:18:39,793
And, uh,
back then there were pagers,

299
00:18:39,835 --> 00:18:42,254
so I got this page to call

300
00:18:42,296 --> 00:18:45,341
and, uh, talk to the chief.

301
00:18:47,718 --> 00:18:49,345
From there,
the investigation began.

302
00:18:49,386 --> 00:18:52,181
We immediately brought
the FBI in,

303
00:18:52,222 --> 00:18:53,933
along with Interpol.

304
00:18:53,974 --> 00:18:57,728
We worked hand in hand with
the university police department
at the very beginning.

305
00:18:57,770 --> 00:19:00,272
[Olivia Miller]
The director at the time,
Peter Birmingham,

306
00:19:00,314 --> 00:19:04,777
was simultaneously,
you know, horrified, but also

307
00:19:04,818 --> 00:19:06,612
held out a shred of optimism,
you know.

308
00:19:06,654 --> 00:19:09,323
He said, "We have a 50/50 chance
of recovering it,

309
00:19:09,365 --> 00:19:12,409
and I'm hopeful
that it will be found."

310
00:19:12,451 --> 00:19:15,246
[Bob] First, the FBI said,
"We're gonna get it back,
we're gonna get it back,

311
00:19:15,287 --> 00:19:18,499
we're gonna get it back,"
'cause they assumed it was
gonna hit the market.

312
00:19:18,540 --> 00:19:20,084
You know, the FBI's
got its way.

313
00:19:20,125 --> 00:19:23,045
I mean, people are monitoring,
you know, underground
art markets,

314
00:19:23,087 --> 00:19:25,589
and they do find artwork
that's recovered that way,

315
00:19:25,631 --> 00:19:28,801
but the painting never hit
the market, which continued
that dominant theory, right?

316
00:19:28,842 --> 00:19:33,305
This was a contract job.
Somebody wanted that de Kooning
and wanted it very specifically.

317
00:19:34,807 --> 00:19:36,767
[Brian Seastone] We knew
this was gonna be tough.

318
00:19:36,809 --> 00:19:41,230
There weren't fingerprints.
There just wasn't anything.

319
00:19:41,272 --> 00:19:43,816
We were relying
on the community,

320
00:19:43,857 --> 00:19:45,484
if anybody had seen anything.

321
00:19:45,526 --> 00:19:49,113
We had a psychic call
one day and said that,

322
00:19:49,154 --> 00:19:52,157
uh, they thought they knew
where it was.

323
00:19:52,199 --> 00:19:54,618
I've always said, you always
keep an open mind.

324
00:19:54,660 --> 00:19:56,745
[Bob] I called the FBI.

325
00:19:56,787 --> 00:19:59,415
I would check in on it
to find out what the status was.

326
00:19:59,456 --> 00:20:01,208
There was nothing
to investigate.

327
00:20:01,250 --> 00:20:04,086
[Brian] The leads dried up
very quickly.

328
00:20:04,128 --> 00:20:07,631
[Bob] Basically, a dome of
silence dropped over this thing.

329
00:20:07,673 --> 00:20:11,260
Case was closed in 1987
for lack of leads.

330
00:20:11,302 --> 00:20:15,931
[Bob] They hung the empty frame
for the de Kooning on the wall.

331
00:20:18,726 --> 00:20:20,644
But when we close
an investigation,

332
00:20:20,686 --> 00:20:21,979
that just doesn't mean
we're done,

333
00:20:22,021 --> 00:20:24,023
you know, we're never
gonna look at this again.

334
00:20:24,064 --> 00:20:25,399
It just means, think of it as,

335
00:20:25,441 --> 00:20:28,527
"well, we're gonna put it
on the shelf for a while."

336
00:20:29,653 --> 00:20:31,113
"Woman-Ochre" was, in fact,

337
00:20:31,155 --> 00:20:34,533
on the FBI's top 10
art crimes list.

338
00:20:34,575 --> 00:20:36,744
[Brian] At the time
of the theft, it was valued

339
00:20:36,785 --> 00:20:40,664
at between $300,000
and $400,000.

340
00:20:40,706 --> 00:20:46,045
Now it's valued
somewhere over $160 million.

341
00:20:54,178 --> 00:20:56,847
It's an unsolved case
that still haunts

342
00:20:56,889 --> 00:20:59,433
the University of Arizona
Museum of Art,

343
00:20:59,475 --> 00:21:01,143
but with the upcoming
anniversary,

344
00:21:01,185 --> 00:21:03,145
the museum remains hopeful.

345
00:21:06,106 --> 00:21:08,275
[ringing]

346
00:21:08,317 --> 00:21:09,443
I'll never forget that moment.

347
00:21:09,485 --> 00:21:11,737
I was sitting in my office
and the phone rings,

348
00:21:11,779 --> 00:21:13,614
and it's David
on the other line.

349
00:21:13,656 --> 00:21:15,991
And I'm trying to tell her,

350
00:21:16,033 --> 00:21:18,410
I said, "Look, I'm not crazy,
you know.

351
00:21:18,452 --> 00:21:20,371
I purchased this estate

352
00:21:20,412 --> 00:21:23,499
and this painting was in it,"

353
00:21:23,540 --> 00:21:25,584
and I said,
"It's an exact match."

354
00:21:25,626 --> 00:21:27,795
Me and my coworker
just look at each other,

355
00:21:27,836 --> 00:21:29,338
and our eyes get really big,

356
00:21:29,380 --> 00:21:30,631
and she lunges forward
and says,

357
00:21:30,673 --> 00:21:33,592
"Are we gonna remember
this moment for the rest
of our lives?"

358
00:21:33,634 --> 00:21:36,971
And they asked him to email me
photos of the painting,

359
00:21:37,012 --> 00:21:38,847
details of the signature.

360
00:21:38,889 --> 00:21:41,934
Every time we opened a photo,
we just...

361
00:21:41,976 --> 00:21:44,436
would think, "How do we get
to Silver City?"

362
00:21:44,478 --> 00:21:46,146
You know, this is,
this is "Woman-Ochre."

363
00:21:46,188 --> 00:21:49,567
We contacted the police
department here on campus,

364
00:21:49,608 --> 00:21:51,235
and the police officer said,

365
00:21:51,277 --> 00:21:55,114
"No, you know,
we prefer that there's no
side conversations happening"

366
00:21:55,155 --> 00:21:57,324
and told me
to not contact David anymore,

367
00:21:57,366 --> 00:22:00,369
you know, that they were going
to take over from there.

368
00:22:03,038 --> 00:22:05,374
[Dave] And then that was
the last we heard from them.

369
00:22:05,416 --> 00:22:06,750
It went crickets.

370
00:22:06,792 --> 00:22:09,753
In the meantime,
word has kind of gotten around

371
00:22:09,795 --> 00:22:12,172
to a few people in town,
so people are coming in saying,

372
00:22:12,214 --> 00:22:13,549
"We wanna see the de Kooning."

373
00:22:13,591 --> 00:22:15,968
And so, you know,
we said something like,

374
00:22:16,010 --> 00:22:17,636
"Oh, we took it away."

375
00:22:17,678 --> 00:22:20,472
Then it comes closing time,
and I took it home

376
00:22:20,514 --> 00:22:21,765
and I put it behind my sofa.

377
00:22:21,807 --> 00:22:24,268
I actually went and I got
a couple of guns

378
00:22:24,310 --> 00:22:26,061
out of the gun safe,

379
00:22:26,103 --> 00:22:28,564
because we thought, you know,

380
00:22:28,606 --> 00:22:32,026
a meth head, you know,
has heard that we have this.

381
00:22:32,067 --> 00:22:33,736
I mean, people are killed
for less

382
00:22:33,777 --> 00:22:36,864
than a $100 million painting,
so...

383
00:22:36,906 --> 00:22:39,658
It was terrifying.
Very terrifying.

384
00:22:39,700 --> 00:22:43,412
[Dave] Nobody was calling us.
Why hasn't anyone called us?

385
00:22:43,454 --> 00:22:45,789
Meanwhile,
we're losing our minds,

386
00:22:45,831 --> 00:22:47,708
because we're very nervous,

387
00:22:47,750 --> 00:22:49,293
uh, that he sounded genuine

388
00:22:49,335 --> 00:22:51,211
but we had no idea
who he was,

389
00:22:51,253 --> 00:22:53,672
and we were fearful that

390
00:22:53,714 --> 00:22:56,967
the longer he had
to sit with the painting...

391
00:22:57,009 --> 00:22:59,428
perhaps the more likely
he would be to change his mind

392
00:22:59,470 --> 00:23:03,390
or to try to figure out, uh...
how to keep the painting

393
00:23:03,432 --> 00:23:05,392
or maybe hide it again.

394
00:23:05,434 --> 00:23:07,978
I get a phone call
and I answer it,

395
00:23:08,020 --> 00:23:10,189
and it's somebody
identifying themselves

396
00:23:10,231 --> 00:23:13,901
as "an intellectual
properties attorney,"

397
00:23:13,943 --> 00:23:16,654
and basically is kind of
telling me I'm stupid

398
00:23:16,695 --> 00:23:18,948
and, you know, that I really
need to rethink this.

399
00:23:18,989 --> 00:23:20,699
There's a lot of money
on the table,

400
00:23:20,741 --> 00:23:23,827
millions of dollars
on the table, uh...

401
00:23:23,869 --> 00:23:27,039
So after I, you know,
screamed at him for a minute

402
00:23:27,081 --> 00:23:29,917
and I hung up on him,
I dialed Olivia back.

403
00:23:31,043 --> 00:23:32,211
Hi, Olivia.

404
00:23:32,253 --> 00:23:34,838
This is Dave Van Auker
in Silver City, New Mexico.

405
00:23:34,880 --> 00:23:36,757
I'm the one with
the de Kooning painting.

406
00:23:36,799 --> 00:23:41,095
Now, all of the sudden,
I have vulture attorneys

407
00:23:41,136 --> 00:23:43,305
wanting me to do things,

408
00:23:43,347 --> 00:23:45,349
and I don't wanna do it.

409
00:23:45,391 --> 00:23:46,934
I don't wanna do this.

410
00:23:46,976 --> 00:23:50,563
All I want is that painting
to go back where it belongs,

411
00:23:50,604 --> 00:23:52,523
and I'm just freaking out

412
00:23:52,565 --> 00:23:54,191
because I'm not hearing
from you guys,

413
00:23:54,233 --> 00:23:57,778
and somebody
might cut my throat
for this de Kooning painting.

414
00:23:57,820 --> 00:23:59,071
Keep this on record.

415
00:23:59,113 --> 00:24:01,991
I don't wanna hold it hostage,
I don't wanna hold it ransom,

416
00:24:02,032 --> 00:24:04,285
I want you to have
the painting back.

417
00:24:04,326 --> 00:24:06,829
[Olivia] I'll never
forget that call.

418
00:24:06,870 --> 00:24:09,415
Just the sense of relief,
'cause at that point we thought

419
00:24:09,456 --> 00:24:11,959
we were so close and maybe
we wouldn't get it.

420
00:24:13,919 --> 00:24:16,213
On Friday night,
we had the go-ahead

421
00:24:16,255 --> 00:24:19,425
to go to Silver City
to go and pick up the painting.

422
00:24:19,466 --> 00:24:21,302
[pensive music playing]

423
00:24:39,653 --> 00:24:41,530
[laughter]

424
00:24:48,787 --> 00:24:51,665
[Dave] People ask us
all the time how...

425
00:24:51,707 --> 00:24:54,084
how you could
just do it so easily,
and it's like...

426
00:24:54,126 --> 00:24:55,711
-how could you not?
-How could you not?

427
00:24:55,753 --> 00:24:57,338
And that should be
the question,

428
00:24:57,379 --> 00:24:59,340
"How could you not
do it so easily?"

429
00:25:03,385 --> 00:25:06,639
Many thought
a $160 million masterpiece

430
00:25:06,680 --> 00:25:10,559
stolen from a museum in 1985
was gone forever,

431
00:25:10,601 --> 00:25:13,020
until it turned up
in Silver City.

432
00:25:13,062 --> 00:25:15,397
After the painting
was back at the U of A,

433
00:25:15,439 --> 00:25:18,776
the museum sent it off
to the Getty Museum
in Los Angeles

434
00:25:18,817 --> 00:25:20,653
for its conservation process

435
00:25:20,694 --> 00:25:22,988
to restore the painting
to its original glory

436
00:25:23,030 --> 00:25:25,074
as much as possible,

437
00:25:25,115 --> 00:25:27,284
fixing tears and paint loss.

438
00:25:27,326 --> 00:25:30,996
[reporter] But who took it
and where it went
between Tucson and Silver City

439
00:25:31,038 --> 00:25:33,123
is the next mystery to solve.

440
00:25:40,047 --> 00:25:42,299
[narrator] Ken and Judy
built their fine home,

441
00:25:42,341 --> 00:25:44,718
complete with swimming pool
and extensive gardens,

442
00:25:44,760 --> 00:25:46,345
in rural New Mexico,

443
00:25:46,387 --> 00:25:48,847
and it was now
the showplace of the county.

444
00:25:50,391 --> 00:25:52,893
After Ken's heart attack
at age 65, he thought...

445
00:25:52,935 --> 00:25:55,688
The first chance I get
to hire a good pair of hands

446
00:25:55,729 --> 00:25:57,731
to take over the outside tasks,

447
00:25:57,773 --> 00:25:59,191
I'll do it.

448
00:25:59,233 --> 00:26:01,026
He didn't have to wait long.

449
00:26:01,068 --> 00:26:04,655
-[phone rings]
-He received a phone call
from one of his neighbors.

450
00:26:04,697 --> 00:26:06,156
Hello.

451
00:26:08,033 --> 00:26:09,034
Yes.

452
00:26:09,076 --> 00:26:11,453
A rancher who had hired
a Mexican laborer

453
00:26:11,495 --> 00:26:13,205
to rebuild some fences.

454
00:26:16,375 --> 00:26:18,210
Wonderful.

455
00:26:18,252 --> 00:26:20,129
All right, we'll talk soon.

456
00:26:27,219 --> 00:26:30,973
José was a very good worker,
honest, never complained,

457
00:26:31,015 --> 00:26:33,517
and was worth several times
the amount generally paid

458
00:26:33,559 --> 00:26:35,978
to illegal immigrant
itinerant workers.

459
00:26:40,691 --> 00:26:43,527
Ken couldn't have wished
for a better worker.

460
00:26:45,321 --> 00:26:47,364
The food and few dollars
this would cost

461
00:26:47,406 --> 00:26:49,366
would be the best bargain
he ever made.

462
00:26:50,910 --> 00:26:52,578
He was now free
to do some writing,

463
00:26:52,620 --> 00:26:56,957
a secret ambition he always had
but never had the time to try,

464
00:26:56,999 --> 00:26:58,334
until now.

465
00:26:58,375 --> 00:27:00,377
[typewriter keys clacking]

466
00:27:06,675 --> 00:27:08,677
[wind whistling]

467
00:27:30,991 --> 00:27:35,412
[Ron Roseman]
Rita and Jerry Alter
were my aunt and uncle.

468
00:27:39,375 --> 00:27:41,794
Rita Alter was
my mother's sister.

469
00:27:41,835 --> 00:27:44,588
She was just very sweet.

470
00:27:44,630 --> 00:27:48,759
I became a teacher
because of my aunt and uncle.

471
00:27:48,801 --> 00:27:50,844
I just admired them.

472
00:27:53,931 --> 00:27:58,018
My aunt had a bachelor's
in education,

473
00:27:58,060 --> 00:28:01,105
a master's in speech pathology.

474
00:28:01,146 --> 00:28:03,357
I actually had Rita

475
00:28:03,399 --> 00:28:05,317
as one of my teachers

476
00:28:05,359 --> 00:28:08,112
or a specialist
when I was little.

477
00:28:08,153 --> 00:28:11,156
I had a hard time
pronouncing words,

478
00:28:11,198 --> 00:28:13,576
so I had her
when I was in grade school.

479
00:28:13,617 --> 00:28:15,035
She was a nice lady.

480
00:28:15,077 --> 00:28:16,328
She was real nice.

481
00:28:16,370 --> 00:28:19,790
Uncle Jerry,
he was a music teacher

482
00:28:19,832 --> 00:28:22,001
for the New York City
public schools.

483
00:28:22,042 --> 00:28:25,796
When they moved to New Mexico,

484
00:28:25,838 --> 00:28:27,423
my uncle retired.

485
00:28:28,966 --> 00:28:32,094
Here's some pictures of him
playing his clarinet.

486
00:28:32,136 --> 00:28:35,139
I don't know who took this,
but it's kind of neat.

487
00:28:35,180 --> 00:28:40,144
I met Jerry Alter in 1965,

488
00:28:40,185 --> 00:28:43,230
when I entered fifth grade.

489
00:28:43,272 --> 00:28:46,942
And I had him
for an orchestra class.

490
00:28:46,984 --> 00:28:51,113
Jerry Alter went around
like an itinerant teacher

491
00:28:51,155 --> 00:28:54,283
to different classes
and would teach music.

492
00:28:54,325 --> 00:28:59,288
Mr. Alter was very, um, vibrant.

493
00:28:59,330 --> 00:29:02,833
Music has just been
so important in my life,

494
00:29:02,875 --> 00:29:07,630
and he was the first person
to give me music.

495
00:29:07,671 --> 00:29:10,591
He was very empowering,
very motivating.

496
00:29:10,633 --> 00:29:13,969
He made me feel
like I mattered.

497
00:29:14,011 --> 00:29:16,263
Mr. Alter was just
a genuinely nice,

498
00:29:16,305 --> 00:29:18,349
uplifting person.

499
00:29:20,768 --> 00:29:24,271
[Carole Sklar] My mother and I
walk into a store,

500
00:29:24,313 --> 00:29:27,733
and who do we see but Jerry,
my brother,

501
00:29:27,775 --> 00:29:30,444
and out walks Rita

502
00:29:30,486 --> 00:29:33,989
in a one-piece
white bathing suit,

503
00:29:34,031 --> 00:29:37,201
looking very beautiful.

504
00:29:37,243 --> 00:29:39,620
That was how we met Rita.

505
00:29:39,662 --> 00:29:41,622
I thought that was kind of cute.

506
00:29:41,664 --> 00:29:44,458
Especially since
they lasted forever.

507
00:29:44,500 --> 00:29:46,835
[Ron] Oh, they were
definitely soulmates,

508
00:29:46,877 --> 00:29:48,754
and you could just
see it in their eyes

509
00:29:48,796 --> 00:29:51,006
that they adored
one another.

510
00:29:51,048 --> 00:29:52,549
He would do anything for her.

511
00:29:55,803 --> 00:29:58,430
We would see them
every summer growing up.

512
00:29:58,472 --> 00:30:01,809
Always looked forward
to visiting them.

513
00:30:01,850 --> 00:30:03,269
They were exciting.

514
00:30:03,310 --> 00:30:07,064
They always had
interesting stories to tell,

515
00:30:07,106 --> 00:30:08,857
uh, about their travels.

516
00:30:08,899 --> 00:30:12,444
You know, I just admired
their... their lifestyle.

517
00:30:20,744 --> 00:30:23,581
Here is their list
of, uh...

518
00:30:23,622 --> 00:30:26,834
all the places they visited

519
00:30:26,875 --> 00:30:28,335
from 1957,

520
00:30:28,377 --> 00:30:31,547
so they got married
in June of '57.

521
00:30:31,589 --> 00:30:33,591
That was their honeymoon trip.

522
00:30:33,632 --> 00:30:37,219
And their last trip was 2010.

523
00:30:37,261 --> 00:30:41,807
Their travels were
their life accomplishment.

524
00:30:44,268 --> 00:30:46,020
Rita and I worked together,

525
00:30:46,061 --> 00:30:47,229
and one evening she said,

526
00:30:47,271 --> 00:30:50,107
"Would you and Rick and
the girls have dinner with us?"

527
00:30:51,567 --> 00:30:54,320
We saw pictures
of some of their travels,

528
00:30:54,361 --> 00:30:56,780
and, oh my God,
every trip was like

529
00:30:56,822 --> 00:30:59,033
truly an adventure.

530
00:30:59,074 --> 00:31:00,367
[Rick Miller] Yeah, very unique.

531
00:31:00,409 --> 00:31:02,703
[Christy Miller] It wasn't just,
"Let's get on a plane

532
00:31:02,745 --> 00:31:05,372
and go see
a few monuments and..."

533
00:31:05,414 --> 00:31:09,877
-[Rick M.] Yeah, they didn't
travel in luxury.
-[Christy] No.

534
00:31:09,919 --> 00:31:12,796
[Rick M.] They were much more
adventurous, you know.

535
00:31:12,838 --> 00:31:14,590
If they would go to Tahiti,

536
00:31:14,632 --> 00:31:16,634
they would go to Tahiti
for a month

537
00:31:16,675 --> 00:31:18,510
and live in a hut
on the beach.

538
00:31:18,552 --> 00:31:19,720
[Christy] Right.

539
00:31:19,762 --> 00:31:22,681
[Rick M.] Um, or they would go
on a safari in Africa.

540
00:31:22,723 --> 00:31:24,391
They would go to Alaska.

541
00:31:24,433 --> 00:31:28,062
Um, they just went
to very exotic places.

542
00:31:28,103 --> 00:31:31,273
And that was all
very exciting to hear about.

543
00:31:34,443 --> 00:31:37,279
[Carole] In my studio,
there are several things

544
00:31:37,321 --> 00:31:41,283
that Jerry and Rita gave us
from their travels.

545
00:31:43,577 --> 00:31:45,579
These two figures,

546
00:31:45,621 --> 00:31:47,289
male and female,

547
00:31:47,331 --> 00:31:50,334
they look war-like.

548
00:31:50,376 --> 00:31:52,962
They wrote from their trips.

549
00:31:53,003 --> 00:31:56,423
Who wrote this one?
Jerry and Rita. Okay.

550
00:31:56,465 --> 00:31:59,593
"Carib dancers."

551
00:31:59,635 --> 00:32:03,222
In this Anguilla place.

552
00:32:03,264 --> 00:32:05,516
"Hi, Carole and Martin.

553
00:32:05,557 --> 00:32:07,685
This is the best beach
in Anguilla

554
00:32:07,726 --> 00:32:10,563
where we spend
most of our days swimming

555
00:32:10,604 --> 00:32:13,691
and in the sparkling water
and snorkeling

556
00:32:13,732 --> 00:32:15,609
on the fish-filled reefs."

557
00:32:15,651 --> 00:32:17,570
[Ron] My aunt was a recorder,

558
00:32:17,611 --> 00:32:19,154
she recorded everything,

559
00:32:19,196 --> 00:32:20,948
particularly about her trips.

560
00:32:20,990 --> 00:32:23,325
And she had a journal

561
00:32:23,367 --> 00:32:26,120
that she took on her trips.

562
00:32:26,161 --> 00:32:30,040
The itineraries she would
make out would be very precise.

563
00:32:32,876 --> 00:32:34,962
That was always part
of a trip,

564
00:32:35,004 --> 00:32:37,047
you'd sit down and see
the slides

565
00:32:37,089 --> 00:32:39,174
of their latest adventure.

566
00:32:39,216 --> 00:32:44,847
Sometimes the slide shows
were a little much.

567
00:32:46,223 --> 00:32:48,183
Their life revolved
around that.

568
00:32:48,225 --> 00:32:51,020
-It did.
-Planning the next trip.

569
00:32:51,061 --> 00:32:54,690
[Rick M.] I think
that's what they lived for.

570
00:32:54,732 --> 00:32:57,735
[Ron] On some level,
I, you know,

571
00:32:57,776 --> 00:32:59,737
I wished they were my parents.

572
00:32:59,778 --> 00:33:01,530
They were just cool.

573
00:33:05,409 --> 00:33:09,747
Well, my uncle passed away
when he was 81.

574
00:33:09,788 --> 00:33:12,333
He was five years older
than my aunt.

575
00:33:12,374 --> 00:33:15,794
When we discovered my aunt
had Alzheimer's disease,

576
00:33:15,836 --> 00:33:19,632
uh, we came out to visit her
within a month or so

577
00:33:19,673 --> 00:33:22,259
and she named me as executor,

578
00:33:22,301 --> 00:33:25,930
building the estate to divide
between her two children.

579
00:33:25,971 --> 00:33:28,474
The kids both had some issues.

580
00:33:28,515 --> 00:33:31,977
[Rick M.] Her son, I don't
believe he was able to work,

581
00:33:32,019 --> 00:33:34,396
and I think Rita would go
to check on him,

582
00:33:34,438 --> 00:33:35,856
to make sure he was okay.

583
00:33:35,898 --> 00:33:38,317
She had asked me
to make sure particularly

584
00:33:38,359 --> 00:33:40,236
her son was taken care of.

585
00:33:42,488 --> 00:33:44,448
She passed away
from a stroke

586
00:33:44,490 --> 00:33:46,784
not too many months later.

587
00:33:49,203 --> 00:33:52,373
It felt like
a great responsibility

588
00:33:52,414 --> 00:33:55,167
to make sure that, uh,

589
00:33:55,209 --> 00:33:58,045
I wasn't throwing away
anything important.

590
00:34:00,005 --> 00:34:03,550
Their house was full
of souvenirs

591
00:34:03,592 --> 00:34:06,095
from their travels
around the world.

592
00:34:06,136 --> 00:34:11,016
It just had this real sense
of mystery to it.

593
00:34:13,811 --> 00:34:17,064
It's almost like going
into a little museum.

594
00:34:17,106 --> 00:34:21,277
It was just this big mess of,
"who are we gonna find,

595
00:34:21,318 --> 00:34:23,404
who's even gonna want
any of this stuff?"

596
00:34:23,445 --> 00:34:26,240
You know, "is any of this
worth anything?"

597
00:34:26,282 --> 00:34:27,449
Uh, that's... [laughs]

598
00:34:27,491 --> 00:34:29,243
That's really funny.

599
00:34:29,285 --> 00:34:31,954
"Is any of this worth anything?"

600
00:34:34,707 --> 00:34:36,792
[Ron] I called, you know,

601
00:34:36,834 --> 00:34:39,461
a couple dozen universities
and art museums

602
00:34:39,503 --> 00:34:43,048
and sent them pictures
of, you know, what I had,

603
00:34:43,090 --> 00:34:45,217
which included the de Kooning.

604
00:34:45,259 --> 00:34:48,220
I sent it to the Met, MoMA,
the Smithsonian,

605
00:34:48,262 --> 00:34:51,807
universities in New Mexico.

606
00:34:51,849 --> 00:34:54,476
I got no offers,

607
00:34:54,518 --> 00:34:59,481
either, you know,
for payment or for donation.

608
00:35:02,902 --> 00:35:05,779
[Isaac Roseman] My dad's role
is to, uh...

609
00:35:05,821 --> 00:35:09,491
either auction or sell off
the contents of the estate

610
00:35:09,533 --> 00:35:14,538
for the trust of Joey
and Barbara Alter, the kids.

611
00:35:17,333 --> 00:35:20,419
[Ron] Silver City seemed
to be the most practical place

612
00:35:20,461 --> 00:35:24,632
to look to sell the things
that my cousins didn't want

613
00:35:24,673 --> 00:35:28,552
and hopefully build up
part of the estate.

614
00:35:28,594 --> 00:35:33,807
I called Manzanita Ridge,
and I sold them furniture,

615
00:35:33,849 --> 00:35:37,436
paintings, bedding
and any of those knickknacks

616
00:35:37,478 --> 00:35:41,523
that the museums
weren't interested in.

617
00:35:41,565 --> 00:35:45,444
One thing did belong
in a museum.

618
00:35:45,486 --> 00:35:46,779
[laughs]

619
00:35:46,820 --> 00:35:49,615
And we found that out, um...

620
00:35:49,657 --> 00:35:51,325
[laughs]

621
00:35:51,367 --> 00:35:54,245
...in a very awkward way.

622
00:35:54,286 --> 00:35:57,539
[Ron] There was a call,
and she said, "This is the FBI,"

623
00:35:57,581 --> 00:36:01,502
and she said, "You're not
in trouble in any way.

624
00:36:01,543 --> 00:36:03,337
We just need some information."

625
00:36:03,379 --> 00:36:06,590
And then she proceeded
to explain what was found

626
00:36:06,632 --> 00:36:10,094
in my aunt and uncle's
possessions.

627
00:36:10,135 --> 00:36:13,264
I'm not sure I'd ever been
this shocked.

628
00:36:13,305 --> 00:36:16,475
[Carole] My God, you know.

629
00:36:16,517 --> 00:36:17,851
I didn't know.

630
00:36:17,893 --> 00:36:19,895
I had no idea

631
00:36:19,937 --> 00:36:23,148
that this painting
was in their house.

632
00:36:23,190 --> 00:36:24,942
[woman]

633
00:36:26,443 --> 00:36:28,779
Yeah, we were very surprised,
very surprised.

634
00:36:28,821 --> 00:36:29,989
In Cliff, you know.

635
00:36:30,030 --> 00:36:32,616
Nothing had ever happened
in Cliff.

636
00:36:32,658 --> 00:36:36,245
[western music playing]

637
00:36:36,287 --> 00:36:40,624
[Mike Burns]
Cliff is more than 50 miles
from the nearest interstate.

638
00:36:40,666 --> 00:36:42,793
Cliff is your destination.

639
00:36:42,835 --> 00:36:45,713
It's not what I would call
a pass-through community.

640
00:36:49,049 --> 00:36:53,053
If it's news that's fit
to print or be discussed,

641
00:36:53,095 --> 00:36:55,514
it's gonna be discussed
at this convenience store,

642
00:36:55,556 --> 00:36:58,225
sells a little bit of liquor.

643
00:36:58,267 --> 00:37:01,186
[man] Movie company's here
and they're making a movie.

644
00:37:02,313 --> 00:37:04,023
No, really.

645
00:37:04,064 --> 00:37:07,818
Yeah, you need to get up here
so you can get in it.

646
00:37:07,860 --> 00:37:11,655
[man 2]
Be sure and get a picture
of my gun up there on the wall.

647
00:37:15,951 --> 00:37:19,788
And then they found
that painting behind the door.

648
00:37:21,415 --> 00:37:22,833
[man] Yeah.

649
00:37:22,875 --> 00:37:26,295
Wasn't it worth about 300,000?

650
00:37:28,505 --> 00:37:30,341
160-- Yeah.

651
00:37:30,382 --> 00:37:31,800
My God.

652
00:37:31,842 --> 00:37:34,720
Wow, you know,
that just was crazy to me

653
00:37:34,762 --> 00:37:38,557
that it was just hanging up
on their wall all those years.

654
00:37:38,599 --> 00:37:40,601
But I would have never figured
that that painting

655
00:37:40,643 --> 00:37:43,354
was worth anything
just by glancing at it.

656
00:37:43,395 --> 00:37:48,442
[Ron] When I first saw it,
I...

657
00:37:48,484 --> 00:37:52,279
I'm not a terribly big fan,
personally, of modern art.

658
00:37:52,321 --> 00:37:54,240
It didn't impress me
a whole lot.

659
00:37:54,281 --> 00:37:58,994
On the esthetically beautiful,
I would say no.

660
00:37:59,036 --> 00:38:01,330
Well, my personal opinion,

661
00:38:01,372 --> 00:38:04,750
I wouldn't give you $5 for it.

662
00:38:04,792 --> 00:38:07,920
And when I look at it,
it doesn't...

663
00:38:07,962 --> 00:38:10,047
make any sense to me.

664
00:38:10,089 --> 00:38:13,801
I could make a lot of people mad
if I say this,

665
00:38:13,842 --> 00:38:18,472
um, but if you've ever seen
pictures of bonobo apes

666
00:38:18,514 --> 00:38:22,101
and the stuff that they paint,

667
00:38:22,142 --> 00:38:24,979
it's kind of similar.

668
00:38:25,020 --> 00:38:26,522
[laughing]

669
00:38:26,564 --> 00:38:28,065
Growing up in this area,
you know,

670
00:38:28,107 --> 00:38:32,695
we're into western-type scenery
and cattle or horses or deer.

671
00:38:32,736 --> 00:38:34,822
Tim Cox to me,
he's the artist, you know.

672
00:38:34,863 --> 00:38:36,031
Yeah.

673
00:38:36,073 --> 00:38:39,952
No offense to this, whoever
painted this and all that.

674
00:38:39,994 --> 00:38:42,955
Tim Cox, and if I was to find
one of his paintings

675
00:38:42,997 --> 00:38:45,249
on somebody's wall or door
or something like that,

676
00:38:45,291 --> 00:38:46,875
I would pay attention to it,
you know,

677
00:38:46,917 --> 00:38:50,296
and if I found one
that was hidden, it would
be suspicious all right.

678
00:38:50,337 --> 00:38:52,881
But to see something
like that...

679
00:38:52,923 --> 00:38:55,384
it wouldn't have made me
suspicious at all.

680
00:38:55,426 --> 00:38:57,052
I'd have thought they probably
put it back there

681
00:38:57,094 --> 00:38:59,054
'cause it was so ugly
or something.

682
00:38:59,096 --> 00:39:01,849
Yeah. [laughing]

683
00:39:05,436 --> 00:39:08,564
When we first heard
about the painting,

684
00:39:08,606 --> 00:39:11,775
I think, deep down,
I didn't want to believe it,

685
00:39:11,817 --> 00:39:14,236
because I really liked Rita.

686
00:39:14,278 --> 00:39:17,239
If they took
this valuable painting

687
00:39:17,281 --> 00:39:21,076
worth $150 million,
$160 million,

688
00:39:21,118 --> 00:39:23,078
what was the point if they
were just going to hang it

689
00:39:23,120 --> 00:39:25,039
on the wall
behind their bedroom door?

690
00:39:25,080 --> 00:39:26,916
It's not like they sold it.

691
00:39:26,957 --> 00:39:29,335
[Marvin Strange]
School teacher at the school

692
00:39:29,376 --> 00:39:31,503
stealing paintings, I mean...

693
00:39:31,545 --> 00:39:33,631
[chuckles]

694
00:39:33,672 --> 00:39:36,592
But we did wonder how
they funded their travel.

695
00:39:36,634 --> 00:39:38,552
[Christy] It would be like
two or three

696
00:39:38,594 --> 00:39:39,678
trips a year, maybe.

697
00:39:39,720 --> 00:39:41,513
And I know how much
teachers make,

698
00:39:41,555 --> 00:39:45,601
so where did the money come from
to live this lifestyle?

699
00:39:47,353 --> 00:39:50,606
I think they took it.
I think it was them.

700
00:39:50,648 --> 00:39:52,233
[Dave] The very first time
I saw it,

701
00:39:52,274 --> 00:39:54,109
it was like, "How odd."

702
00:39:54,151 --> 00:39:55,986
Nobody would hang
a painting here.

703
00:39:56,028 --> 00:39:58,781
[Buck] There was even
a screw in the doorjamb

704
00:39:58,822 --> 00:40:01,659
that prevented the door
from being opened all the way,

705
00:40:01,700 --> 00:40:04,453
I'm assuming to preserve,
maybe, the doorknob

706
00:40:04,495 --> 00:40:05,621
from hitting the painting.

707
00:40:05,663 --> 00:40:07,831
It was definitely hidden.

708
00:40:07,873 --> 00:40:09,166
-It was solely for them.
-Yeah.

709
00:40:09,208 --> 00:40:11,627
It was purely for their benefit,
for their enjoyment.

710
00:40:11,669 --> 00:40:14,296
It was not
for anybody else to see.

711
00:40:16,799 --> 00:40:20,469
[Rick M.] There certainly are
unanswered questions.

712
00:40:22,846 --> 00:40:24,556
And they were in Tucson.

713
00:40:28,561 --> 00:40:30,604
[Ron] Probably
once every three years

714
00:40:30,646 --> 00:40:33,274
they'd come to my parents' house
for Thanksgiving,

715
00:40:33,315 --> 00:40:36,860
and, uh, at the time, in 1985,

716
00:40:36,902 --> 00:40:39,530
we were living
in the Tucson area.

717
00:40:43,075 --> 00:40:46,745
And this is the photo in, uh...

718
00:40:46,787 --> 00:40:48,414
November '85.

719
00:40:48,455 --> 00:40:55,045
Thanksgiving, with my aunt
and uncle visiting us.

720
00:40:55,087 --> 00:40:57,214
They were very active people,

721
00:40:57,256 --> 00:40:59,300
and when they would come
on Thanksgiving,

722
00:40:59,341 --> 00:41:00,426
they'd stay the night

723
00:41:00,467 --> 00:41:04,096
and take off
in the morning to hike.

724
00:41:04,138 --> 00:41:07,975
And that's the date
the theft happened.

725
00:41:08,017 --> 00:41:11,312
As we were going through stuff,
we found these travel journals

726
00:41:11,353 --> 00:41:12,980
that the Alters kept,

727
00:41:13,022 --> 00:41:15,065
and what was kind
of interesting about them is

728
00:41:15,107 --> 00:41:17,151
they noted, every time
they left Cliff,

729
00:41:17,192 --> 00:41:20,195
every time they went anywhere
for more than a day,

730
00:41:20,237 --> 00:41:21,864
they wrote it down.

731
00:41:21,906 --> 00:41:26,619
Thanksgiving 1985
was left completely blank,

732
00:41:26,660 --> 00:41:28,662
which we found fascinating.

733
00:41:28,704 --> 00:41:32,583
And then, you know,
then we're right back
into taking notes again,

734
00:41:32,625 --> 00:41:34,209
right after.

735
00:41:34,251 --> 00:41:36,420
[Ron] The thing I remember
most is,

736
00:41:36,462 --> 00:41:39,131
my uncle was showing off
his car.

737
00:41:39,173 --> 00:41:42,384
His... You know, they drove
there in their sports car.

738
00:41:42,426 --> 00:41:46,347
They drove their red
Toyota Supra that day.

739
00:41:46,388 --> 00:41:49,308
The small description
that we had of the vehicle--

740
00:41:49,350 --> 00:41:50,768
rust-colored car.

741
00:41:55,022 --> 00:41:57,107
[Dave] This is
what few little bits

742
00:41:57,149 --> 00:41:58,901
of photographs and stuff we had.

743
00:41:58,943 --> 00:42:00,819
And, you know,
some of the things

744
00:42:00,861 --> 00:42:04,823
that we found fascinating
were the red sports car.

745
00:42:04,865 --> 00:42:06,367
And then we found it
fascinating that,

746
00:42:06,408 --> 00:42:09,286
in the description
of the woman leaving,

747
00:42:09,328 --> 00:42:10,746
she was wearing a red coat,

748
00:42:10,788 --> 00:42:13,540
and the drawing is
exactly this red coat.

749
00:42:13,582 --> 00:42:16,085
And these pictures are 1985.

750
00:42:16,126 --> 00:42:18,963
The envelope that they
came out of said 1985.

751
00:42:19,004 --> 00:42:21,131
There's snow
on the mountain behind,

752
00:42:21,173 --> 00:42:25,261
so this either happened
right before the theft

753
00:42:25,302 --> 00:42:26,637
or right after.

754
00:42:26,679 --> 00:42:28,305
Probably within a month.

755
00:42:28,347 --> 00:42:30,140
[Brian] We were able

756
00:42:30,182 --> 00:42:32,351
to get some composites

757
00:42:32,393 --> 00:42:35,437
of the two people.

758
00:42:35,479 --> 00:42:38,232
Wow, that sure looks
like he did.

759
00:42:38,274 --> 00:42:40,568
And it looks like her.

760
00:42:40,609 --> 00:42:44,071
It looked pretty similar
to my great aunt and uncle.

761
00:42:44,113 --> 00:42:45,447
I see a resemblance.

762
00:42:52,204 --> 00:42:53,664
Yeah, it looks like them.

763
00:42:53,706 --> 00:42:55,666
The same hair.

764
00:42:55,708 --> 00:42:57,084
Maybe he had a fake mustache

765
00:42:57,126 --> 00:42:58,919
the day he did the actual theft.

766
00:42:58,961 --> 00:43:02,339
The mustache looked like
a theatrical mustache.

767
00:43:02,381 --> 00:43:03,924
It did not look real.

768
00:43:03,966 --> 00:43:06,218
But it does look like
both of them.

769
00:43:06,260 --> 00:43:09,638
There's a saying that there
are no coincidences,

770
00:43:09,680 --> 00:43:13,309
but there's
so many coincidences

771
00:43:13,350 --> 00:43:16,270
that it's hard to dismiss that

772
00:43:16,312 --> 00:43:18,564
as a very strong possibility.

773
00:43:18,606 --> 00:43:20,858
Man, I, uh...

774
00:43:20,900 --> 00:43:23,736
You know, if they really
came and smiled

775
00:43:23,777 --> 00:43:27,197
and had a great time with us,
all the time planning,

776
00:43:27,239 --> 00:43:30,326
it's just weird that, uh,

777
00:43:30,367 --> 00:43:31,827
they could go through

778
00:43:31,869 --> 00:43:33,370
and have
just another Thanksgiving

779
00:43:33,412 --> 00:43:36,457
with my aunt and uncle
and cousin.

780
00:43:36,498 --> 00:43:39,418
Uh, it's compelling, right?
But it's not definitive.

781
00:43:39,460 --> 00:43:44,256
I still would like to think that
this isn't my aunt and uncle.

782
00:43:46,967 --> 00:43:49,470
I don't believe it,

783
00:43:49,511 --> 00:43:51,472
but then I think...

784
00:43:52,556 --> 00:43:55,476
I... yeah, I do believe it.

785
00:43:55,517 --> 00:43:57,353
Well, I mean, you know,

786
00:43:57,394 --> 00:44:00,272
I don't know.

787
00:44:00,314 --> 00:44:02,191
[typewriter bell dings]

788
00:44:05,402 --> 00:44:07,404
[typewriter keys clacking]

789
00:44:18,040 --> 00:44:22,086
[Carole] Rita was sweet
and good and lovely,

790
00:44:22,127 --> 00:44:25,881
and I couldn't see that
as my brother,

791
00:44:25,923 --> 00:44:28,384
my sister-in-law,

792
00:44:28,425 --> 00:44:30,177
my family,

793
00:44:30,219 --> 00:44:32,513
doing something like that.

794
00:44:37,017 --> 00:44:40,062
These books are...

795
00:44:40,104 --> 00:44:44,483
the three that Jerry wrote.

796
00:44:44,525 --> 00:44:46,569
And in this one,

797
00:44:46,610 --> 00:44:49,989
it's called
"The Cup and the Lip."

798
00:44:50,030 --> 00:44:52,074
These photos are his photos,

799
00:44:52,116 --> 00:44:54,159
of course, on the cover.

800
00:44:54,201 --> 00:44:56,579
And it's a book

801
00:44:56,620 --> 00:44:58,497
of short stories

802
00:44:58,539 --> 00:45:00,708
of travels

803
00:45:00,749 --> 00:45:02,042
and other invent--

804
00:45:02,084 --> 00:45:04,545
Well, some are...

805
00:45:04,587 --> 00:45:07,965
Well, I think that all artists

806
00:45:08,007 --> 00:45:10,551
have a right to invent

807
00:45:10,593 --> 00:45:12,636
anything they want to.

808
00:45:12,678 --> 00:45:15,347
It's your freedom, you know.

809
00:45:15,389 --> 00:45:17,266
-Here it is.
-Guess what I found.

810
00:45:17,308 --> 00:45:18,642
Yep, there it is.

811
00:45:21,145 --> 00:45:22,521
Manuscript

812
00:45:22,563 --> 00:45:27,151
for "The Cup and the Lip."

813
00:45:27,192 --> 00:45:29,403
When he published the book,

814
00:45:29,445 --> 00:45:34,491
he contacted me and asked
if I'd like a copy.

815
00:45:34,533 --> 00:45:37,286
And he was very excited
about it.

816
00:45:37,328 --> 00:45:40,205
So I read
the first couple stories.

817
00:45:40,247 --> 00:45:42,958
There's just so much writing.

818
00:45:43,000 --> 00:45:45,544
I personally didn't find them
very interesting.

819
00:45:45,586 --> 00:45:48,631
So, yeah, this is
"Thrill Seekers,"

820
00:45:48,672 --> 00:45:50,716
part of the manuscript
from Jerry.

821
00:45:50,758 --> 00:45:54,762
Uh, "Georges and Suzie
were almost breathless
with anticipation

822
00:45:54,803 --> 00:45:57,264
as they approached
the expansive entryway
to the museum."

823
00:45:57,306 --> 00:46:01,560
"At home in Paris,
Georges and Suzie lived
a conservative life,"

824
00:46:01,602 --> 00:46:03,604
comma, "ostensibly."

825
00:46:03,646 --> 00:46:04,939
"But they had a double life."

826
00:46:04,980 --> 00:46:06,482
"Highly acquisitive by nature...

827
00:46:06,523 --> 00:46:09,193
both were thrill seekers
of a particular variety."

828
00:46:09,235 --> 00:46:14,823
"They saw themselves as masters
of victimless crimes."

829
00:46:14,865 --> 00:46:16,533
Wow.

830
00:46:16,575 --> 00:46:18,077
Yeah, it's... [chuckles]

831
00:46:18,118 --> 00:46:19,703
I mean, yeah,
so you look at these.

832
00:46:19,745 --> 00:46:21,455
"This is not
their first undertaking,

833
00:46:21,497 --> 00:46:23,958
but it was their most
ambitious, by far."

834
00:46:23,999 --> 00:46:27,461
It... it describes them.

835
00:46:27,503 --> 00:46:31,799
They were talking
about themselves.

836
00:46:33,634 --> 00:46:34,927
[Dave] One of the travel agents

837
00:46:34,969 --> 00:46:37,513
that used to book
their things said,

838
00:46:37,554 --> 00:46:38,639
"I'm sure they did it."

839
00:46:38,681 --> 00:46:40,266
And we're like,
"Why are you sure?"

840
00:46:40,307 --> 00:46:42,518
And she said, "'Cause they
were adrenaline junkies."

841
00:46:42,559 --> 00:46:44,979
They would book a flight
into a country

842
00:46:45,020 --> 00:46:46,605
and they would make
arrangements

843
00:46:46,647 --> 00:46:47,898
for somebody to smuggle them

844
00:46:47,940 --> 00:46:50,442
into a country that they
weren't allowed to go into.

845
00:46:50,484 --> 00:46:52,778
This little old man
and his little old lady

846
00:46:52,820 --> 00:46:54,655
were adrenaline junkies.

847
00:46:57,116 --> 00:46:59,785
This is one I thought
was kind of, um...

848
00:46:59,827 --> 00:47:03,038
interesting
because I don't think

849
00:47:03,080 --> 00:47:04,164
"The Eye of the Jaguar"

850
00:47:04,206 --> 00:47:06,041
is in the table of contents.

851
00:47:06,083 --> 00:47:10,045
But I think the story made it.

852
00:47:11,672 --> 00:47:13,465
[narrator]
One afternoon at 4 p.m.,

853
00:47:13,507 --> 00:47:15,342
a well-dressed woman
in her late middle age,

854
00:47:15,384 --> 00:47:17,803
accompanied by
her 14-year-old granddaughter,

855
00:47:17,845 --> 00:47:19,888
entered the museum.

856
00:47:19,930 --> 00:47:22,850
After making a one-hour tour
through all the rooms,

857
00:47:22,891 --> 00:47:25,144
they stopped
to more closely examine

858
00:47:25,185 --> 00:47:26,645
the museum's prized exhibit,

859
00:47:26,687 --> 00:47:29,565
enclosed in a glass case
without a pedestal.

860
00:47:29,607 --> 00:47:31,483
It was one
of the world's largest

861
00:47:31,525 --> 00:47:33,611
and most perfect emeralds,

862
00:47:33,652 --> 00:47:36,196
the Eye of the Jaguar.

863
00:47:42,119 --> 00:47:43,787
Go.

864
00:47:43,829 --> 00:47:45,664
[suspenseful music playing]

865
00:48:00,971 --> 00:48:04,767
The guard thought,
"Wow, those two seem
to be in a hurry.

866
00:48:04,808 --> 00:48:08,312
Most unusual for visitors
to a place such as this."

867
00:48:10,856 --> 00:48:12,816
"My God!"
he screamed inwardly,

868
00:48:12,858 --> 00:48:15,277
"They stole
the Eye of the Jaguar!

869
00:48:15,319 --> 00:48:17,696
Our priceless jewel is gone!"

870
00:48:21,492 --> 00:48:23,244
In a room several miles away

871
00:48:23,285 --> 00:48:25,579
from the place
this incident transpired,

872
00:48:25,621 --> 00:48:29,583
a plush couch
is centered against one wall.

873
00:48:29,625 --> 00:48:32,127
Above the couch,
a single beam of light

874
00:48:32,169 --> 00:48:35,589
is focused on a panel
in the center
of the opposite wall.

875
00:48:35,631 --> 00:48:39,260
At the press of a button
on the arm of the couch,

876
00:48:39,301 --> 00:48:40,970
the panel flies to one side,

877
00:48:41,011 --> 00:48:44,265
revealing a stunning
120-carat emerald,

878
00:48:44,306 --> 00:48:47,393
unique in the entire world,

879
00:48:47,434 --> 00:48:51,522
and two pairs of eyes
exclusively are...

880
00:48:51,564 --> 00:48:53,440
-"...there to see."
-"...there to see."

881
00:48:58,571 --> 00:49:01,532
Jerry, how do you meet
so many couples

882
00:49:01,574 --> 00:49:03,993
that happen to steal

883
00:49:04,034 --> 00:49:07,997
certain valuable objects
in very similar ways?

884
00:49:08,038 --> 00:49:10,791
That's very odd. [chuckles]

885
00:49:10,833 --> 00:49:14,628
Reading this,
in the context of this book,

886
00:49:14,670 --> 00:49:18,090
and my own take on this case,

887
00:49:18,132 --> 00:49:20,593
is about as consistent

888
00:49:20,634 --> 00:49:23,512
as a New York hot dog
on a hot summer day.

889
00:49:23,554 --> 00:49:26,056
We didn't know
the real Jerry and Rita.

890
00:49:26,098 --> 00:49:30,978
They did a good job
of hiding whatever they were.

891
00:49:31,020 --> 00:49:32,980
[Ron] I just wonder a lot.

892
00:49:33,022 --> 00:49:36,525
People who you think
are upstanding citizens,

893
00:49:36,567 --> 00:49:40,529
what motivates them
all of a sudden

894
00:49:40,571 --> 00:49:42,323
to do something like this?

895
00:49:42,364 --> 00:49:44,909
It seems like this couple
is really the story here.

896
00:49:44,950 --> 00:49:46,952
They're the mystery.

897
00:50:01,550 --> 00:50:04,470
[woman] So, where were you
working last week?

898
00:50:04,511 --> 00:50:08,057
So, I've been working
in the lower right area.

899
00:50:08,098 --> 00:50:10,184
-Uh, you see that brown patch?
-Down here?

900
00:50:10,225 --> 00:50:11,518
Yeah, that looks beautiful.

901
00:50:11,560 --> 00:50:16,023
And, um, it's actually quite
amazing how much it relaxes

902
00:50:16,065 --> 00:50:19,652
once we get it under the heat.

903
00:50:19,693 --> 00:50:20,611
I'm Ulrich Birkmaier.

904
00:50:20,653 --> 00:50:22,613
I'm the senior conservator
of paintings

905
00:50:22,655 --> 00:50:23,989
here at the Getty Museum.

906
00:50:24,031 --> 00:50:26,867
My name is Laura Rivers.
I'm one of the painting
conservators

907
00:50:26,909 --> 00:50:29,078
working on the painting.

908
00:50:30,621 --> 00:50:32,748
[Ulrich] We're currently
in the midst

909
00:50:32,790 --> 00:50:34,959
of the treatment
of the painting.

910
00:50:35,000 --> 00:50:38,087
[Laura] It's a very fractured
paint surface

911
00:50:38,128 --> 00:50:40,714
that was damaged
during the theft.

912
00:50:40,756 --> 00:50:44,218
And this is the moment
at which we are,

913
00:50:44,260 --> 00:50:46,971
carefully and very slowly,
under the microscope,

914
00:50:47,012 --> 00:50:48,597
putting that back together.

915
00:50:50,391 --> 00:50:52,851
So essentially through
the microscope,

916
00:50:52,893 --> 00:50:55,896
I am looking at

917
00:50:55,938 --> 00:50:58,691
sort of canyons
formed by the missing paint

918
00:50:58,732 --> 00:51:02,194
that probably flaked off
during the rolling.

919
00:51:03,445 --> 00:51:06,949
I am moving pieces
back into place

920
00:51:06,991 --> 00:51:08,701
with this hot-air needle

921
00:51:08,742 --> 00:51:10,786
and then pressing very lightly

922
00:51:10,828 --> 00:51:13,038
to sort of set them down.

923
00:51:13,080 --> 00:51:14,331
Because of the rolling,

924
00:51:14,373 --> 00:51:17,084
flakes are scattered
over the surface.

925
00:51:17,126 --> 00:51:20,004
So right now I've actually found

926
00:51:20,045 --> 00:51:21,755
a flake that
doesn't belong here.

927
00:51:21,797 --> 00:51:25,384
And I'm going to very carefully

928
00:51:25,426 --> 00:51:28,387
put it in box 21.

929
00:51:30,973 --> 00:51:33,892
After the theft,
a strainer was made for it

930
00:51:33,934 --> 00:51:36,687
and the strainer
is quite crude.

931
00:51:36,729 --> 00:51:40,357
Uh, it would have been
available in an art store.

932
00:51:40,399 --> 00:51:43,694
The painting was then
stapled to that strainer

933
00:51:43,736 --> 00:51:45,654
and the staples went through

934
00:51:45,696 --> 00:51:48,282
what should have been
the front of the painting.

935
00:51:48,324 --> 00:51:51,702
And that's one of the most
difficult issues that we face.

936
00:51:51,744 --> 00:51:54,079
And once that was done,

937
00:51:54,121 --> 00:51:57,041
someone chose
to varnish the painting.

938
00:51:59,335 --> 00:52:02,755
[Ulrich] You can definitely
tell that the thieves

939
00:52:02,796 --> 00:52:06,091
had some art background.

940
00:52:06,133 --> 00:52:08,594
[Laura] It feels like
a faint echo

941
00:52:08,636 --> 00:52:11,972
of what would have been done
in a professional context.

942
00:52:16,602 --> 00:52:21,148
They also made the choice
to do some minor retouching,

943
00:52:21,190 --> 00:52:26,111
so touching in some of
the areas of loss with paint.

944
00:52:26,153 --> 00:52:28,405
[Josh Goldberg]
That's a sacrilege.

945
00:52:28,447 --> 00:52:30,491
It's just, it's such hubris.

946
00:52:30,532 --> 00:52:33,410
I mean, to think that
you could even do that.

947
00:52:33,452 --> 00:52:35,037
Putting your own stupid
paint on it?

948
00:52:35,079 --> 00:52:38,290
I mean, if you're untrained?
I mean, my God.

949
00:52:38,332 --> 00:52:40,334
Really, uh...

950
00:52:40,376 --> 00:52:41,710
What would lead anybody

951
00:52:41,752 --> 00:52:44,505
to think that they
should do such a thing?

952
00:52:44,546 --> 00:52:48,425
[Jamie Strange] Jerry has
more grandiose ideas, I guess.

953
00:52:48,467 --> 00:52:51,262
To me, he was a person
that was more book smart

954
00:52:51,303 --> 00:52:54,348
than, than common sense smart.

955
00:52:54,390 --> 00:52:57,101
[Jamie] Like he built
lots of stuff at the property.

956
00:52:57,142 --> 00:52:59,562
Stuff in the house isn't square.

957
00:52:59,603 --> 00:53:02,982
This structure that we're
sitting under isn't level,

958
00:53:03,023 --> 00:53:03,941
so we have a joke now

959
00:53:03,983 --> 00:53:06,318
that stuff in the house
is "Jerry-rigged"

960
00:53:06,360 --> 00:53:07,945
'cause it was all done by Jerry.

961
00:53:09,488 --> 00:53:13,492
[Ron] He always seemed
to know a lot about

962
00:53:13,534 --> 00:53:15,077
just about anything
that came up.

963
00:53:15,119 --> 00:53:18,706
I could picture him speaking
with a brain surgeon

964
00:53:18,747 --> 00:53:22,876
and arguing with him about
something about brain surgery.

965
00:53:22,918 --> 00:53:24,878
He knew better.

966
00:53:24,920 --> 00:53:27,298
But I think, if you're
confident in yourself,

967
00:53:27,339 --> 00:53:29,758
there's no need
to impress anybody.

968
00:53:31,468 --> 00:53:35,389
My uncle was a jazz musician,
a good one,

969
00:53:35,431 --> 00:53:37,391
and maybe he imagined

970
00:53:37,433 --> 00:53:40,603
that he should have
gone on to better things,

971
00:53:40,644 --> 00:53:42,938
but circumstances didn't put him
in the right place

972
00:53:42,980 --> 00:53:44,607
at the right time.

973
00:53:44,648 --> 00:53:47,151
He was teaching in Manhattan,

974
00:53:47,192 --> 00:53:49,862
and he felt the schools were
getting rougher and rougher

975
00:53:49,904 --> 00:53:51,780
and the administration
was insensitive

976
00:53:51,822 --> 00:53:53,824
to the plights of the teachers.

977
00:53:53,866 --> 00:53:57,202
He felt he deserved a promotion
he didn't get,

978
00:53:57,244 --> 00:53:59,455
and he had enough,

979
00:53:59,496 --> 00:54:04,710
so he moved to Cliff
when he was 47.

980
00:54:04,752 --> 00:54:07,212
[narrator] Quentin Carlyle
had spent 35 years

981
00:54:07,254 --> 00:54:09,423
as an accountant
in a large company.

982
00:54:09,465 --> 00:54:11,759
He never received a promotion.

983
00:54:11,800 --> 00:54:13,802
And his status
had remained identical

984
00:54:13,844 --> 00:54:16,347
to what it was
the day he was hired.

985
00:54:16,388 --> 00:54:18,432
As the years passed,
he found himself

986
00:54:18,474 --> 00:54:22,186
taking direction from younger
and younger coworkers.

987
00:54:22,228 --> 00:54:23,604
To hell with them all!

988
00:54:23,646 --> 00:54:28,776
His 35-year retirement would be
effective in a month's time.

989
00:54:30,194 --> 00:54:34,114
[Ron] He had ambitions
with some of his artwork

990
00:54:34,156 --> 00:54:36,033
and his writing.

991
00:54:36,075 --> 00:54:38,953
[Buck]
Well, even being in the house,
the house was set up

992
00:54:38,994 --> 00:54:42,206
more so as an alter
to what I consider

993
00:54:42,248 --> 00:54:46,210
the crazy bright vibrant artwork
that just lined the walls.

994
00:54:46,252 --> 00:54:47,920
He liked to do
a lot of painting.

995
00:54:47,962 --> 00:54:51,257
It's not great painting.

996
00:54:51,298 --> 00:54:53,050
Like, it was a hobby
and it was fun,

997
00:54:53,092 --> 00:54:55,094
but his artistic ability
was not great.

998
00:54:55,135 --> 00:54:57,805
But I think it was all done,
we heard, for therapy.

999
00:54:57,846 --> 00:55:00,516
-Yeah, for therapy.
-After he had
a stroke or something.

1000
00:55:00,557 --> 00:55:02,977
[Ron] His father passed away
from a heart attack

1001
00:55:03,018 --> 00:55:04,228
at a young age,

1002
00:55:04,270 --> 00:55:08,399
and my uncle had suffered
a major heart attack himself.

1003
00:55:08,440 --> 00:55:10,442
His heart was much weakened.

1004
00:55:10,484 --> 00:55:13,904
So he became very afraid
of getting ill.

1005
00:55:15,614 --> 00:55:18,075
Deep down, Sam knew
he was having a heart attack,

1006
00:55:18,117 --> 00:55:21,662
but at 39, he was far short
of the age for most men

1007
00:55:21,704 --> 00:55:23,163
when this occurs.

1008
00:55:23,205 --> 00:55:25,583
If you want to live,
you must give up

1009
00:55:25,624 --> 00:55:27,501
all excessive physical activity

1010
00:55:27,543 --> 00:55:30,838
and find sedentary work
of a calming nature.

1011
00:55:30,879 --> 00:55:33,340
I'll be a painter.

1012
00:55:33,382 --> 00:55:34,967
What do you know about art?

1013
00:55:35,009 --> 00:55:36,427
You never went to art school

1014
00:55:36,468 --> 00:55:40,180
to be properly trained
to be an artist.

1015
00:55:40,222 --> 00:55:43,851
In painting, formal education
is not essential.

1016
00:55:52,192 --> 00:55:53,444
During the month-long
exhibition,

1017
00:55:53,485 --> 00:55:56,196
all paintings sold
for 50K each.

1018
00:56:02,286 --> 00:56:04,121
Sam realized with all modesty,

1019
00:56:04,163 --> 00:56:08,500
he might have been blessed
with a spark of genius.

1020
00:56:08,542 --> 00:56:10,794
I hate to say it,

1021
00:56:10,836 --> 00:56:13,464
but I think he thought
more of himself

1022
00:56:13,505 --> 00:56:15,466
than he actually was.

1023
00:56:15,507 --> 00:56:18,594
Probably his writing this,
he'd thought,

1024
00:56:18,636 --> 00:56:20,387
you know, he was maybe
gonna make it big.

1025
00:56:20,429 --> 00:56:21,805
[Buck] Yeah.

1026
00:56:23,557 --> 00:56:25,935
Ken was quite
a talented writer.

1027
00:56:25,976 --> 00:56:30,272
To further hone his skills,
he registered
in a creative writing class

1028
00:56:30,314 --> 00:56:32,399
given at the university
in town.

1029
00:56:33,817 --> 00:56:37,112
This left Judy with
a lot of free time alone.

1030
00:57:21,407 --> 00:57:25,202
The picture became
clear in Ken's mind.

1031
00:57:26,620 --> 00:57:29,873
Ken had José load some tools
into Ken's wheelbarrow.

1032
00:57:29,915 --> 00:57:32,835
These were brought to the area
of the magnificent
front garden,

1033
00:57:32,876 --> 00:57:35,879
where the septic tank lay
buried under 2 feet of soil,

1034
00:57:35,921 --> 00:57:38,841
plastic sheeting,
and crushed red lava rock.

1035
00:57:42,469 --> 00:57:45,514
Ken reached
for his 8-pound sledgehammer.

1036
00:57:52,313 --> 00:57:55,274
[Dave] You wonder,
were they fantasies,

1037
00:57:55,316 --> 00:57:58,360
and in his mind, you know,
this is what he wanted?

1038
00:57:58,402 --> 00:57:59,862
I think Jerry Alter

1039
00:57:59,904 --> 00:58:02,781
might have been living
in a bit of a fantasy world.

1040
00:58:02,823 --> 00:58:05,326
But I think his outlet
was his book.

1041
00:58:06,744 --> 00:58:10,581
[Isaac]
"Harry felt a black hatred
for man and all his works.

1042
00:58:10,623 --> 00:58:11,874
Certainly in his adult life,

1043
00:58:11,916 --> 00:58:14,209
he had already left
a swath of destruction

1044
00:58:14,251 --> 00:58:15,294
in his wake.

1045
00:58:15,336 --> 00:58:17,171
Ruined property
and devastated lives

1046
00:58:17,212 --> 00:58:21,008
caused not the slightest upset
or pang of conscience in him.

1047
00:58:21,050 --> 00:58:23,177
Of course,
Squire would never commit

1048
00:58:23,218 --> 00:58:24,637
the sort of overt illegal act

1049
00:58:24,678 --> 00:58:26,889
sure to bring the police
down on him.

1050
00:58:26,931 --> 00:58:29,725
No, he was too smart for that.

1051
00:58:29,767 --> 00:58:32,019
He would have to live freely
for a very long time

1052
00:58:32,061 --> 00:58:34,730
in order to exact his revenge
on God and mankind

1053
00:58:34,772 --> 00:58:37,066
for slighting him,
for disrespecting him,

1054
00:58:37,107 --> 00:58:39,985
and for depriving him
of his opportunities."

1055
00:58:42,363 --> 00:58:44,490
[Bob] "The Thief Collector"

1056
00:58:44,531 --> 00:58:47,743
is the darkest of them all.

1057
00:58:47,785 --> 00:58:51,622
And it also speaks
of a kind of self-victimhood,

1058
00:58:51,664 --> 00:58:54,083
you know,
that "I must have this,
I must have this,

1059
00:58:54,124 --> 00:58:57,044
nobody else can have this."

1060
00:58:57,086 --> 00:58:58,963
That's not healthy.

1061
00:58:59,004 --> 00:59:02,883
[Mark Stevens] Everything
about the case suggests that

1062
00:59:02,925 --> 00:59:04,843
the person who stole
the painting

1063
00:59:04,885 --> 00:59:07,930
had some kind of obsession.

1064
00:59:07,972 --> 00:59:10,724
Why would you risk
going to jail

1065
00:59:10,766 --> 00:59:12,601
if you didn't?

1066
00:59:12,643 --> 00:59:15,020
Why would you not sell it

1067
00:59:15,062 --> 00:59:17,356
if you were just interested
in making money?

1068
00:59:17,398 --> 00:59:20,818
Why would you keep it
in your bedroom for decades

1069
00:59:20,859 --> 00:59:25,072
and hide it there if it was not
some personal obsession?

1070
00:59:25,114 --> 00:59:27,533
[Bob] It may well be the case

1071
00:59:27,575 --> 00:59:30,286
that they experienced
de Kooning's paintings directly,

1072
00:59:30,327 --> 00:59:34,415
you know, because he was hitting
right when they were there.

1073
00:59:34,456 --> 00:59:37,084
The chances of them bumping
into de Kooning are very high.

1074
00:59:37,126 --> 00:59:40,921
You know, the chances of anybody
bumping into-- these guys
are just drinking in bars.

1075
00:59:40,963 --> 00:59:42,798
Everybody and his brother
showed up

1076
00:59:42,840 --> 00:59:44,592
at one time or another
at the galleries

1077
00:59:44,633 --> 00:59:47,553
or at the Cedar Bar
who was interested in painting.

1078
00:59:47,595 --> 00:59:50,306
So it's not far-fetched at all.

1079
00:59:51,890 --> 00:59:53,726
They could have been,
you know, I don't know,

1080
00:59:53,767 --> 00:59:55,978
but they could have been
disappointed that

1081
00:59:56,020 --> 00:59:58,022
their life didn't work out

1082
00:59:58,063 --> 01:00:00,566
in the way
they might have wanted.

1083
01:00:02,776 --> 01:00:07,865
You can imagine it was a symbol
of all his disappointment,

1084
01:00:07,907 --> 01:00:12,620
all his aspiration,
all his anger.

1085
01:00:12,661 --> 01:00:16,790
And then to... to razor it
out of the frame,

1086
01:00:16,832 --> 01:00:20,377
um, that's saying that,
"Well, secretly, actually,

1087
01:00:20,419 --> 01:00:22,296
I'm as good as any of you.

1088
01:00:22,338 --> 01:00:26,759
I can kill you, I can steal you,
I can dominate you."

1089
01:00:28,093 --> 01:00:31,180
[Ron] I could see my uncle
thinking,

1090
01:00:31,221 --> 01:00:33,515
"If I can't be famous,

1091
01:00:33,557 --> 01:00:35,851
at least I could be infamous."

1092
01:00:39,688 --> 01:00:45,236
I wonder if they felt
like the painting personally,
that it belonged to them.

1093
01:00:45,277 --> 01:00:47,154
[Dave] We have some
early pictures of Rita,

1094
01:00:47,196 --> 01:00:51,408
and she was a stunning woman,
absolutely beautiful woman.

1095
01:00:51,450 --> 01:00:53,535
And then, of course,
then you start hearing

1096
01:00:53,577 --> 01:00:56,121
about how de Kooning
was a womanizer

1097
01:00:56,163 --> 01:00:58,624
and slept with his models
and things like that.

1098
01:00:58,666 --> 01:01:01,377
And so then we thought, well,
maybe that was part of this.

1099
01:01:01,418 --> 01:01:04,797
Maybe Rita was the model for it.

1100
01:01:04,838 --> 01:01:08,217
[Bob] "Woman-Ochre"
was painted in 1955.

1101
01:01:08,259 --> 01:01:10,844
[Ron] My aunt and uncle met

1102
01:01:10,886 --> 01:01:14,223
somewhere in 1955.

1103
01:01:14,265 --> 01:01:17,434
[Christy] Somehow that made...

1104
01:01:17,476 --> 01:01:19,979
that made it easier
for me to believe...

1105
01:01:20,020 --> 01:01:21,438
[Rick M.] Yeah,
if that were true.

1106
01:01:21,480 --> 01:01:23,148
[Christy] ...if she
was the model, like, okay.

1107
01:01:23,190 --> 01:01:27,111
Well, and if he told you
that it was yours
because you were the model,

1108
01:01:27,152 --> 01:01:31,240
then, and you didn't get it,
well then, by golly,
then just steal it.

1109
01:01:31,282 --> 01:01:32,783
I mean, it's...

1110
01:01:32,825 --> 01:01:34,827
I guess it makes it
a little easier to swallow.

1111
01:01:34,868 --> 01:01:37,037
Makes it a little bit
more romantic,

1112
01:01:37,079 --> 01:01:38,664
like a movie or something.

1113
01:01:41,584 --> 01:01:42,960
Uh, no, he didn't use...

1114
01:01:43,002 --> 01:01:45,129
He wouldn't have used her
as a model.

1115
01:01:45,170 --> 01:01:47,506
He had women in mind,
you know,

1116
01:01:47,548 --> 01:01:49,216
including particular women,

1117
01:01:49,258 --> 01:01:52,052
but no, he never put
a model on the stand

1118
01:01:52,094 --> 01:01:55,347
and carefully painted her
in his studio.

1119
01:01:56,849 --> 01:01:58,475
But she could well have been,

1120
01:01:58,517 --> 01:02:01,186
uh, you know,
one of the many women

1121
01:02:01,228 --> 01:02:03,564
who were hanging out
at the Cedar Tavern,

1122
01:02:03,606 --> 01:02:07,192
or he might have
met her at an opening.

1123
01:02:07,234 --> 01:02:10,487
[Ron] Carole lived near
the Martha Jackson gallery,

1124
01:02:10,529 --> 01:02:13,324
where "Woman-Ochre"
was on display.

1125
01:02:14,450 --> 01:02:15,993
And it makes sense to me

1126
01:02:16,035 --> 01:02:19,580
that they saw that painting
on at least one occasion.

1127
01:02:19,622 --> 01:02:23,334
I mean, um,
there's all kinds of ways

1128
01:02:23,375 --> 01:02:26,170
that they probably did
know each other a little bit.

1129
01:02:26,211 --> 01:02:28,005
Which might be part
of the resentment, right?

1130
01:02:28,047 --> 01:02:30,215
I mean, he was
a sort of sleep-around, too.

1131
01:02:31,634 --> 01:02:34,261
I guess it's not
beyond the pale

1132
01:02:34,303 --> 01:02:37,473
to think that they might
have had something like that.

1133
01:02:41,268 --> 01:02:45,105
In the theft, you can see
aspects of both revenge

1134
01:02:45,147 --> 01:02:47,524
and awe

1135
01:02:47,566 --> 01:02:50,152
and worship.

1136
01:02:57,034 --> 01:02:59,620
I don't want to blame
any of it on Rita.

1137
01:02:59,662 --> 01:03:01,830
It's okay
to blame it on Jerry.

1138
01:03:03,207 --> 01:03:04,500
[Rick M.] The vibe you got

1139
01:03:04,541 --> 01:03:05,960
was that Rita went along

1140
01:03:06,001 --> 01:03:08,629
with whatever Jerry
wanted to do.

1141
01:03:08,671 --> 01:03:11,048
"Rita, we're going
to the end of the world."

1142
01:03:11,090 --> 01:03:14,093
"Okay, Jerry, I'll go to
the end of the world with you."

1143
01:03:14,134 --> 01:03:16,345
So that's the feeling I got.

1144
01:03:16,387 --> 01:03:19,098
Jerry made the decisions.

1145
01:03:22,226 --> 01:03:24,270
[Dave] A woman
came into our store

1146
01:03:24,311 --> 01:03:27,147
and she said
she had always loved Rita,

1147
01:03:27,189 --> 01:03:30,192
and Rita had come back
from one of her trips.

1148
01:03:30,234 --> 01:03:32,152
They had gone into...

1149
01:03:32,194 --> 01:03:35,322
somewhere deep into the country,
into the jungle,

1150
01:03:35,364 --> 01:03:38,367
or wherever it was
they were going.

1151
01:03:38,409 --> 01:03:43,372
And apparently
it was two tribes.

1152
01:03:43,414 --> 01:03:47,501
And they stood on a hillside,
and these two tribes

1153
01:03:47,543 --> 01:03:48,836
were battling.

1154
01:03:48,877 --> 01:03:50,546
And I don't know
if it was a ritual

1155
01:03:50,588 --> 01:03:53,757
or if it was, you know,
a real whatever it was.

1156
01:03:53,799 --> 01:03:56,176
But they actually
killed each other.

1157
01:03:56,218 --> 01:03:58,387
You know, it was
that kind of a battle.

1158
01:03:58,429 --> 01:04:02,975
And she said, "Rita is sitting
here telling me this story

1159
01:04:03,017 --> 01:04:05,895
of watching people being killed

1160
01:04:05,936 --> 01:04:09,440
like they'd gone to Disneyland."

1161
01:04:09,481 --> 01:04:14,778
And she said, "That quick,
my opinion of Rita had changed."

1162
01:04:14,820 --> 01:04:17,239
And she said,
"I went from thinking

1163
01:04:17,281 --> 01:04:19,617
what a wonderful,
lovely person she was

1164
01:04:19,658 --> 01:04:22,745
to what a horrible
human being she was."

1165
01:04:26,999 --> 01:04:28,834
Seriously?

1166
01:04:28,876 --> 01:04:31,921
[Buck] So I really should
read this manuscript.

1167
01:04:34,882 --> 01:04:36,050
-Wow!
-So...

1168
01:04:36,091 --> 01:04:37,343
Okay, that's pretty cool.

1169
01:04:37,384 --> 01:04:39,887
"Rita and Jerry had
their driver rush to the field

1170
01:04:39,929 --> 01:04:42,431
so they could witness the scene
from a time in pre-history.

1171
01:04:42,473 --> 01:04:46,226
Within a half-hour, both clans
were standing in the fields
face to face.

1172
01:04:46,268 --> 01:04:48,103
All warriors
were in tight formation

1173
01:04:48,145 --> 01:04:51,065
while the respective chiefs
argued their points
as loudly as they could.

1174
01:04:51,106 --> 01:04:53,317
While Rita and Peter
remained in the parked jeep

1175
01:04:53,359 --> 01:04:55,027
on the roadway
adjacent to the field,

1176
01:04:55,069 --> 01:04:58,239
Jerry with his camera in hand
found a way to cross
the deep trench

1177
01:04:58,280 --> 01:05:00,324
which separated the field
from the roadway.

1178
01:05:00,366 --> 01:05:02,451
He ventured very close
to the center of the action

1179
01:05:02,493 --> 01:05:04,995
while taking a set
of remarkable photos."

1180
01:05:07,331 --> 01:05:09,041
-All right, that is...
-It's awesome.

1181
01:05:09,083 --> 01:05:10,292
Okay.

1182
01:05:10,334 --> 01:05:14,129
-[Buck] What do you believe
at this point?
-[Dave] Yeah.

1183
01:05:14,171 --> 01:05:15,631
[Buck]
There's a great possibility

1184
01:05:15,673 --> 01:05:18,592
that these are actually
not made up.

1185
01:05:18,634 --> 01:05:20,094
These are true stories.

1186
01:05:20,135 --> 01:05:21,553
That's horrifying.

1187
01:05:21,595 --> 01:05:24,473
[Dave] I hoped that this

1188
01:05:24,515 --> 01:05:25,891
would start the FBI

1189
01:05:25,933 --> 01:05:28,227
into digging deeper and deeper

1190
01:05:28,269 --> 01:05:29,770
and deeper into...

1191
01:05:29,812 --> 01:05:31,355
-But we don't know
that it hasn't.
-Right.

1192
01:05:31,397 --> 01:05:34,900
[Mike Burns]
With an organization
like the FBI,

1193
01:05:34,942 --> 01:05:36,860
I would bank on the fact
that that book was reviewed

1194
01:05:36,902 --> 01:05:39,530
by people who have
degrees in psychology

1195
01:05:39,572 --> 01:05:42,449
or human behavior,

1196
01:05:42,491 --> 01:05:46,036
because there's
a wealth of information

1197
01:05:46,078 --> 01:05:47,621
between the lines.

1198
01:05:47,663 --> 01:05:49,957
I did read through
three-quarters of it

1199
01:05:49,999 --> 01:05:53,502
that I was able
to manage through, so...

1200
01:05:53,544 --> 01:05:55,170
It's a hard read, right?

1201
01:05:59,008 --> 01:06:00,092
I don't think anyone else--

1202
01:06:00,134 --> 01:06:01,302
I know I had recommended it

1203
01:06:01,343 --> 01:06:03,345
and had asked a couple
of them to do that.

1204
01:06:03,387 --> 01:06:06,265
I don't think that ever
made it on their list, though.

1205
01:06:06,307 --> 01:06:07,808
We really need to read these.

1206
01:06:07,850 --> 01:06:10,060
I think these are just
like true stories.

1207
01:06:10,102 --> 01:06:15,399
What he told me was that
all of these stories

1208
01:06:15,441 --> 01:06:18,235
"come from
my personal experiences."

1209
01:06:18,277 --> 01:06:22,740
He... His statement to me
was all inclusive.

1210
01:06:22,781 --> 01:06:25,284
The title of this book,
"The Cup and the Lip,"

1211
01:06:25,326 --> 01:06:27,661
probably for
any English speaker,

1212
01:06:27,703 --> 01:06:29,872
it's probably an odd title.

1213
01:06:29,914 --> 01:06:31,582
But in Yiddish,

1214
01:06:31,624 --> 01:06:36,587
which is the Jewish language
of the Old Country,

1215
01:06:36,629 --> 01:06:40,215
uh, cup refers to the head,

1216
01:06:40,257 --> 01:06:41,592
but also refers to your mind.

1217
01:06:41,634 --> 01:06:46,931
And then the lip
refers to your mouth.

1218
01:06:46,972 --> 01:06:48,766
It refers to what you say,
what you speak.

1219
01:06:48,807 --> 01:06:50,559
"Oh, you've got some lip."

1220
01:06:50,601 --> 01:06:53,062
What comes to mind for me

1221
01:06:53,103 --> 01:06:54,355
is that

1222
01:06:54,396 --> 01:06:55,981
whenever we tell a story,

1223
01:06:56,023 --> 01:07:00,110
we have to choose what to say

1224
01:07:00,152 --> 01:07:01,570
and what to leave out.

1225
01:07:01,612 --> 01:07:03,781
When I hear
"The Cup and the Lip,"

1226
01:07:03,822 --> 01:07:05,950
you've got the story
in your cup

1227
01:07:05,991 --> 01:07:11,288
and then you've got the story
that you can tell with lip.

1228
01:07:11,330 --> 01:07:13,123
"The Cup and the Lip"
was his outlet.

1229
01:07:13,165 --> 01:07:14,541
That was his way

1230
01:07:14,583 --> 01:07:15,834
of communicating

1231
01:07:15,876 --> 01:07:17,836
the stories

1232
01:07:17,878 --> 01:07:20,422
that he experienced himself

1233
01:07:20,464 --> 01:07:23,759
but couldn't tell anyone about.

1234
01:07:23,801 --> 01:07:26,303
I wonder what else they did.

1235
01:07:26,345 --> 01:07:28,055
[chuckles]

1236
01:07:28,097 --> 01:07:29,723
[intense music playing]

1237
01:07:29,765 --> 01:07:32,559
They were living
this lavish lifestyle

1238
01:07:32,601 --> 01:07:33,936
and traveling
around the world,

1239
01:07:33,978 --> 01:07:36,522
and where did they get
their money for that, you know?

1240
01:07:36,564 --> 01:07:38,315
Did they steal other paintings,
you know?

1241
01:07:38,357 --> 01:07:40,401
Were they career art thieves?

1242
01:07:40,442 --> 01:07:43,153
If they did it once,
I bet they'd do it again.

1243
01:07:43,195 --> 01:07:44,655
You can't just do it once.

1244
01:07:44,697 --> 01:07:47,616
When we got all of the photo
albums from the estate,

1245
01:07:47,658 --> 01:07:51,328
we went through them before
the FBI went here, of course.
We were being nosy.

1246
01:07:51,370 --> 01:07:54,290
But they had gone to museums
and they had taken

1247
01:07:54,331 --> 01:07:58,919
a lot of pictures
of paintings in museums.

1248
01:07:58,961 --> 01:08:01,463
Lots and lots and lots.

1249
01:08:01,505 --> 01:08:04,091
Sounds almost like
casing the joint.

1250
01:08:04,133 --> 01:08:05,634
It's the simplest explanation.

1251
01:08:05,676 --> 01:08:08,304
It wasn't just one theft,
it was many.

1252
01:08:16,312 --> 01:08:17,813
The FBI came in
and X-rayed the walls

1253
01:08:17,855 --> 01:08:21,233
to see if there was any other
type of stolen artwork.

1254
01:08:21,275 --> 01:08:24,778
Actually I was there for that,
and so I led the team
that went out and did that.

1255
01:08:24,820 --> 01:08:28,115
[Buck] Rita had told caregivers
that in the attic

1256
01:08:28,157 --> 01:08:30,659
they had stored
some precious stuff,

1257
01:08:30,701 --> 01:08:32,578
and I think she actually
said paintings.

1258
01:08:32,620 --> 01:08:34,914
We took an FBI
bomb technician with us,

1259
01:08:34,955 --> 01:08:37,291
because they had the X-ray
machine that we could use

1260
01:08:37,333 --> 01:08:38,792
to quickly X-ray the walls.

1261
01:08:38,834 --> 01:08:42,463
Nothing in the walls,
so, I don't think there's
anything in the house.

1262
01:08:42,504 --> 01:08:45,257
[Dave] But before
we were contacted,

1263
01:08:45,299 --> 01:08:48,594
apparently Ron donated

1264
01:08:48,636 --> 01:08:51,513
tons of stuff to charity,

1265
01:08:51,555 --> 01:08:54,350
and really good stuff.

1266
01:08:56,810 --> 01:08:58,938
Well... [chuckles]

1267
01:08:58,979 --> 01:09:01,190
Um, these people said,
"My aunt just died

1268
01:09:01,232 --> 01:09:04,777
and we're dealing with
all the stuff in her house

1269
01:09:04,818 --> 01:09:07,196
and we'd like to donate
to the Garden Club

1270
01:09:07,238 --> 01:09:11,450
because we found out
that you give all your profits

1271
01:09:11,492 --> 01:09:16,288
to worthwhile
community projects."

1272
01:09:16,330 --> 01:09:19,708
So I made an appointment
for them to come
and donate their stuff,

1273
01:09:19,750 --> 01:09:21,502
and they arrived
the following Tuesday

1274
01:09:21,543 --> 01:09:23,462
with a pickup truck
full of stuff.

1275
01:09:25,297 --> 01:09:27,800
One of the teenagers
came in carrying

1276
01:09:27,841 --> 01:09:31,053
a very familiar work of art,

1277
01:09:31,095 --> 01:09:34,265
a bronze Remington,
Frederic Remington bronze,

1278
01:09:34,306 --> 01:09:36,850
and Frederic Remington
is one of the most famous

1279
01:09:36,892 --> 01:09:39,687
art sculptors
of the western schools.

1280
01:09:39,728 --> 01:09:43,983
So I said, "Wait a minute,
wait a minute, we can't
take stuff like that.

1281
01:09:44,024 --> 01:09:45,359
We're a thrift store.

1282
01:09:45,401 --> 01:09:48,195
We sell things for $2 and $5,

1283
01:09:48,237 --> 01:09:50,322
and if we're very rich,
it's $10."

1284
01:09:50,364 --> 01:09:51,907
Oh, yeah, I remember that, yeah.

1285
01:09:51,949 --> 01:09:54,326
I was there, yeah, 'cause I
remember seeing the statue.

1286
01:09:54,368 --> 01:09:57,204
[Ron] I mean, I looked at,
it was, you know,
a reproduction.

1287
01:09:57,246 --> 01:09:59,540
I had made what I thought

1288
01:09:59,582 --> 01:10:01,458
was a reasonable attempt
to sell them,

1289
01:10:01,500 --> 01:10:03,836
and no one seemed interested.

1290
01:10:03,877 --> 01:10:07,131
We were also pressed for time
for me getting back to work,

1291
01:10:07,172 --> 01:10:09,842
so we were trying
to get it wrapped up.

1292
01:10:09,883 --> 01:10:13,095
I mean, this was
an amazing deal.

1293
01:10:13,137 --> 01:10:15,264
And my son is loading
stuff into the car,

1294
01:10:15,306 --> 01:10:16,599
and all of the sudden, he said,

1295
01:10:16,640 --> 01:10:20,686
"Can I look at that painting
there of the Indian's head?"

1296
01:10:20,728 --> 01:10:22,688
And he picked it up
and he turned it over,

1297
01:10:22,730 --> 01:10:26,692
and he said, "Oh, my Lord,
this is a JH Sharp."

1298
01:10:26,734 --> 01:10:31,906
JH Sharp is one of the most
famous western artists.

1299
01:10:31,947 --> 01:10:36,201
So that caused him to look
at other stuff that was here.

1300
01:10:36,243 --> 01:10:37,828
He looked at the bronzes.

1301
01:10:37,870 --> 01:10:40,331
There were two R.C. Gormans.

1302
01:10:40,372 --> 01:10:42,750
He's a famous sculptor.

1303
01:10:42,791 --> 01:10:45,461
My son called Sotheby's

1304
01:10:45,502 --> 01:10:46,670
and they were interested.

1305
01:10:46,712 --> 01:10:49,214
I mean, this stuff
was good enough for Sotheby's.

1306
01:10:49,256 --> 01:10:51,342
Sotheby's was one
of the places I thought...

1307
01:10:51,383 --> 01:10:55,804
I contacted Sotheby's with...
I emailed them and asked them.

1308
01:10:55,846 --> 01:10:58,390
[Isaac]
And they weren't interested
at the time, but then...

1309
01:10:58,432 --> 01:11:01,226
Yeah, they said, "We don't deal
with this type of thing,

1310
01:11:01,268 --> 01:11:04,230
we deal with higher-end things."

1311
01:11:10,945 --> 01:11:12,947
Oh, wow. The Remington?

1312
01:11:12,988 --> 01:11:15,991
So, they had
authentic materials,

1313
01:11:16,033 --> 01:11:19,411
but they told everybody
they were reproductions.

1314
01:11:19,453 --> 01:11:21,247
-Like, uh...
-Yeah.

1315
01:11:21,288 --> 01:11:24,458
Maybe they, um, were shy

1316
01:11:24,500 --> 01:11:28,462
about telling people that
they had authentic art

1317
01:11:28,504 --> 01:11:30,547
because they didn't want people
to start thinking,

1318
01:11:30,589 --> 01:11:32,841
"Well, what else do they have
that's authentic?"

1319
01:11:32,883 --> 01:11:34,051
They want people to think,

1320
01:11:34,093 --> 01:11:36,470
"Everything in our house
is a reproduction."

1321
01:11:38,639 --> 01:11:41,558
-[Buck] I think it was
a safety thing, you know.
-[Dave] Yeah.

1322
01:11:41,600 --> 01:11:44,019
Their not wanting to draw
attention to art, I guess.

1323
01:11:44,061 --> 01:11:45,771
You know, living in Cliff,

1324
01:11:45,813 --> 01:11:47,648
if anybody knew
that you had a Remington,

1325
01:11:47,690 --> 01:11:49,358
everybody would know
you had a Remington.

1326
01:11:49,400 --> 01:11:51,485
What was she,
a speech pathologist

1327
01:11:51,527 --> 01:11:52,945
for a local school,

1328
01:11:52,987 --> 01:11:55,531
to have a real Remington?

1329
01:11:55,573 --> 01:11:58,492
You know, none of this stuff
was insured.

1330
01:11:58,534 --> 01:12:01,453
And it's not very expensive.
I mean...

1331
01:12:01,495 --> 01:12:02,955
Maybe they were all stolen.

1332
01:12:04,707 --> 01:12:07,126
At one point,
the FBI was involved,

1333
01:12:07,167 --> 01:12:09,169
and they came out
and took pictures,

1334
01:12:09,211 --> 01:12:10,796
and they ran it
by their database,

1335
01:12:10,838 --> 01:12:13,841
and we were clean,
stuff wasn't stolen.

1336
01:12:13,882 --> 01:12:17,303
But I will tell you
that one of the agents said,

1337
01:12:17,344 --> 01:12:19,263
"Just because we cleared it

1338
01:12:19,305 --> 01:12:20,973
doesn't mean
that it's not stolen."

1339
01:12:21,015 --> 01:12:23,392
"It could have just
not been reported,"

1340
01:12:23,434 --> 01:12:27,271
or, you know,
it's not on their radar.

1341
01:12:27,313 --> 01:12:30,149
[Harriet Rogers]
To make a long story short,

1342
01:12:30,190 --> 01:12:33,068
they sold them at their auction.

1343
01:12:33,110 --> 01:12:35,070
The Higgins
was the most val--

1344
01:12:35,112 --> 01:12:37,323
It made $80,000.

1345
01:12:39,074 --> 01:12:45,623
The total intake for the gallery
was about 160,000,

1346
01:12:45,664 --> 01:12:49,084
of which we took in
something like 129,000.

1347
01:12:49,126 --> 01:12:52,671
We got a check for $129,000.

1348
01:12:52,713 --> 01:12:55,966
Yeah, I mean,
we were a thrift shop.

1349
01:12:57,509 --> 01:13:00,220
It would have been nice
if my aunt or uncle

1350
01:13:00,262 --> 01:13:02,473
would have documented this

1351
01:13:02,514 --> 01:13:06,226
for their poor executor.

1352
01:13:06,268 --> 01:13:09,146
[chuckles] There was nothing
about any of their items

1353
01:13:09,188 --> 01:13:12,900
or what they were worth,
so what am I supposed to think?

1354
01:13:12,942 --> 01:13:15,945
And we actually purchased
some of it from the Garden Club.

1355
01:13:15,986 --> 01:13:17,780
We have several
of the Navajo rugs

1356
01:13:17,821 --> 01:13:21,116
and they're really fine
Navajo rugs.

1357
01:13:22,701 --> 01:13:23,994
Well, then we find out

1358
01:13:24,036 --> 01:13:27,873
that there
is the Amerind Museum.

1359
01:13:38,300 --> 01:13:41,011
In 1989, they had

1360
01:13:41,053 --> 01:13:44,348
like a million-dollar
chief's blanket

1361
01:13:44,390 --> 01:13:46,225
stolen from them.

1362
01:13:46,267 --> 01:13:49,979
And it was
the exact same M.O.

1363
01:13:50,020 --> 01:13:52,064
[intense music playing]

1364
01:13:55,734 --> 01:13:57,945
A woman distracted the guard

1365
01:13:57,987 --> 01:14:01,323
and a man took it and ran,
and then the woman left.

1366
01:14:01,365 --> 01:14:02,908
Thank you so much.

1367
01:14:02,950 --> 01:14:04,368
The Amerind called us,

1368
01:14:04,410 --> 01:14:07,162
and then the very next day,
the FBI called us.

1369
01:14:07,204 --> 01:14:10,874
The agent sent us
a picture of the blanket.

1370
01:14:10,916 --> 01:14:12,543
[Tim Carpenter]
Uh, that's a bit foggy.

1371
01:14:12,585 --> 01:14:15,045
I seem to have some recollection
of a mention of that,

1372
01:14:15,087 --> 01:14:18,090
but I don't know-- I personally
didn't follow up on that.

1373
01:14:18,132 --> 01:14:20,426
I'd have to talk
to the case agent about that.

1374
01:14:22,052 --> 01:14:25,681
[Dave] Looks like August 27
of '89.

1375
01:14:25,723 --> 01:14:27,933
And...

1376
01:14:27,975 --> 01:14:29,268
what we happen to have...

1377
01:14:31,520 --> 01:14:34,690
another journal here,

1378
01:14:34,732 --> 01:14:37,067
a few days before

1379
01:14:37,109 --> 01:14:39,069
they...

1380
01:14:39,111 --> 01:14:41,322
flew into Tucson.

1381
01:14:41,363 --> 01:14:45,826
"Arrived in Tucson
at 2 p.m. on a Delta flight."

1382
01:14:45,868 --> 01:14:48,203
And then that's it.
Then nothing else.

1383
01:14:49,663 --> 01:14:51,874
The first thing that
made me kind of go "hmm"

1384
01:14:51,916 --> 01:14:53,709
is when they would fly
into Tucson,

1385
01:14:53,751 --> 01:14:55,920
they would visit family
for a few days.

1386
01:14:55,961 --> 01:14:58,505
I don't know if they ever
just flew into Tucson

1387
01:14:58,547 --> 01:15:00,007
and drove straight to Cliff.

1388
01:15:00,049 --> 01:15:02,259
But not one thing written down.

1389
01:15:02,301 --> 01:15:05,763
And they usually wrote

1390
01:15:05,804 --> 01:15:08,182
about their trip back to Cliff,

1391
01:15:08,223 --> 01:15:10,309
which isn't here.

1392
01:15:12,061 --> 01:15:14,897
On the 27th...

1393
01:15:14,939 --> 01:15:16,482
they're blank again.

1394
01:15:19,902 --> 01:15:23,906
Buck, come here,
I wanna show you this.

1395
01:15:23,948 --> 01:15:27,117
The Alters,
after they flew into Tucson,

1396
01:15:27,159 --> 01:15:29,620
would have driven
right past Dragoon,

1397
01:15:29,662 --> 01:15:34,541
where the Amerind Museum
heist happened.

1398
01:15:34,583 --> 01:15:36,001
Right on the path.

1399
01:15:38,337 --> 01:15:42,591
[Ron] Carole mentioned that
there might be an expensive rug

1400
01:15:42,633 --> 01:15:44,093
in their home,

1401
01:15:44,134 --> 01:15:46,387
but I had sent photographs
of things on the wall

1402
01:15:46,428 --> 01:15:49,932
that none of them were what
she thought that they had.

1403
01:15:49,974 --> 01:15:51,976
If there was
an expensive rug there,

1404
01:15:52,017 --> 01:15:54,979
I wouldn't know
what happened to it.

1405
01:15:55,020 --> 01:15:58,190
It looks somewhat familiar,
but no.

1406
01:15:58,232 --> 01:16:02,611
-Yeah, but if we had, it would
have gone to the Garden Club.
-Yeah.

1407
01:16:06,365 --> 01:16:08,951
[Dave] You know you have
those things that you're like,

1408
01:16:08,993 --> 01:16:10,244
oh, I know it.

1409
01:16:10,286 --> 01:16:13,080
Like, that blanket was there.

1410
01:16:13,122 --> 01:16:15,708
They probably took it
to another country, you know,

1411
01:16:15,749 --> 01:16:17,626
on one of their trips.

1412
01:16:17,668 --> 01:16:20,963
[Isaac] What if they went
on their trips

1413
01:16:21,005 --> 01:16:24,091
to sell the stuff that
they stole in the U.S.?

1414
01:16:24,133 --> 01:16:26,927
[Ron] Yeah, nobody would think
any different of it.

1415
01:16:26,969 --> 01:16:28,846
[Isaac] There was no,
uh, TSA back then.

1416
01:16:28,887 --> 01:16:33,642
You know, it would make
a lot of sense.

1417
01:16:33,684 --> 01:16:38,188
It would kind of tie up
those loose ends very neatly.

1418
01:16:38,230 --> 01:16:39,899
He wasn't sloppy.

1419
01:16:39,940 --> 01:16:42,443
I mean, everything he did
was meticulous, clearly,

1420
01:16:42,484 --> 01:16:45,863
'cause he got away with it,
and that's the craziest part,
you know.

1421
01:16:47,448 --> 01:16:48,824
[Ron] It makes sense to me,

1422
01:16:48,866 --> 01:16:50,701
if they were stealing
a lot of art,

1423
01:16:50,743 --> 01:16:54,163
that they wouldn't want
to exhibit that wealth

1424
01:16:54,204 --> 01:16:58,125
to friends and family,
wouldn't want the questions.

1425
01:16:58,167 --> 01:17:01,670
They wanted to give
a air of frugalness

1426
01:17:01,712 --> 01:17:04,840
that might fit a couple
who only had one income

1427
01:17:04,882 --> 01:17:06,800
throughout their marriage.

1428
01:17:08,510 --> 01:17:10,721
They kept their home simple.

1429
01:17:10,763 --> 01:17:14,600
They had furniture there
from 40 or 50 years ago.

1430
01:17:14,642 --> 01:17:16,727
I'd say nothing is extravagant.

1431
01:17:16,769 --> 01:17:18,812
There's not...
like you would expect thieves

1432
01:17:18,854 --> 01:17:21,523
to have some kind of
extravagant lifestyle,

1433
01:17:21,565 --> 01:17:23,609
stealing multi-million-dollar
paintings, but...

1434
01:17:23,651 --> 01:17:28,280
I mean, it's just a humble,
simple little house.

1435
01:17:28,322 --> 01:17:32,243
[Ron] They didn't even
replace their septic tank

1436
01:17:32,284 --> 01:17:35,496
after 40 years of living there.

1437
01:17:35,537 --> 01:17:37,831
When I would visit there,

1438
01:17:37,873 --> 01:17:41,961
they didn't want anything
other than liquids

1439
01:17:42,002 --> 01:17:44,129
going down their toilet.

1440
01:17:44,171 --> 01:17:46,048
Number two's, they just said,

1441
01:17:46,090 --> 01:17:47,549
"Don't flush,
we'll take care of it."

1442
01:17:47,591 --> 01:17:50,678
I think they would wrap it up,
probably put it outside,

1443
01:17:50,719 --> 01:17:54,139
and then they would take
the trash to the city dump.

1444
01:17:54,181 --> 01:17:58,394
And, uh... odd as that was, um,

1445
01:17:58,435 --> 01:18:01,021
I found out, years later,
they didn't want

1446
01:18:01,063 --> 01:18:04,275
to spend the money to replace
their septic tank.

1447
01:18:25,921 --> 01:18:30,342
"He pulled the body to the hole
and forced it down,
head first, into the tank.

1448
01:18:30,384 --> 01:18:32,428
He watched it sink
to the bottom.

1449
01:18:32,469 --> 01:18:34,221
Using all the strength
in his body,

1450
01:18:34,263 --> 01:18:36,932
he lifted the lid,
centered it above the opening,

1451
01:18:36,974 --> 01:18:39,560
and, bending over
as far as he could,

1452
01:18:39,602 --> 01:18:40,769
he dropped it.

1453
01:18:40,811 --> 01:18:42,605
It fell into place
with a hollow thud.

1454
01:18:42,646 --> 01:18:46,066
He raked back the sand,
tamped it down with his feet,

1455
01:18:46,108 --> 01:18:47,610
and replaced the plastic."

1456
01:18:50,529 --> 01:18:51,739
Well...

1457
01:18:51,780 --> 01:18:54,366
So he's definitely had
a history of...

1458
01:18:54,408 --> 01:18:57,536
you know, hiring
itinerant workers.

1459
01:19:02,333 --> 01:19:07,046
Well, I certainly hope he didn't
do anything like this.

1460
01:19:07,087 --> 01:19:08,881
Um...

1461
01:19:11,258 --> 01:19:15,095
But I don't think
that was his character, right?

1462
01:19:16,555 --> 01:19:18,265
[Ron] I don't think so.

1463
01:19:18,307 --> 01:19:21,143
When I became
my aunt's conservator,

1464
01:19:21,185 --> 01:19:23,270
the caretakers were complaining,

1465
01:19:23,312 --> 01:19:26,190
so I brought out
some septic engineers

1466
01:19:26,232 --> 01:19:28,651
and they put in
a new septic tank.

1467
01:19:36,075 --> 01:19:39,787
These notes were from
one of our technicians,

1468
01:19:39,828 --> 01:19:44,250
and it says that,
"date last pumped:
never, 40 years."

1469
01:19:44,291 --> 01:19:47,044
So they just put the note
that it had never been pumped

1470
01:19:47,086 --> 01:19:49,672
since it was installed.

1471
01:19:49,713 --> 01:19:52,007
Right away they noticed
heavy deterioration

1472
01:19:52,049 --> 01:19:55,678
because it's double
over the replacement age.

1473
01:19:55,719 --> 01:20:00,432
And gasses and just time
will erode the concrete.

1474
01:20:00,474 --> 01:20:05,563
And this one almost had
solid waste top to bottom.

1475
01:20:05,604 --> 01:20:08,857
When we serviced it,
we pumped the liquids out.

1476
01:20:08,899 --> 01:20:10,693
That way there's a void there.

1477
01:20:10,734 --> 01:20:12,361
And they get a backhoe
or an excavator

1478
01:20:12,403 --> 01:20:14,446
and they'll just
put the heavy bucket on there

1479
01:20:14,488 --> 01:20:16,907
and it will collapse it in.

1480
01:20:16,949 --> 01:20:20,327
I would say that there
was nothing in there.

1481
01:20:20,369 --> 01:20:24,623
Um, it's very unlikely that
there was anything in there.

1482
01:20:25,791 --> 01:20:26,917
Okay.

1483
01:20:26,959 --> 01:20:28,210
"He lifted out the lid

1484
01:20:28,252 --> 01:20:29,878
and maneuvered it
alongside the hole.

1485
01:20:29,920 --> 01:20:33,924
Yes, there was the water level
in the 8-foot-diameter tank.

1486
01:20:33,966 --> 01:20:37,177
It was a foot below the opening,
exactly where it should be."

1487
01:20:39,930 --> 01:20:42,266
I hadn't read this story before.

1488
01:20:42,308 --> 01:20:46,353
Um, so that definitely
opened my mind.

1489
01:20:47,521 --> 01:20:48,772
The detail of that was,

1490
01:20:48,814 --> 01:20:53,485
well, it's surprising 'cause
95% of the customers I talk to

1491
01:20:53,527 --> 01:20:55,154
think that the tank is full,

1492
01:20:55,195 --> 01:20:58,073
but he described
that the tank level

1493
01:20:58,115 --> 01:20:59,533
was where it should be,

1494
01:20:59,575 --> 01:21:02,536
which most people
don't understand that.

1495
01:21:02,578 --> 01:21:04,288
That was surprising.

1496
01:21:04,330 --> 01:21:06,874
That's the diameter of lid,

1497
01:21:06,916 --> 01:21:08,167
and what he would have
been looking at

1498
01:21:08,208 --> 01:21:11,837
when he was describing
putting the body in the tank...

1499
01:21:11,879 --> 01:21:15,591
that's what it would
have looked like.

1500
01:21:17,509 --> 01:21:19,678
It's very feasible, yeah.

1501
01:21:19,720 --> 01:21:22,097
Maybe that actually happened.

1502
01:21:29,188 --> 01:21:31,232
[Tim] We did not look
into the septic tank.

1503
01:21:31,273 --> 01:21:33,943
We've reviewed this book
down to some extent, right?

1504
01:21:33,984 --> 01:21:36,111
And some of it can seem
to be pretty compelling,

1505
01:21:36,153 --> 01:21:39,365
but again it's an effort
of what can be corroborated,

1506
01:21:39,406 --> 01:21:41,492
right, what can you
establish as fact

1507
01:21:41,533 --> 01:21:44,161
versus fiction, right, something
that was just written down,

1508
01:21:44,203 --> 01:21:47,498
and so frankly, that's also
really more of a matter
for the local police

1509
01:21:47,539 --> 01:21:49,208
than it would be for the FBI.

1510
01:21:49,250 --> 01:21:52,962
Uh, all I can say with this is,

1511
01:21:53,003 --> 01:21:54,630
is it possible? Sure.

1512
01:21:54,672 --> 01:21:58,968
Is it consistent with
details on that property? Yes.

1513
01:21:59,009 --> 01:22:03,013
The yard is completely
full of lava rock.

1514
01:22:03,055 --> 01:22:04,598
Full of lava rock, yeah.

1515
01:22:04,640 --> 01:22:07,810
[Mike] Were the gardens
manicured at one time? Yes.

1516
01:22:07,851 --> 01:22:10,354
And is it possible
to put somebody,

1517
01:22:10,396 --> 01:22:12,147
a dead body, into a septic tank?

1518
01:22:12,189 --> 01:22:14,733
The way he's describing it,
that would be consistent

1519
01:22:14,775 --> 01:22:17,361
with a ferro-concrete
septic tank,

1520
01:22:17,403 --> 01:22:18,821
which was commonly used,

1521
01:22:18,862 --> 01:22:22,032
and the access to the tanks
are well large enough

1522
01:22:22,074 --> 01:22:23,409
to dispose of a body.

1523
01:22:23,450 --> 01:22:26,453
A whole body would be easier,
in that particular tank,

1524
01:22:26,495 --> 01:22:27,955
to fit in there.

1525
01:22:27,997 --> 01:22:29,665
[Dave] In the late '70s,

1526
01:22:29,707 --> 01:22:32,876
craftsmen would come up
from Mexico, and still do,

1527
01:22:32,918 --> 01:22:34,670
to help in the building
of the house.

1528
01:22:34,712 --> 01:22:38,090
You know, because Jerry
certainly couldn't have built
that house on his own.

1529
01:22:38,132 --> 01:22:42,094
In '77,
he showed us his blueprints

1530
01:22:42,136 --> 01:22:44,513
and he bragged
that he was gonna hire

1531
01:22:44,555 --> 01:22:47,433
undocumented workers to do it.

1532
01:22:47,474 --> 01:22:49,893
And what's sad is,

1533
01:22:49,935 --> 01:22:52,146
unfortunately, especially then,

1534
01:22:52,187 --> 01:22:54,356
if somebody came up missing,

1535
01:22:54,398 --> 01:22:56,317
you know, who was
gonna investigate it?

1536
01:22:56,358 --> 01:22:57,818
Who was gonna track 'em down?

1537
01:22:57,860 --> 01:23:04,700
[Mike] Our society tends to
turn a blind eye in many ways

1538
01:23:04,742 --> 01:23:09,455
to people who are living
in the shadows, in the cracks.

1539
01:23:09,496 --> 01:23:13,626
And for those people
to disappear,

1540
01:23:13,667 --> 01:23:19,048
if you don't recognize their
presence in the first place,

1541
01:23:19,089 --> 01:23:22,468
how would you notice
their departure?

1542
01:23:22,509 --> 01:23:24,428
I've actually had inquiries

1543
01:23:24,470 --> 01:23:28,223
from Mexican authorities
over the years,

1544
01:23:28,265 --> 01:23:32,186
from families in Mexico,
wondering where people are.

1545
01:23:35,648 --> 01:23:37,274
[Ron] Hi, this is Ron.

1546
01:23:37,316 --> 01:23:40,653
Uh, I was thinking
about everything

1547
01:23:40,694 --> 01:23:43,530
after our interview,

1548
01:23:43,572 --> 01:23:46,492
and, uh, what struck me was,

1549
01:23:46,533 --> 01:23:49,453
when I talked to my aunt
about the septic tank,

1550
01:23:49,495 --> 01:23:53,249
she was dead set
against having it done.

1551
01:23:53,290 --> 01:23:55,042
She got very upset about it,

1552
01:23:55,084 --> 01:23:58,254
started making some excuses.

1553
01:23:59,713 --> 01:24:01,548
And her agitation
grew and grew

1554
01:24:01,590 --> 01:24:04,927
till the day she died
of a brain hemorrhage

1555
01:24:04,969 --> 01:24:07,012
less than a week later.

1556
01:24:28,909 --> 01:24:30,286
So what I'm thinking,

1557
01:24:30,327 --> 01:24:34,164
I'll probably get the GPR
and bring it around here,

1558
01:24:34,206 --> 01:24:36,208
around over here.

1559
01:24:36,250 --> 01:24:39,545
At some point, you're gonna
end up seeing the in-flow...

1560
01:24:39,587 --> 01:24:41,463
-Mm-hmm.
-...from the house,

1561
01:24:41,505 --> 01:24:43,924
and then whether it's
an infiltrator or a leach...

1562
01:24:43,966 --> 01:24:46,260
-Right.
-...field below it.

1563
01:24:46,302 --> 01:24:49,013
-Okay.
-Just ask Bach, right?

1564
01:24:49,054 --> 01:24:51,807
[chuckles] He probably knows
where it is.

1565
01:24:59,231 --> 01:25:02,067
[Mike] Law enforcement
does tend to use this equipment

1566
01:25:02,109 --> 01:25:04,778
for things that are
a little bit less mundane

1567
01:25:04,820 --> 01:25:08,240
than finding a buried
water line, electrical line.

1568
01:25:09,742 --> 01:25:11,785
Ground penetrating radar
can indicate

1569
01:25:11,827 --> 01:25:14,997
an old gravesite,
a murder victim.

1570
01:25:15,039 --> 01:25:18,000
But it takes the trained eye,
like yours,

1571
01:25:18,042 --> 01:25:19,585
doing what we're doing
right now.

1572
01:25:19,627 --> 01:25:25,674
Yeah. Yeah, I have a few
spikes on the screen.

1573
01:25:25,716 --> 01:25:29,553
One is pretty significant
right here.

1574
01:25:29,595 --> 01:25:32,473
There's a clear solid image
of an indication

1575
01:25:32,514 --> 01:25:34,934
of there's something
disrupting the signal.

1576
01:25:34,975 --> 01:25:37,478
[Mike] Common sense would tend
to think it's a leach line.

1577
01:25:37,519 --> 01:25:39,521
Yeah, yeah, I would say
without a...

1578
01:25:39,563 --> 01:25:42,942
Almost 100% sure, that's more
than likely what it is.

1579
01:25:42,983 --> 01:25:44,235
-Makes sense.
-Like I said,

1580
01:25:44,276 --> 01:25:47,404
the indication happens
right between the tires, so...

1581
01:25:47,446 --> 01:25:51,033
I would say that's the best...
the best guess right there.

1582
01:26:12,304 --> 01:26:14,348
Got a small indication
right there.

1583
01:26:14,390 --> 01:26:18,060
Might it be the edge
of the tank itself?

1584
01:26:18,102 --> 01:26:19,353
It could be the edge.

1585
01:26:19,395 --> 01:26:23,148
It could be, um, see that dip
in the floor right there?

1586
01:26:23,190 --> 01:26:25,025
-Okay.
-It could have been the GPR

1587
01:26:25,067 --> 01:26:27,319
going down
and coming up real quick.

1588
01:26:27,361 --> 01:26:29,321
I want to go across the house.

1589
01:26:29,363 --> 01:26:31,782
-[Mike] Like the lawn area?
-Mm-hmm.

1590
01:26:31,824 --> 01:26:35,536
I'm getting the same reading
that I was over here.

1591
01:26:35,578 --> 01:26:37,496
-See, right here?
-Mm-hmm.

1592
01:26:37,538 --> 01:26:38,914
How it jumps up like that.

1593
01:26:38,956 --> 01:26:40,666
That's a pretty solid
return there.

1594
01:26:40,708 --> 01:26:42,710
Yeah. So, how she said,

1595
01:26:42,751 --> 01:26:45,671
I think she was right how,
sort of rectangle right here.

1596
01:26:45,713 --> 01:26:47,131
-Mm-hmm.
-And it splits.

1597
01:26:47,172 --> 01:26:49,717
So that would make sense
from what I'm getting.

1598
01:26:49,758 --> 01:26:52,303
I'm gonna do
one more on the other side,

1599
01:26:52,344 --> 01:26:55,723
and then I think...

1600
01:26:55,764 --> 01:26:58,017
that'll be pretty much

1601
01:26:58,058 --> 01:27:01,145
all I can pick up with this.

1602
01:27:02,381 --> 01:27:05,774
At my point in my career,
I'm quite resigned to the fact

1603
01:27:05,816 --> 01:27:08,736
that I may not have
all of the blanks filled in

1604
01:27:08,777 --> 01:27:10,613
when cases are closed.

1605
01:27:12,740 --> 01:27:16,911
Law enforcement cases
rarely end the way they start.

1606
01:27:16,952 --> 01:27:19,288
And many times,
what you start with

1607
01:27:19,330 --> 01:27:22,917
has to be completely rewritten
two or three times,

1608
01:27:22,958 --> 01:27:25,836
and you go
where the evidence takes you.

1609
01:27:25,878 --> 01:27:27,171
Nothing?

1610
01:27:27,212 --> 01:27:29,006
-No.
-At least nothing unusual?

1611
01:27:29,048 --> 01:27:30,966
Nothing unusual.

1612
01:27:32,676 --> 01:27:36,513
If the evidence
doesn't lead you

1613
01:27:36,555 --> 01:27:39,433
to a certain place
or conclusion,

1614
01:27:39,475 --> 01:27:42,686
then you really can't
defend that conclusion.

1615
01:27:44,563 --> 01:27:46,899
You know what, I may have to go.

1616
01:27:50,236 --> 01:27:52,238
I may have to go.

1617
01:27:54,073 --> 01:27:55,908
Okay, units there yet?

1618
01:27:55,950 --> 01:27:57,493
[woman] Yes, uh-huh.

1619
01:27:57,534 --> 01:28:00,037
Okay, I'm gonna be
headed that way shortly.

1620
01:28:01,914 --> 01:28:03,624
Okay, thank you.
Mm-hmm, bye.

1621
01:28:04,667 --> 01:28:06,377
[woman] If you need
to get going...

1622
01:28:06,418 --> 01:28:08,295
I do. We have a homicide.

1623
01:28:08,337 --> 01:28:09,964
[woman] Okay.

1624
01:28:10,005 --> 01:28:11,966
I don't have any, any issues

1625
01:28:12,007 --> 01:28:15,302
with there still being
unanswered questions.

1626
01:28:20,474 --> 01:28:23,143
[Ron] Most people who
commit crimes, I would assume,

1627
01:28:23,185 --> 01:28:25,145
think they could
get away with it.

1628
01:28:25,187 --> 01:28:30,985
So that wasn't anything
for my uncle to aspire to.

1629
01:28:31,026 --> 01:28:34,488
He thought he was
better than most people.

1630
01:28:37,408 --> 01:28:41,412
He could confess to it
and still get away with it.

1631
01:28:45,124 --> 01:28:48,961
In a sense, his book
was his confession.

1632
01:28:52,715 --> 01:28:54,425
But you're just left to wonder,

1633
01:28:54,466 --> 01:28:57,970
which parts are reality
and which parts are fiction?

1634
01:29:00,097 --> 01:29:02,391
[Isaac] Maybe that was
his plan all along,

1635
01:29:02,433 --> 01:29:06,687
to keep himself within
the realm of consciousness.

1636
01:29:06,729 --> 01:29:10,024
You know, the mystery
is very exciting,

1637
01:29:10,065 --> 01:29:12,610
just knowing that,
that I'll never know

1638
01:29:12,651 --> 01:29:15,654
what parts are true
and what aren't.

1639
01:29:15,696 --> 01:29:18,157
His intention perhaps was

1640
01:29:18,198 --> 01:29:21,452
to turn himself into a legend.

1641
01:29:23,537 --> 01:29:25,956
[Buck] I think in death
he got what he wanted.

1642
01:29:25,998 --> 01:29:27,791
-Yeah. He's well-known.
-I really do.

1643
01:29:33,088 --> 01:29:35,341
[Mark] But the final line
of the book is,

1644
01:29:35,382 --> 01:29:37,426
"To own wealth
is to be possessed by it."

1645
01:29:37,468 --> 01:29:39,970
"Stolen assets
are not safe anywhere."

1646
01:29:40,012 --> 01:29:43,265
"It can bring only
disquietude to their possessor,

1647
01:29:43,307 --> 01:29:45,476
for such is the nature
of man..."

1648
01:29:45,517 --> 01:29:47,436
"...they spin an endless web
of deceit..."

1649
01:29:47,478 --> 01:29:49,605
"...forever imprisoning
their owner

1650
01:29:49,647 --> 01:29:52,233
in an insidious embrace."

1651
01:29:56,070 --> 01:30:00,532
[Isaac]
It was probably very hard
for him to keep this a secret.

1652
01:30:00,574 --> 01:30:02,576
Must have been torture.

1653
01:30:04,370 --> 01:30:07,414
[Dave] Maybe at the very end,
by giving the painting back,

1654
01:30:07,456 --> 01:30:08,916
we outsmarted Jerry.

1655
01:30:11,293 --> 01:30:13,170
People will walk in
and they'll say,

1656
01:30:13,212 --> 01:30:16,215
"Is this the place that
found the de Kooning?"

1657
01:30:16,257 --> 01:30:18,550
[Rick Johnson] We've had people
from the Netherlands,

1658
01:30:18,592 --> 01:30:22,179
from everywhere, that have
come over to see the store

1659
01:30:22,221 --> 01:30:23,264
where the painting was found.

1660
01:30:23,305 --> 01:30:25,307
-We've gotten
phone calls from...
-Spain...

1661
01:30:25,349 --> 01:30:27,476
-...all over the world.
-Yep, all over the world.

1662
01:30:27,518 --> 01:30:30,062
Just calling to say thank you,
you know.

1663
01:30:30,104 --> 01:30:31,939
And those still choke us up.

1664
01:30:31,981 --> 01:30:36,735
We just received gifts yesterday
from one of our customers

1665
01:30:36,777 --> 01:30:39,405
who brought us this fantastic
book on de Kooning

1666
01:30:39,446 --> 01:30:41,991
and this absolutely
fabulous letter.

1667
01:30:45,160 --> 01:30:47,705
"In this day and age,
when greed, dishonesty...

1668
01:30:52,167 --> 01:30:55,212
and lack of integrity
are commonplace...

1669
01:31:00,884 --> 01:31:04,805
you three wonderful people
are a beacon of hope
for this world

1670
01:31:04,847 --> 01:31:07,057
and you put Silver City
on the world map

1671
01:31:07,099 --> 01:31:10,144
in the most fantastic light
possible.

1672
01:31:10,185 --> 01:31:11,770
Sincerely, Nancy."

1673
01:31:14,231 --> 01:31:15,357
That's... sorry.

1674
01:31:19,445 --> 01:31:22,865
I mean, who thinks you're gonna
ever get that proclamation

1675
01:31:22,907 --> 01:31:26,118
that a good deed you did...

1676
01:31:26,160 --> 01:31:28,203
has that much pull

1677
01:31:28,245 --> 01:31:31,415
that it makes the world pause
even for a second

1678
01:31:31,457 --> 01:31:33,667
to say "Wow"?

1679
01:31:37,922 --> 01:31:42,051
[Brian] August 6th will be
the day that I retire.

1680
01:31:42,092 --> 01:31:43,719
It will be a big day
and a new chapter.

1681
01:31:50,434 --> 01:31:53,562
When I saw our cars
come up with the painting

1682
01:31:53,604 --> 01:31:56,023
and then when I actually
got to see it again

1683
01:31:56,065 --> 01:31:58,651
here in the art museum, uh...

1684
01:31:58,692 --> 01:32:01,862
I got a little choked up,
I'll admit that.

1685
01:32:01,904 --> 01:32:05,157
The warmth came back,
if that makes any sense.

1686
01:32:05,199 --> 01:32:06,909
There was a sense of closure.

1687
01:32:11,872 --> 01:32:14,917
Only the Alters know
the circumstances

1688
01:32:14,959 --> 01:32:17,127
of how they came into possession
of that painting,

1689
01:32:17,169 --> 01:32:20,214
and unfortunately they've taken
that information to the grave,

1690
01:32:20,256 --> 01:32:22,591
and so we close
that investigation.

1691
01:32:26,136 --> 01:32:31,809
[Buck] One of the most prized
possessions from this whole
experience is that empty frame.

1692
01:32:31,850 --> 01:32:35,020
It held that painting
for 30-plus years,

1693
01:32:35,062 --> 01:32:37,856
and everybody that has been
a part of this story

1694
01:32:37,898 --> 01:32:40,192
has signed the back of it.

1695
01:32:40,234 --> 01:32:41,443
"Thank you for everything.

1696
01:32:41,485 --> 01:32:44,071
So glad it was you all
who found it."

1697
01:32:44,113 --> 01:32:47,241
"Our heroes, love you guys."

1698
01:32:47,283 --> 01:32:50,077
"We could never
possibly thank you enough.

1699
01:32:50,119 --> 01:32:51,870
We love our heroes."

1700
01:32:51,912 --> 01:32:53,789
Why does that
make me wanna cry?

1701
01:32:53,831 --> 01:32:55,040
I know.

1702
01:32:55,082 --> 01:32:57,960
I don't know, I think we got
the better end of the deal.

1703
01:33:00,045 --> 01:33:02,047
All right, let's see
how it looks.

1704
01:33:02,089 --> 01:33:04,425
[upbeat music playing]