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(tense music)

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Downloaded from
YTS.MX

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Official YIFY movies site:
YTS.MX

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(tense music continues)

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(tense music continues)

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In the midst of an economic storm,

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a new world emerges,
right before our eyes.

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It makes me reflect on my childhood,

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when something happened to me,

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that would shape my perspective forever.

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In 1993, at the height
of the HIV AIDS pandemic,

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my father started a foundation
for prevention programs

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in Africa.

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My family was along for the ride.

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While many searched for a cure,
he chose a different path.

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And listening to local community leaders,

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questioning conventional development aid,

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and recognizing that just maybe,

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the West did not have all the answers.

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Three decades later,

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I find myself having similar realizations.

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My own journey began wanting
to build upon a legacy,

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harnessing the power of
technology to expand the impact.

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This paper I'm writing
initially aimed to assist

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some of the world's leading agencies

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on financial inclusion agendas,

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but I quickly became overwhelmed

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by a financial technology movement

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that was already underway.

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I started to question
if financial inclusion

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was more than just buzzwords,

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and whether or not the West
actually cared about places

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like Africa, and the global south.

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Was I delusional?

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After all, the West grapples
with its own problems.

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And then, almost like it was scripted,

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another pandemic struck,

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contributing to more economic
uncertainty in the West.

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Trade tensions, heightened inflation,

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soaring interest rates,
recession concerns,

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money printing, banks collapsing,

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32 trillion in national debt,

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one trillion coming from credit card debt.

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Some people even had
their bank accounts frozen

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for showing solidarity
and support for others.

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Living and investigating in Africa,

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watching everything unravel back home,

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I refocused my research and
dialed it in with a new lens.

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With millions of people
considered unbanked in the West,

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perhaps listening to the
challenges faced by those in Africa

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who have already lived
this economic reality

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wasn't as crazy as it
was sounding in my head.

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As my journey continued, I found
myself asking the question,

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"Can Africa save the West?"

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(tense music)

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I think we need to start at the beginning,

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where I got this whole idea.

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So let's rewind 30 years.

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In a tiny village, my
dad founded a project.

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Sensing a shift in the charitable model,

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the idea that Africa needed saving

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in conventional ways seemed flawed.

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So the community
initiated a pilot project,

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aimed at integrating the unbanked

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into the economy through loans.

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Many would call this microfinance.

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According to hard local data,

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loans were repaid 99% of the time.

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No credit scoring system,
no fancy credit algorithms,

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no technology, no banks.

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So why does this matter for the West?

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Well, when I came across a
story of a group of women

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who are trying to own the land they occupy

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using these microfinance loans,

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it became clear that their unique formula

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for loan repayment held the potential

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to address an ongoing
affordable housing crisis.

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- The chairperson of
LC3 came to us and said,

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"Can you assist me and
give these women loans

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so that they can put their money together

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and go and pay the bank so
that they cannot be evicted?"

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The landlord had secured
a loan from the bank,

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and put this piece of land as the security

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so that the bank can give him the loan.

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And he failed to pay the loan.

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That's when the bank came, and
wanted to evict these people,

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so that the bank can
sell this piece of land

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and secure the money that
the landlord had taken.

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They just throw you away.

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And you go in there and
you have nowhere to stay.

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- [Luke] Two groups of
women faced eviction

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because the landowner
wasn't paying the mortgage.

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- [Hajat] So we came and had
a meeting with the women,

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and informed them about the process on

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how we give out loans.

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It's just the trust from these women.

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If one doesn't pay,

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then other members will
have to pay for her loan.

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So the group is the security.

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[Luke] So they each get a separate loan?

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Yes, each one gets a separate loan.

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- [Luke] But together
through all of the loans,

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collectively, they pay back the bank loan?

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Yes.

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- [Luke] So the foundation
steps in with a loan offer.

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With no track record,

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credit worthiness is based on
the strength of one's standing

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in community, known as social collateral.

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- We give them a grace
period of one month.

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Another is that our
interest rate is very low.

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We want them to be well in their families,

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which other lending
institutions don't have,

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because for them, they
just give out loans.

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They want interest, they want money back.

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[Luke] Is this story a rare exception

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in the field of microfinance?

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Could trust and reputation be the key?

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I left with more questions,

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so I turned to a leading
microfinance expert

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to explore its potential
for Western economics.

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- There's a dangerous
issue in microfinance,

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which it straddles both
the most charitable

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and the least charitable institutions,

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which is the repayment rate.

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The fact that someone
is able to repay a loan

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has absolutely nothing to do

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with whether that loan
actually helped them.

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There are many cases,

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and this has been seen across the world.

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Cases of women being
forced into prostitution

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in order to repay their loans.

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About this job, uh uh, no one like it.

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- Well, those banks still
reported 99% repayment rates.

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The question is, how did the
women get the money to repay?

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Parents, because of the fear

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of not repaying a microfinance loan,

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they take their children out of school,

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and they get their children to also work

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in the family business in
order to repay the loan.

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So the microfinance institution
turns around and says,

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"Ha, we have a 99% repayment rate.

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Therefore, we helped the client."

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Well, not necessarily.

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Maybe the client struggled,

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and only just managed to repay the loan,

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but we didn't hear about that.

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- [Luke] These discussions
led me to reassess this story

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for Western contexts.

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But faced with increasing home losses,

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groups of women leveraged
their community bonds

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to access loans from a charitable lender,

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and it made me wonder if
institutions in the West

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could embrace lending
with a similar spirit.

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(gentle music)

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(gentle music continues)

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With this story on my mind,

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it was hard to miss the obvious clues

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for another grounded approach,

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funded not by companies and charity,

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but by the will of the people.

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They're called SACCOs, savings
and credit co-operatives.

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- A SACCO is a
member-user-controlled organization.

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It belongs to the people. It
belongs to a number of people.

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And they mobilize their own
capital from their own pockets

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and they pool their resources together.

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They select the board members

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who actually oversee the
operations of the SACCO

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on behalf of other members,

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getting somebody who can lead them,

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and then they empower
that person to lead them

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whom they can trust.

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- It's the place that people
go when they feel alienated,

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or excluded from traditional

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mainstream commercial banking systems,

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where groups of people come together,

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pool money in a cooperative manner,

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and then they will share these
goods to each member in turn.

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- [Luke] So all these years
driving through East Africa,

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I'd never stopped to
think about what's printed

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on the side of these buses.

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And as it turns out,

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these are giant moving
billboards for community banks.

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- But microfinance institutions
are actually companies,

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most of them are companies.

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But the SACCO, the ideas,

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the policies are developed
by their members.

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In microfinance institutions,
you don't share profits.

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They go to a few shareholders.

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Something has changed dramatically.

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Financial institutions have
become very preoccupied

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with profits and they've become detached

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from everyday people and their needs.

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And I think ROSCA systems,
SACCOs, co-operatives,

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provide that alternative, more
social humanistic approach

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to people's economic development.

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[Luke] After my visit to the kingdom,

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I needed an example of a SACCO in action.

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On more than one occasion,

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I made the 10-hour journey from Kampala

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to a place called Okere City.

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- So this is the road?
- Yes, this is the road.

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So we have another three hours to go.

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We'll ask a few more
strangers how to get there.

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(traffic noises)

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(traffic noises)

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In the late 90s,

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the government implemented
a blanket policy

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of everyone in this
part of Northern Uganda

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must be resident in the
internally displaced people camps.

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At that time, most rural
Northern Uganda was unstable.

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Towards the late 2000s, conflict subsided,

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people started returning back home.

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And basically this is
what they found. A bush.

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So they had to start
rebuilding themselves,

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fighting the legacies of conflict.

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[Luke] Reflecting on Ojok's accounts

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of rebuilding a community,

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I couldn't help but draw parallels

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to the ongoing wars in
Palestine, or Ukraine.

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How do people start over in the aftermath

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of such devastating conflicts?

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(tense music)

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When I was returning home,

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was also the same time that
"Black Panther" was released.

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And I was so mesmerized by
the fact that a community,

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a fictitious nation of Wakanda,

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located within the East African region,

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had a resource that they used

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to power everything in their country.

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And when I returned here,
I looked at this shea tree,

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and I'm like, "This
could be our vibranium."

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This could be this resource

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that powers our
transformation as a community.

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So shea butter is one
of the most sought-after

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cosmetic product.

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So I tell the community this,
and they can't believe it.

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They're like, "But we just eat this here,

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and everybody has it."

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And so they don't even value it

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because everybody's having it.

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For you to get this shea butter,

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the production process itself
is an entire day's work.

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And that is assuming

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that you already have the dry shea nuts.

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They get money from the
sale of the shea butter.

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The other way they can also get money

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is through the dividend.

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So if a village member is part
of the co-operative society,

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they get a small percentage of the profits

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that the co-operative society
has made through sale.

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This is an important global resource

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that can play significant
role in connecting us.

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- That idea of Ubuntu,
that's what he's doing.

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I am, because you are.

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When people have gone
through extreme forms

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of displacement or crisis,

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that's when people turn to one another

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to figure out how can we
cooperate to mitigate the fallout.

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And money pooling is one way
that people come together

260
00:13:12,000 --> 00:13:15,273
to repair the harms that
have happened in society.

261
00:13:16,200 --> 00:13:18,360
- So Ojok took me to the
heart of the community,

262
00:13:18,360 --> 00:13:19,590
where on Saturdays,

263
00:13:19,590 --> 00:13:22,410
the entire village meets
to do their banking.

264
00:13:22,410 --> 00:13:24,780
So I'm sitting there,

265
00:13:24,780 --> 00:13:28,863
and in comes this mysterious green box.

266
00:13:30,050 --> 00:13:32,850
- [Ojok] The box usually
has three padlocks.

267
00:13:32,850 --> 00:13:36,347
As we can see, three different
people must have the keys

268
00:13:36,347 --> 00:13:37,920
for each of these padlocks,

269
00:13:37,920 --> 00:13:42,066
because the idea is that
if you give one person

270
00:13:42,066 --> 00:13:44,790
all these three keys,

271
00:13:44,790 --> 00:13:48,300
then they might look for where the box is,

272
00:13:48,300 --> 00:13:51,300
and they'll open the box
and take all the money.

273
00:13:51,300 --> 00:13:56,280
So the box is not kept
where any of the person

274
00:13:56,280 --> 00:13:58,260
with the keys are.

275
00:13:58,260 --> 00:14:01,080
And so what happens is that
each of these three people

276
00:14:01,080 --> 00:14:05,610
must be present for a
village saving activity

277
00:14:05,610 --> 00:14:06,630
to be conducted.

278
00:14:06,630 --> 00:14:11,010
So this box basically is village bank.

279
00:14:11,010 --> 00:14:13,260
[Luke] After driving for 11 hours,

280
00:14:13,260 --> 00:14:16,380
the big reveal was a safety deposit box.

281
00:14:16,380 --> 00:14:18,843
How was this a solution for the West?

282
00:14:19,950 --> 00:14:21,510
When you put your money into a bank,

283
00:14:21,510 --> 00:14:24,840
you're not putting it into safe custody.

284
00:14:24,840 --> 00:14:27,420
You are lending it to the bank.

285
00:14:27,420 --> 00:14:30,510
It is safe only if the bank is safe.

286
00:14:30,510 --> 00:14:33,630
Unless the terms of your
agreement with the bank

287
00:14:33,630 --> 00:14:37,110
are that you've put your
money into safe custody,

288
00:14:37,110 --> 00:14:39,450
banks do offer safe deposit boxes.

289
00:14:39,450 --> 00:14:41,580
You put physical cash
into a safe deposit box,

290
00:14:41,580 --> 00:14:42,480
that is your money.

291
00:14:42,480 --> 00:14:44,430
The bank's not supposed to
be able to touch it, right?

292
00:14:44,430 --> 00:14:47,100
But you put money into an
ordinary deposit account,

293
00:14:47,100 --> 00:14:49,500
you check the terms and conditions
of your deposit account,

294
00:14:49,500 --> 00:14:51,253
you'll find you've lent
the money to the bank,

295
00:14:51,253 --> 00:14:52,980
and the bank could do
what it likes with it.

296
00:14:52,980 --> 00:14:56,640
Technically, it's not
yours, but you have a claim.

297
00:14:56,640 --> 00:14:58,650
[Luke] The process of community banking

298
00:14:58,650 --> 00:15:00,480
was surprisingly straightforward.

299
00:15:00,480 --> 00:15:02,220
Proceeds from the shea butter sales

300
00:15:02,220 --> 00:15:03,690
made their way into the box,

301
00:15:03,690 --> 00:15:06,630
becoming the village's
well-deserved compensation.

302
00:15:06,630 --> 00:15:09,150
Then came monthly
contributions to the SACCO,

303
00:15:09,150 --> 00:15:12,210
interest on loans paid,
new loans extended,

304
00:15:12,210 --> 00:15:15,570
and at last, dividends
were paid to everyone.

305
00:15:15,570 --> 00:15:20,570
- Inside the toolbox
are also money purses.

306
00:15:20,750 --> 00:15:24,630
So I hope there is money in
this box, but they are meant to,

307
00:15:24,630 --> 00:15:28,530
so all the savings that people bring

308
00:15:28,530 --> 00:15:32,700
are put into this money purses,

309
00:15:32,700 --> 00:15:34,920
and luckily this group has many.

310
00:15:34,920 --> 00:15:36,300
So this is what remained

311
00:15:36,300 --> 00:15:39,660
after lending out the
last time they served,

312
00:15:39,660 --> 00:15:41,280
which was last week.

313
00:15:41,280 --> 00:15:46,280
And they have about 230,000 shillings,

314
00:15:46,500 --> 00:15:51,500
which is an equivalent
of about six, US$70.

315
00:15:55,140 --> 00:15:59,070
- And basically what this
box represents, is hope.

316
00:15:59,070 --> 00:16:01,950
It's the hope that we
can assist each other.

317
00:16:01,950 --> 00:16:04,500
It's the hope that we can transform things

318
00:16:04,500 --> 00:16:06,210
so we have a better society.

319
00:16:06,210 --> 00:16:09,954
And people put their money based on trust

320
00:16:09,954 --> 00:16:13,470
to support one another's activities.

321
00:16:13,470 --> 00:16:16,393
And that box has huge inspiration

322
00:16:16,393 --> 00:16:20,370
of transforming the financial
systems that we have.

323
00:16:20,370 --> 00:16:22,590
- Money often is the one
thing that destroys it,

324
00:16:22,590 --> 00:16:23,670
not build it.

325
00:16:23,670 --> 00:16:25,706
Want of money tends to destroy it,

326
00:16:25,706 --> 00:16:29,490
whereas gradual money
going in that they grow,

327
00:16:29,490 --> 00:16:32,040
that they take ownership
of, they take the fund,

328
00:16:32,040 --> 00:16:35,160
they grow the fund, they
become part of the fund.

329
00:16:35,160 --> 00:16:37,321
And now that fund is an
integral part of the community

330
00:16:37,321 --> 00:16:41,133
that now gives you a far
different basis to operate from.

331
00:16:43,500 --> 00:16:47,940
- [Speaker] African people
always came together

332
00:16:47,940 --> 00:16:52,940
to collect resources, to give
it out to the people in need,

333
00:16:54,480 --> 00:16:57,180
get it back, and continue lending it.

334
00:16:57,180 --> 00:17:01,800
What we are doing here has a
lot to do with the refinements

335
00:17:01,800 --> 00:17:06,621
and improvements around what
existed in the community.

336
00:17:06,621 --> 00:17:09,204
(gentle music)

337
00:17:13,710 --> 00:17:16,560
- After my visit to Ojok in
the heart of the smart city,

338
00:17:16,560 --> 00:17:18,330
I found myself questioning whether or not

339
00:17:18,330 --> 00:17:21,393
the symbolic green box was
more than just a metaphor.

340
00:17:22,230 --> 00:17:24,810
But what if this humble green
box could be the catalyst

341
00:17:24,810 --> 00:17:27,780
for digitizing informal community banks?

342
00:17:27,780 --> 00:17:29,580
And now that I was looking for it,

343
00:17:29,580 --> 00:17:32,970
I continued to find communities
like Ojok's everywhere,

344
00:17:32,970 --> 00:17:35,160
who had already embraced technology

345
00:17:35,160 --> 00:17:39,390
in tandem with their own boxes,
helping them track savings,

346
00:17:39,390 --> 00:17:41,970
dividends, and new loans.

347
00:17:41,970 --> 00:17:44,400
However, skeptics would argue

348
00:17:44,400 --> 00:17:46,740
that even by digitizing a SACCO,

349
00:17:46,740 --> 00:17:48,630
financial growth is still limited

350
00:17:48,630 --> 00:17:51,150
to what's inside the community box.

351
00:17:51,150 --> 00:17:55,350
Again, I started to reevaluate
if SACCOs are scalable

352
00:17:55,350 --> 00:17:58,863
for Western scenarios,
even with technology.

353
00:18:00,138 --> 00:18:02,638
(tense music)

354
00:18:09,690 --> 00:18:13,020
The green box was not
limited to Ojok's community.

355
00:18:13,020 --> 00:18:14,910
These boxes were everywhere.

356
00:18:14,910 --> 00:18:18,030
And they are supercharged

357
00:18:18,030 --> 00:18:21,300
by a technology called mobile money.

358
00:18:21,300 --> 00:18:23,640
All the money is kept in that box.

359
00:18:23,640 --> 00:18:25,200
- [Luke] That's the first
one I've seen like that.

360
00:18:25,200 --> 00:18:26,595
- [Ssenkumba] Yeah!
- That's like a mini...

361
00:18:26,595 --> 00:18:28,105
It's a mobile money kiosk.

362
00:18:28,105 --> 00:18:30,605
(tense music)

363
00:18:33,710 --> 00:18:37,590
- In 2007, I remember
walking into the office

364
00:18:37,590 --> 00:18:40,020
of the then Safaricom CEO,

365
00:18:40,020 --> 00:18:42,807
and he'd showed me something
and it was called M-PESA,

366
00:18:42,807 --> 00:18:45,330
and he said, "This could be quite sticky."

367
00:18:45,330 --> 00:18:48,210
And this product was
designed to facilitate

368
00:18:48,210 --> 00:18:52,380
the movement of money from
the wage earner in the city

369
00:18:52,380 --> 00:18:55,830
back to his family somewhere
in the countryside.

370
00:18:55,830 --> 00:19:00,363
From that is launched the
whole mobile money phenomena.

371
00:19:01,380 --> 00:19:05,460
- Anything that is moving
money around can act as a bank.

372
00:19:05,460 --> 00:19:07,401
It doesn't matter whether
the money you are moving

373
00:19:07,401 --> 00:19:10,200
is created by central
banks, by commercial banks,

374
00:19:10,200 --> 00:19:11,970
or by mobile phone companies.

375
00:19:11,970 --> 00:19:14,460
As long as somebody's
using it for transactions,

376
00:19:14,460 --> 00:19:15,660
then it's money.

377
00:19:15,660 --> 00:19:18,120
In Africa, access to bank accounts

378
00:19:18,120 --> 00:19:23,120
doesn't mean access to a bank account.

379
00:19:23,220 --> 00:19:27,745
It means really, access to mobile money.

380
00:19:27,745 --> 00:19:28,950
It actually started with people

381
00:19:28,950 --> 00:19:30,570
sending themselves airtime.

382
00:19:30,570 --> 00:19:32,857
And then the company
looked at it and said,

383
00:19:32,857 --> 00:19:35,940
"Okay, if people are sending figures

384
00:19:35,940 --> 00:19:38,640
to credit their phones with talk time,

385
00:19:38,640 --> 00:19:40,290
can't we do something more?"

386
00:19:40,290 --> 00:19:42,000
When digital payments came in,

387
00:19:42,000 --> 00:19:43,770
people saw an opportunity there,

388
00:19:43,770 --> 00:19:47,160
where they would reduce
their costs even lower.

389
00:19:47,160 --> 00:19:51,030
And we now started the
revolution of digital lending

390
00:19:51,030 --> 00:19:52,713
and microfinance for profit.

391
00:19:53,970 --> 00:19:55,770
- [Luke] Mobile money
evolved beyond a place

392
00:19:55,770 --> 00:19:57,840
to just send and store money.

393
00:19:57,840 --> 00:20:00,630
It became a gateway to
swift digital credit,

394
00:20:00,630 --> 00:20:03,900
providing loans at an unprecedented pace.

395
00:20:03,900 --> 00:20:06,210
- Today I was looking at
credit card debt in the US,

396
00:20:06,210 --> 00:20:07,890
it's just about a trillion dollars.

397
00:20:07,890 --> 00:20:11,910
And the average interest
rate on that debt is 24.6%,

398
00:20:11,910 --> 00:20:14,250
which is very expensive.

399
00:20:14,250 --> 00:20:16,627
Why is somebody not thinking,

400
00:20:16,627 --> 00:20:19,140
"I can disrupt that credit card business

401
00:20:19,140 --> 00:20:22,260
by coming in via the
mobile money business."

402
00:20:22,260 --> 00:20:24,270
The channel cost to reach all these people

403
00:20:24,270 --> 00:20:26,790
is cheaper than a credit card.

404
00:20:26,790 --> 00:20:28,800
With all the hype around these fast,

405
00:20:28,800 --> 00:20:30,000
instant digital loans,

406
00:20:30,000 --> 00:20:32,250
I had to find someone who was using them

407
00:20:32,250 --> 00:20:34,380
on a daily basis to survive.

408
00:20:34,380 --> 00:20:35,730
So most people in this market

409
00:20:35,730 --> 00:20:36,900
would have a digital loan of some kind?

410
00:20:36,900 --> 00:20:38,247
[Anne] Yeah, yes, they would.

411
00:20:38,247 --> 00:20:40,513
- And how many different
loans do you have right now?

412
00:20:40,513 --> 00:20:42,090
I have like four different loans.

413
00:20:42,090 --> 00:20:43,526
- Four different loans?
- Yes.

414
00:20:43,526 --> 00:20:48,510
If you go to the bank, you're
asked to give security.

415
00:20:48,510 --> 00:20:49,950
But with the mobile apps,

416
00:20:49,950 --> 00:20:53,130
it is as easy as just going to the phone

417
00:20:53,130 --> 00:20:55,170
and you get it immediately.

418
00:20:55,170 --> 00:20:57,870
It's less than 30 seconds.

419
00:20:57,870 --> 00:20:59,467
We've seen quite a number of fintechs

420
00:20:59,467 --> 00:21:00,967
that have come into the
market and they say,

421
00:21:00,967 --> 00:21:03,900
"Look, we don't require any bureau data

422
00:21:03,900 --> 00:21:06,240
to assess the individual's credibility.

423
00:21:06,240 --> 00:21:10,590
We'll use other
sophisticated forms of data

424
00:21:10,590 --> 00:21:12,600
that they're able to
get from their phones,

425
00:21:12,600 --> 00:21:15,690
so they're able to scrape
data from their phones,

426
00:21:15,690 --> 00:21:16,860
get SMSes to be able

427
00:21:16,860 --> 00:21:20,370
to understand their transaction histories,

428
00:21:20,370 --> 00:21:23,409
and use that as part
of their risk modeling

429
00:21:23,409 --> 00:21:25,590
for that particular individual.

430
00:21:25,590 --> 00:21:28,200
Before mobile money,

431
00:21:28,200 --> 00:21:30,690
you would go to a
microfinance institution,

432
00:21:30,690 --> 00:21:32,250
and you'd ask for a loan.

433
00:21:32,250 --> 00:21:35,280
By the time you get that loan
a week later, two weeks later,

434
00:21:35,280 --> 00:21:39,450
a month later, your needs have changed.

435
00:21:39,450 --> 00:21:41,133
The issue was access.

436
00:21:42,180 --> 00:21:46,380
These guys filled a very important gap.

437
00:21:46,380 --> 00:21:50,430
Nobody will lend to that guy

438
00:21:50,430 --> 00:21:54,330
sitting outside on the streets.

439
00:21:54,330 --> 00:21:55,738
Not even you. Not even me.

440
00:21:55,738 --> 00:21:58,290
Why? Because you had no data.

441
00:21:58,290 --> 00:21:59,823
Mobile money changed all that.

442
00:22:01,112 --> 00:22:03,531
As we are riding our own bike.

443
00:22:03,531 --> 00:22:05,496
For others, the bike is owned by a boss.

444
00:22:05,496 --> 00:22:07,533
He gave me this bike
and now I have to pay.

445
00:22:07,533 --> 00:22:12,533
So now I need to save money
so that I can pay the loan.

446
00:22:12,977 --> 00:22:16,050
And me to save as a person, it's not easy.

447
00:22:16,050 --> 00:22:19,676
To benefit in the app,
you need to ride more,

448
00:22:19,676 --> 00:22:24,393
but on the apps, they're the
ones that give you customers.

449
00:22:24,393 --> 00:22:28,203
When you take a customer, there
are two ways of paying you.

450
00:22:29,107 --> 00:22:31,407
There is what we call a
cashless and the cash.

451
00:22:33,266 --> 00:22:35,293
Others, they're refusing cashless,

452
00:22:35,293 --> 00:22:39,157
because they'll not get
that money from the app.

453
00:22:40,143 --> 00:22:41,250
That money,

454
00:22:41,250 --> 00:22:44,610
they'll keep on chopping
it until it got finished,

455
00:22:44,610 --> 00:22:47,580
so it's not easy to grow it.

456
00:22:47,580 --> 00:22:50,010
- [Luke] All of these riders
are taking out rapid loans

457
00:22:50,010 --> 00:22:52,050
from motorbike businesses.

458
00:22:52,050 --> 00:22:56,760
Yet here I am with 10 of them,
with no demand for rides.

459
00:22:56,760 --> 00:23:00,480
People are borrowing for
businesses with no customer base.

460
00:23:00,480 --> 00:23:02,880
How is this beneficial?

461
00:23:02,880 --> 00:23:04,224
So how many more fishermen

462
00:23:04,224 --> 00:23:08,935
are looking to lease boat
engines with this model?

463
00:23:08,935 --> 00:23:12,602
(speaking foreign language)

464
00:23:19,857 --> 00:23:23,190
(speaking foreign language)

465
00:23:23,190 --> 00:23:26,310
- This new technology is rewriting
the rules of microfinance

466
00:23:26,310 --> 00:23:30,810
and not necessarily with the
highest levels of regulation.

467
00:23:30,810 --> 00:23:34,050
We've made this so incredibly easy,

468
00:23:34,050 --> 00:23:35,760
that is what is absolutely terrifying.

469
00:23:35,760 --> 00:23:37,770
- The really rich people
in Silicon Valley,

470
00:23:37,770 --> 00:23:38,880
what are their incentives?

471
00:23:38,880 --> 00:23:41,610
What do they want? 'Cause
they're not altruistic.

472
00:23:41,610 --> 00:23:44,430
And it's those kind of questions
that you need to be asking.

473
00:23:44,430 --> 00:23:47,370
Is it safe to have a
very powerful company,

474
00:23:47,370 --> 00:23:49,950
or a very powerful
individual controlling access

475
00:23:49,950 --> 00:23:52,113
to funds for an entire community?

476
00:23:53,286 --> 00:23:55,710
- [Luke] When I started
this investigation,

477
00:23:55,710 --> 00:23:58,530
I was a big believer in
how financial technology

478
00:23:58,530 --> 00:24:01,980
could supercharge
microloans for the unbanked.

479
00:24:01,980 --> 00:24:04,800
And while I believe the founders
and CEOs of these companies

480
00:24:04,800 --> 00:24:06,900
have their hearts in the right place,

481
00:24:06,900 --> 00:24:08,634
my perspective started to shift

482
00:24:08,634 --> 00:24:13,080
when I did a follow-up visit
with Anne two years later.

483
00:24:13,080 --> 00:24:15,637
- Life has not been
easy from the last time

484
00:24:15,637 --> 00:24:16,627
we saw each other,

485
00:24:16,627 --> 00:24:20,700
because I take the digital
loans to be able to buy products

486
00:24:20,700 --> 00:24:22,710
and also, I sell the products

487
00:24:22,710 --> 00:24:24,944
to be able to repay for the loans.

488
00:24:24,944 --> 00:24:26,131
I'm fascinated because here,

489
00:24:26,131 --> 00:24:28,080
you say you can get loans in seconds,

490
00:24:28,080 --> 00:24:30,630
where in North America, you can't do that.

491
00:24:30,630 --> 00:24:32,973
You look at a country like ours, Kenya,

492
00:24:33,870 --> 00:24:38,550
currently even getting
opportunities to work.

493
00:24:38,550 --> 00:24:41,823
I'm a graduate, by the
way. I have a degree.

494
00:24:43,020 --> 00:24:45,210
But getting a job is hard.

495
00:24:45,210 --> 00:24:47,400
I have looked for jobs everywhere.

496
00:24:47,400 --> 00:24:50,310
I have applied over
thousands and thousands

497
00:24:50,310 --> 00:24:51,480
of job opportunities.

498
00:24:51,480 --> 00:24:56,010
But getting opportunity
to get a job is not easy.

499
00:24:56,010 --> 00:24:57,960
There is this romanticized idea

500
00:24:57,960 --> 00:25:00,270
that this abundance of credits

501
00:25:00,270 --> 00:25:02,370
will lead to some sort
of economic development.

502
00:25:02,370 --> 00:25:04,770
But not everyone is
really an entrepreneur.

503
00:25:04,770 --> 00:25:06,120
And when you actually sit down

504
00:25:06,120 --> 00:25:07,680
with some of these entrepreneurs,

505
00:25:07,680 --> 00:25:09,630
what they all generally say is,

506
00:25:09,630 --> 00:25:13,140
what I would really like is
a job, but there aren't any.

507
00:25:13,140 --> 00:25:14,670
So that's why I've come up with this idea

508
00:25:14,670 --> 00:25:17,400
to become a sandwich maker.

509
00:25:17,400 --> 00:25:19,290
It's not that they had this vocation

510
00:25:19,290 --> 00:25:21,030
to become a sandwich maker.

511
00:25:21,030 --> 00:25:22,890
They were kind of forced into it

512
00:25:22,890 --> 00:25:24,810
for lack of any alternative.

513
00:25:24,810 --> 00:25:27,180
Most people who take up these loans

514
00:25:27,180 --> 00:25:29,640
are low income earners
and the middle class.

515
00:25:29,640 --> 00:25:31,650
For the low income earners,
I sympathize with them,

516
00:25:31,650 --> 00:25:33,540
because the first time
when you take up a loan,

517
00:25:33,540 --> 00:25:37,170
probably you have an urgency
to sort out something.

518
00:25:37,170 --> 00:25:40,140
But then again, it's like
cocaine, you get addicted.

519
00:25:40,140 --> 00:25:42,750
You keep on borrowing in as
much as you had the thought

520
00:25:42,750 --> 00:25:45,780
of paying and not taking up a loan.

521
00:25:45,780 --> 00:25:47,550
That ease of access to credit

522
00:25:47,550 --> 00:25:49,800
just makes you to want to take them up

523
00:25:49,800 --> 00:25:51,690
more and more and more and more and more,

524
00:25:51,690 --> 00:25:53,400
over and over and over again.

525
00:25:53,400 --> 00:25:57,060
Interest rates for one
particular lending app,

526
00:25:57,060 --> 00:26:01,620
if you accumulate it for one
year, it comes to almost 200%.

527
00:26:01,620 --> 00:26:04,530
- We talked some time back and
you promised to pay 10,000.

528
00:26:04,530 --> 00:26:06,390
It's needed by the end of this week.

529
00:26:06,390 --> 00:26:09,130
No, we can't wait until the end of March.

530
00:26:09,130 --> 00:26:12,270
Compare credit to morphine.

531
00:26:12,270 --> 00:26:13,110
We know that morphine

532
00:26:13,110 --> 00:26:16,530
can be an extremely dangerous, fatal drug.

533
00:26:16,530 --> 00:26:20,096
And it has to be used in
extremely isolated cases,

534
00:26:20,096 --> 00:26:24,390
administered by qualified people
for very specific purposes

535
00:26:24,390 --> 00:26:26,490
in small doses for certain people,

536
00:26:26,490 --> 00:26:28,620
for short periods of time.

537
00:26:28,620 --> 00:26:32,190
Now, the fact that morphine can
just as equally kill someone

538
00:26:32,190 --> 00:26:33,150
does not necessarily mean

539
00:26:33,150 --> 00:26:34,980
that we should ban morphine altogether,

540
00:26:34,980 --> 00:26:37,140
but nor does it mean that
we should be handing it out

541
00:26:37,140 --> 00:26:38,490
on street corners,

542
00:26:38,490 --> 00:26:41,430
or at the touch of a
button on a telephone.

543
00:26:41,430 --> 00:26:44,670
Now why do we consider
credit to be any different?

544
00:26:44,670 --> 00:26:47,790
Credit can have catastrophic
effects on individuals

545
00:26:47,790 --> 00:26:51,876
and families and can bring
entire economies to their knees.

546
00:26:51,876 --> 00:26:53,820
And yet we keep on handing it out,

547
00:26:53,820 --> 00:26:57,420
as though it was a lollipop
on a street corner.

548
00:26:57,420 --> 00:26:59,460
Anyone can get hold of these loans

549
00:26:59,460 --> 00:27:02,190
without necessarily
understanding the implications

550
00:27:02,190 --> 00:27:03,060
of getting indebted,

551
00:27:03,060 --> 00:27:06,030
how that's going to come back
and haunt them in the future.

552
00:27:06,030 --> 00:27:08,280
So we just spent two days with Anne,

553
00:27:08,280 --> 00:27:12,720
and she's been telling me
about these fast digital loans.

554
00:27:12,720 --> 00:27:15,300
And while we're driving
home, the cameras are off,

555
00:27:15,300 --> 00:27:17,520
and she gets a phone call.

556
00:27:17,520 --> 00:27:21,022
And I had to capture what
happened next on my phone.

557
00:27:21,022 --> 00:27:25,275
(speaking foreign language)

558
00:27:25,275 --> 00:27:27,780
Oh my god, this is so funny,

559
00:27:27,780 --> 00:27:30,240
because we are filming the same thing.

560
00:27:30,240 --> 00:27:32,520
And then today, they've
just decided to call me

561
00:27:32,520 --> 00:27:33,985
to ask me why I've not been able

562
00:27:33,985 --> 00:27:35,210
to pay back the mobile loan,

563
00:27:35,210 --> 00:27:38,310
the mobile loan that I owe them.

564
00:27:38,310 --> 00:27:41,700
So she's asking me why have
I not been able to pay.

565
00:27:41,700 --> 00:27:42,720
The last time we talked,

566
00:27:42,720 --> 00:27:44,820
I was supposed to pay by a certain time.

567
00:27:44,820 --> 00:27:46,473
Why have I not been able to pay?

568
00:27:46,473 --> 00:27:47,850
And then I told her,

569
00:27:47,850 --> 00:27:51,060
it's because the business I
was doing that time collapsed.

570
00:27:51,060 --> 00:27:54,480
So that's why I've not
been able to pay back.

571
00:27:54,480 --> 00:27:56,910
- Central bank governor
said he was concerned about

572
00:27:56,910 --> 00:28:00,420
the digital lenders who are
like loan sharks on steroids.

573
00:28:00,420 --> 00:28:03,000
Some of them have very bad practices

574
00:28:03,000 --> 00:28:05,760
of getting into the borrower's contacts.

575
00:28:05,760 --> 00:28:08,670
They're going to shame you
in front of your family.

576
00:28:08,670 --> 00:28:12,090
And culturally, the people in Africa,

577
00:28:12,090 --> 00:28:13,470
they really despise that.

578
00:28:13,470 --> 00:28:16,230
They tell you you would
better take away a car,

579
00:28:16,230 --> 00:28:18,420
or you better take away a house,

580
00:28:18,420 --> 00:28:22,860
but don't injure my ego by
telling me I cannot pay a loan.

581
00:28:22,860 --> 00:28:25,980
Some people have actually become suicidal

582
00:28:25,980 --> 00:28:28,860
just because they have
failed to pay a loan,

583
00:28:28,860 --> 00:28:33,147
sometimes of even as little as 100, $200.

584
00:28:36,270 --> 00:28:40,410
- When I started using
the apps to take loans,

585
00:28:40,410 --> 00:28:43,830
I took from many apps, many and many.

586
00:28:43,830 --> 00:28:47,130
So I ended up, at some
point, I was not able to pay.

587
00:28:47,130 --> 00:28:51,540
And then they started calling
from one number to another.

588
00:28:51,540 --> 00:28:53,580
I don't know if they hacked my phone,

589
00:28:53,580 --> 00:28:55,440
or where they got my contact.

590
00:28:55,440 --> 00:29:00,360
So I was tied in a corner

591
00:29:00,360 --> 00:29:02,880
because I was not picking the calls,

592
00:29:02,880 --> 00:29:04,800
and they keep on calling, calling,

593
00:29:04,800 --> 00:29:06,967
until they call my
pastor, and he was like,

594
00:29:06,967 --> 00:29:08,520
"Oh, sister Felisters."

595
00:29:08,520 --> 00:29:09,667
He called me and he told me,

596
00:29:09,667 --> 00:29:12,420
"My sister, did you take
loan from this app?"

597
00:29:12,420 --> 00:29:13,800
I told him, "Yes, I took."

598
00:29:13,800 --> 00:29:15,600
They called me, "Go and pay that loan."

599
00:29:15,600 --> 00:29:16,770
I told him, "I don't have money."

600
00:29:16,770 --> 00:29:19,577
He say, "Okay, how much?"
I told him, "3,150."

601
00:29:19,577 --> 00:29:22,320
He told me, "Okay, take
this money, go and pay.

602
00:29:22,320 --> 00:29:23,580
And don't take loans again."

603
00:29:23,580 --> 00:29:25,770
I still went back and took loan again.

604
00:29:25,770 --> 00:29:26,700
[Luke] Why?

605
00:29:26,700 --> 00:29:28,113
Because I need the money!

606
00:29:30,150 --> 00:29:33,030
We need the money, we need money to move.

607
00:29:33,030 --> 00:29:35,490
I told him, of course, I cannot lie.

608
00:29:35,490 --> 00:29:37,260
I told him I took another one,

609
00:29:37,260 --> 00:29:40,110
and another one, and another one.

610
00:29:40,110 --> 00:29:41,070
The more you borrow,

611
00:29:41,070 --> 00:29:43,710
the more your credit amount goes higher.

612
00:29:43,710 --> 00:29:46,350
So I'm just going to move
round and round and round.

613
00:29:46,350 --> 00:29:49,800
But the repercussion is, if
I find myself whereby, look,

614
00:29:49,800 --> 00:29:51,930
my salary is 30,000 Kenyan shillings,

615
00:29:51,930 --> 00:29:53,160
and then I'm at a place whereby

616
00:29:53,160 --> 00:29:55,290
I've borrowed 50,000 Kenyan shillings,

617
00:29:55,290 --> 00:29:57,240
or 70,000 Kenyan shillings.

618
00:29:57,240 --> 00:30:00,810
I'm looking at somebody's
going to come after me,

619
00:30:00,810 --> 00:30:02,460
because of 50,000 Kenyan shillings.

620
00:30:02,460 --> 00:30:04,660
I can't manage. The
next thing that I'll do?

621
00:30:06,150 --> 00:30:09,300
I'll drop the SIM card,
go buy another SIM card,

622
00:30:09,300 --> 00:30:10,983
it's just 50 Kenyan shillings,

623
00:30:11,970 --> 00:30:14,760
and then download my contacts from Google.

624
00:30:14,760 --> 00:30:18,300
Hey, this is my new line,
reach me on this line.

625
00:30:18,300 --> 00:30:21,480
So with the hope that probably
they'll never come after me.

626
00:30:21,480 --> 00:30:23,640
Some people throw away their SIM cards.

627
00:30:23,640 --> 00:30:26,253
But me, I chose not to throw it away.

628
00:30:27,120 --> 00:30:29,165
Because it means to me

629
00:30:29,165 --> 00:30:32,283
I'm running away from my responsibility.

630
00:30:33,570 --> 00:30:37,600
The only medicine to clear this
sickness is paying the debt

631
00:30:38,490 --> 00:30:41,040
because now I'm a slave to debts.

632
00:30:41,040 --> 00:30:42,783
I'm a slave to the apps.

633
00:30:44,481 --> 00:30:45,633
What's your plan?

634
00:30:47,130 --> 00:30:51,123
- Just to work more hard
and pay off the debt.

635
00:30:52,017 --> 00:30:54,750
The moment you give someone a loan,

636
00:30:54,750 --> 00:30:59,460
and they owe you money,
you essentially own them.

637
00:30:59,460 --> 00:31:01,680
We've got hundreds of millions of people,

638
00:31:01,680 --> 00:31:04,610
furiously working in
their microenterprises.

639
00:31:04,610 --> 00:31:06,330
In the name of financial inclusion,

640
00:31:06,330 --> 00:31:10,320
we can tap all that surplus
labor that generates wealth.

641
00:31:10,320 --> 00:31:13,830
And that wealth is repaid
to us via interest.

642
00:31:13,830 --> 00:31:15,600
It's essentially nothing more

643
00:31:15,600 --> 00:31:18,120
than the traditional 17th
century slavery model,

644
00:31:18,120 --> 00:31:22,590
but without the need to actually
move the slaves from Africa

645
00:31:22,590 --> 00:31:24,120
and Latin America, wherever,

646
00:31:24,120 --> 00:31:26,670
to the so-called developed countries.

647
00:31:26,670 --> 00:31:29,580
We've just essentially cut out that stage.

648
00:31:29,580 --> 00:31:32,430
It's frustrating, to be honest.

649
00:31:32,430 --> 00:31:37,080
Because it's like they
make money off of me,

650
00:31:37,080 --> 00:31:41,310
while in real sense, I don't
benefit as much as I should be.

651
00:31:41,310 --> 00:31:43,350
They increase the interest rates,

652
00:31:43,350 --> 00:31:45,120
because they know that
by the end of the day,

653
00:31:45,120 --> 00:31:46,560
we will still need the money.

654
00:31:46,560 --> 00:31:51,330
So they continue being rich,
while we continue struggling.

655
00:31:51,330 --> 00:31:56,330
- Think about digital
finance, fintech revolution,

656
00:31:56,820 --> 00:32:01,320
all of that stuff is actually borrowing on

657
00:32:01,320 --> 00:32:06,320
this history of ROSCAs,
co-operatives, SACCOs,

658
00:32:07,260 --> 00:32:09,930
except the very foundation of ROSCAs

659
00:32:09,930 --> 00:32:12,510
is this concept of social provisioning.

660
00:32:12,510 --> 00:32:16,860
And so ROSCA members see that
not only are they helping

661
00:32:16,860 --> 00:32:19,530
their own livelihoods advance,

662
00:32:19,530 --> 00:32:23,190
but the money that they pull
in is actually shared out.

663
00:32:23,190 --> 00:32:25,080
And there's this notion that profits

664
00:32:25,080 --> 00:32:30,080
would go to some anonymous
figure, some capitalist tycoon,

665
00:32:30,330 --> 00:32:32,464
is really a foreign concept to them.

666
00:32:32,464 --> 00:32:35,131
(ambient music)

667
00:32:42,750 --> 00:32:44,190
[Luke] To summarize,

668
00:32:44,190 --> 00:32:46,620
mobile money revolutionized
the very concept

669
00:32:46,620 --> 00:32:48,570
of banking in Africa,

670
00:32:48,570 --> 00:32:51,453
and expanded access to
credit for millions.

671
00:32:52,500 --> 00:32:54,534
But influenced by profit-driven motives

672
00:32:54,534 --> 00:32:56,850
and tech-driven data,

673
00:32:56,850 --> 00:33:00,750
it further exposed the
dark side of microfinance.

674
00:33:00,750 --> 00:33:02,790
In a world that hopes to move towards

675
00:33:02,790 --> 00:33:04,473
an era of open banking,

676
00:33:05,970 --> 00:33:09,750
is there a way to reclaim the
technology behind mobile money

677
00:33:09,750 --> 00:33:11,193
to empower people again?

678
00:33:12,120 --> 00:33:14,220
He can be able to send and receive money

679
00:33:14,220 --> 00:33:16,740
through mobile money using USSD.

680
00:33:16,740 --> 00:33:18,150
They already know that.

681
00:33:18,150 --> 00:33:20,250
But now if you go a step further,

682
00:33:20,250 --> 00:33:23,610
and show them that there is
this thing called Bitcoin,

683
00:33:23,610 --> 00:33:25,680
it's better than the fiat standard.

684
00:33:25,680 --> 00:33:30,003
And then you show them you
can be able to send Bitcoin,

685
00:33:30,930 --> 00:33:33,180
receive it, or even make a purchase

686
00:33:33,180 --> 00:33:36,519
just as easy as you're using fiat,

687
00:33:36,519 --> 00:33:38,440
it totally makes sense to them.

688
00:33:38,440 --> 00:33:42,000
And they love the ease of use.

689
00:33:42,000 --> 00:33:43,984
So I'm talking with Master Guantai,

690
00:33:43,984 --> 00:33:48,180
and he tells me about his
friend in South Africa

691
00:33:48,180 --> 00:33:51,750
who has invented a way to move Bitcoin

692
00:33:51,750 --> 00:33:54,573
on the same technology as mobile money.

693
00:33:55,680 --> 00:33:56,830
I had to find this guy.

694
00:33:58,290 --> 00:34:01,410
Internet penetration is not that high

695
00:34:01,410 --> 00:34:03,300
across the African continent, right?

696
00:34:03,300 --> 00:34:06,510
So we needed a way for
Bitcoin transactions

697
00:34:06,510 --> 00:34:09,450
to be done without the hard requirement

698
00:34:09,450 --> 00:34:11,460
of having an Internet-connected device.

699
00:34:11,460 --> 00:34:14,040
Think about it like SMS, right?

700
00:34:14,040 --> 00:34:16,200
Instead of sending an SMS to somebody,

701
00:34:16,200 --> 00:34:18,480
you dial into a number.

702
00:34:18,480 --> 00:34:21,510
It's almost like you
are visiting a website,

703
00:34:21,510 --> 00:34:23,580
where the only interface is text,

704
00:34:23,580 --> 00:34:26,040
but you have to go back
to the future, right?

705
00:34:26,040 --> 00:34:30,390
So as much as it's outdated,
a lot of people still use it.

706
00:34:30,390 --> 00:34:34,050
Ultimately, as long as a Bitcoin
transaction went through,

707
00:34:34,050 --> 00:34:37,290
you shouldn't care too
much whether it was USSD,

708
00:34:37,290 --> 00:34:39,270
or whether it was via an app.

709
00:34:39,270 --> 00:34:41,190
It is no other option.

710
00:34:41,190 --> 00:34:42,330
Because it's either that,

711
00:34:42,330 --> 00:34:44,786
or you continue being in the system

712
00:34:44,786 --> 00:34:47,205
that is already not working in your favor,

713
00:34:47,205 --> 00:34:49,980
like at all, like right now.

714
00:34:49,980 --> 00:34:52,920
You just want Kenyan citizens' data,

715
00:34:52,920 --> 00:34:55,020
and you're not interested
in the core business

716
00:34:55,020 --> 00:34:57,210
of mobile money lending.

717
00:34:57,210 --> 00:34:59,787
And when you get this data,
who do you give it to?

718
00:34:59,787 --> 00:35:01,770
And what are the implications

719
00:35:01,770 --> 00:35:04,953
of you stealing this data
on me as a Kenyan citizen?

720
00:35:05,850 --> 00:35:08,250
Having the ability to use a money

721
00:35:08,250 --> 00:35:11,730
that your government doesn't
control is quite important.

722
00:35:11,730 --> 00:35:14,790
Bitcoin would be the only form of money

723
00:35:14,790 --> 00:35:19,790
that Africans get to adopt
by their own volition.

724
00:35:20,130 --> 00:35:24,720
- I really didn't want
to go down the Bitcoin,

725
00:35:24,720 --> 00:35:26,670
cryptocurrency rabbit hole in this one.

726
00:35:28,680 --> 00:35:32,550
But I would be doing this
project and investigation

727
00:35:32,550 --> 00:35:36,273
a massive disservice if I
didn't follow the story.

728
00:35:37,380 --> 00:35:39,030
So that's what we did.

729
00:35:39,030 --> 00:35:42,000
Kgothatso is using the
technology behind mobile money

730
00:35:42,000 --> 00:35:43,803
to give power back to the people.

731
00:35:45,510 --> 00:35:49,650
In the cryptocurrency
landscape, Bitcoin is beaming,

732
00:35:49,650 --> 00:35:52,560
as it moves through Africa via USSD.

733
00:35:52,560 --> 00:35:54,690
The mobile money technology,

734
00:35:54,690 --> 00:35:57,900
driven by passionate
innovators and believers

735
00:35:57,900 --> 00:35:58,983
in what could be.

736
00:36:00,690 --> 00:36:03,257
What skepticism remains about Bitcoin

737
00:36:03,257 --> 00:36:05,670
are largely due to how it's created

738
00:36:05,670 --> 00:36:08,938
and its limitations on
widespread adoption.

739
00:36:08,938 --> 00:36:11,521
(gentle music)

740
00:36:12,390 --> 00:36:15,900
This is when I had to call
a friend and lifeline, Erik,

741
00:36:15,900 --> 00:36:17,970
who was also raised in Africa.

742
00:36:17,970 --> 00:36:19,680
He's highly respected when it comes

743
00:36:19,680 --> 00:36:23,973
to bringing Africa online, even
before stars and satellites.

744
00:36:24,840 --> 00:36:27,960
Now I find him in the lush
jungles of Kenya and Malawi,

745
00:36:27,960 --> 00:36:30,483
where he builds sustainable Bitcoin mines.

746
00:36:33,932 --> 00:36:35,002
- Should I just start
like you just walked in,

747
00:36:35,002 --> 00:36:35,835
and I was talking about the other stuff?

748
00:36:35,835 --> 00:36:38,010
- [Luke] Yeah, like I
bugged you like this, yeah.

749
00:36:38,010 --> 00:36:40,860
Yeah, so let me start back here then.

750
00:36:40,860 --> 00:36:41,693
Okay, cool.

751
00:36:41,693 --> 00:36:43,941
So do you have audio going?

752
00:36:43,941 --> 00:36:44,820
- Yeah.
- We're good?

753
00:36:44,820 --> 00:36:48,293
Yeah, okay. So right back
here is what we have.

754
00:36:48,293 --> 00:36:50,550
So this is where we repair old miners.

755
00:36:50,550 --> 00:36:53,850
So these are like Bitmain S17s,

756
00:36:53,850 --> 00:36:55,980
which are like really,
really crappy machines,

757
00:36:55,980 --> 00:36:57,750
but they're very cheap back in the day.

758
00:36:57,750 --> 00:36:59,730
So we used those to test
out a bunch of stuff,

759
00:36:59,730 --> 00:37:01,680
and now we're just
trying to keep 'em alive.

760
00:37:01,680 --> 00:37:02,880
I didn't think I'd actually see,

761
00:37:02,880 --> 00:37:04,890
ever get to see like a Bitcoin miner.

762
00:37:04,890 --> 00:37:05,790
Well, let me at least show you

763
00:37:05,790 --> 00:37:06,964
what a better one looks like.

764
00:37:06,964 --> 00:37:08,580
This is like the really crappy version.

765
00:37:08,580 --> 00:37:12,450
These ones stand up to
the environment of Africa

766
00:37:12,450 --> 00:37:15,690
better than the other manufacturers'.

767
00:37:15,690 --> 00:37:18,360
So they can deal with
like higher temperatures.

768
00:37:18,360 --> 00:37:20,010
They can take more bugs crawling into them

769
00:37:20,010 --> 00:37:21,570
and still stay alive.

770
00:37:21,570 --> 00:37:24,480
- [Luke] How many Bitcoins
would one of these produce

771
00:37:24,480 --> 00:37:26,883
over this lifetime, is a fair question?

772
00:37:27,900 --> 00:37:28,733
They differ, right?

773
00:37:28,733 --> 00:37:30,540
Like if you were to transfer that Bitcoin

774
00:37:30,540 --> 00:37:32,160
into dollars immediately,

775
00:37:32,160 --> 00:37:35,753
it'd probably be around 10
or $15 a day that they earn.

776
00:37:35,753 --> 00:37:37,410
Cost of power is your biggest cost,

777
00:37:37,410 --> 00:37:38,728
it's your biggest operational cost.

778
00:37:38,728 --> 00:37:42,270
So you're trying to find
the least expensive power,

779
00:37:42,270 --> 00:37:44,760
and you're trying to keep
the most efficient machines

780
00:37:44,760 --> 00:37:47,100
in there and keep them
alive as long as possible.

781
00:37:47,100 --> 00:37:47,970
How we think of it is this.

782
00:37:47,970 --> 00:37:50,670
So like, we wanna go to
places have renewable energy,

783
00:37:50,670 --> 00:37:53,880
the local community probably
uses 40 to 60% of it.

784
00:37:53,880 --> 00:37:55,950
And so we come in as a
buyer of last resort,

785
00:37:55,950 --> 00:37:58,110
wholesale buy the rest of their power.

786
00:37:58,110 --> 00:38:00,180
And then in some locations,
what that does too

787
00:38:00,180 --> 00:38:01,980
is it also lowers the price of power

788
00:38:01,980 --> 00:38:03,570
for everybody in the community.

789
00:38:03,570 --> 00:38:05,350
Really the whole idea of Gridless

790
00:38:05,350 --> 00:38:08,970
was instead of them
dumping that electricity,

791
00:38:08,970 --> 00:38:11,310
let's convert that electricity into money.

792
00:38:11,310 --> 00:38:13,860
There's too much electricity being made,

793
00:38:13,860 --> 00:38:15,900
versus how much is being demanded.

794
00:38:15,900 --> 00:38:17,340
You have to dump the excess in here.

795
00:38:17,340 --> 00:38:19,140
- And that's actually called,
- And then they heat it...

796
00:38:19,140 --> 00:38:20,730
- It's called the dump load.
- Okay.

797
00:38:20,730 --> 00:38:24,690
- So the excess electricity
goes into heating that water

798
00:38:24,690 --> 00:38:27,660
as a way of just doing something with it.

799
00:38:27,660 --> 00:38:29,130
So what happens is the electricity

800
00:38:29,130 --> 00:38:32,040
that would go to that dump
load now comes in here.

801
00:38:32,040 --> 00:38:34,290
We've had to create a
more sophisticated system

802
00:38:34,290 --> 00:38:35,932
for controlling our Bitcoin miners.

803
00:38:35,932 --> 00:38:39,810
So in most mining situations,
they just buy electricity,

804
00:38:39,810 --> 00:38:42,206
they turn them on, and
they run them all the time.

805
00:38:42,206 --> 00:38:45,090
But because we are trying
to only use electricity

806
00:38:45,090 --> 00:38:46,530
that nobody else wants,

807
00:38:46,530 --> 00:38:49,380
we have to monitor the grid constantly.

808
00:38:49,380 --> 00:38:53,233
- Bitcoin mining solves
a very specific problem

809
00:38:53,233 --> 00:38:55,290
for energy generators.

810
00:38:55,290 --> 00:38:56,857
Somebody like us, who
are coming and saying,

811
00:38:56,857 --> 00:38:59,520
"Hey, we'll sign up and
we'll use that excess power,

812
00:38:59,520 --> 00:39:00,840
that stranded energy."

813
00:39:00,840 --> 00:39:03,060
That means that the community
gets the energy they need.

814
00:39:03,060 --> 00:39:05,370
The energy provider has a customer,

815
00:39:05,370 --> 00:39:08,880
so they're able to work sustainably
for the first time ever.

816
00:39:08,880 --> 00:39:10,650
And then we're able to make Bitcoin.

817
00:39:10,650 --> 00:39:11,483
[Luke] Oh, thanks for this.

818
00:39:11,483 --> 00:39:13,470
Wait, no, I've gotta do my symphony.

819
00:39:13,470 --> 00:39:15,480
Like, you've got to hear.

820
00:39:15,480 --> 00:39:18,795
All right, so, and I've talked
to other Bitcoin miners.

821
00:39:18,795 --> 00:39:19,710
Well, you control the symphony.

822
00:39:19,710 --> 00:39:21,300
Well, I'm gonna turn it on,

823
00:39:21,300 --> 00:39:22,650
so that you get this experience.

824
00:39:22,650 --> 00:39:24,690
But like I've talked
to other Bitcoin miners

825
00:39:24,690 --> 00:39:28,380
and like, we have a love for this sound.

826
00:39:28,380 --> 00:39:30,361
- You ready?
- [Luke] Yes, please.

827
00:39:30,361 --> 00:39:33,028
(miner humming)

828
00:39:34,350 --> 00:39:35,250
And so during the day,

829
00:39:35,250 --> 00:39:37,123
they're constantly going up and down.

830
00:39:37,123 --> 00:39:39,790
(miner humming)

831
00:39:43,098 --> 00:39:44,153
- I love it.
- It's wild.

832
00:39:45,120 --> 00:39:49,290
- Money's a means of exchange.
It's a store of value.

833
00:39:49,290 --> 00:39:50,820
It's a record of accounts.

834
00:39:50,820 --> 00:39:52,680
Those are the things that money is, right?

835
00:39:52,680 --> 00:39:54,960
So you could use anything
for money, and we used to.

836
00:39:54,960 --> 00:39:58,860
We used to have cowrie
shells or gold or cash,

837
00:39:58,860 --> 00:40:01,500
or now we use credit cards
and debit cards, right?

838
00:40:01,500 --> 00:40:03,000
We can use anything.

839
00:40:03,000 --> 00:40:04,323
And so I think in this case,

840
00:40:04,323 --> 00:40:07,680
there's no reason why a community
who's coming from nothing,

841
00:40:07,680 --> 00:40:10,260
whether they're in the
US or they're in Africa,

842
00:40:10,260 --> 00:40:12,960
couldn't be using Bitcoin
as their medium of exchange,

843
00:40:12,960 --> 00:40:15,900
as their store of value,
and their record of account.

844
00:40:15,900 --> 00:40:19,020
- The dollar replaced the
British pound as the currency

845
00:40:19,020 --> 00:40:21,720
for international trade,
and it was backed by gold.

846
00:40:21,720 --> 00:40:25,080
And so gold was the anchor
for international trade.

847
00:40:25,080 --> 00:40:28,898
And that was suspended in
1971 by President Nixon.

848
00:40:28,898 --> 00:40:32,855
But it had become increasingly
difficult to hold that peg,

849
00:40:32,855 --> 00:40:37,500
because basically the
world wanted more dollars

850
00:40:37,500 --> 00:40:41,197
than the US having to hold the peg to gold

851
00:40:41,197 --> 00:40:42,960
could realistically provide.

852
00:40:42,960 --> 00:40:45,690
Its trade deficit was getting
bigger and bigger and bigger.

853
00:40:45,690 --> 00:40:47,280
It needed to devalue, and in the end,

854
00:40:47,280 --> 00:40:49,860
the simplest thing was to
abandon the gold standard.

855
00:40:49,860 --> 00:40:52,080
There are a lot of people who
would like to bring that back

856
00:40:52,080 --> 00:40:54,870
because they see gold
as providing an anchor

857
00:40:54,870 --> 00:40:56,610
for the international system

858
00:40:56,610 --> 00:40:58,650
that the dollar can't easily be.

859
00:40:58,650 --> 00:41:01,380
They fear inflation arising from

860
00:41:01,380 --> 00:41:04,200
out of control money
creation by central banks,

861
00:41:04,200 --> 00:41:06,000
and particularly by the Fed.

862
00:41:06,000 --> 00:41:08,550
And they want to re-anchor
the international system

863
00:41:08,550 --> 00:41:12,630
to gold, really to stop
governments doing that.

864
00:41:12,630 --> 00:41:16,050
- Weird space where
there's very rural Africa,

865
00:41:16,050 --> 00:41:20,310
yet the very front edge of
that technology for money.

866
00:41:20,310 --> 00:41:22,680
The way that fiat currencies
are currently managed

867
00:41:22,680 --> 00:41:26,430
by their central banks, or by
larger institutions globally,

868
00:41:26,430 --> 00:41:29,698
means that inflation is bound to happen.

869
00:41:29,698 --> 00:41:33,330
You have a decreasing value
of your currency every year,

870
00:41:33,330 --> 00:41:34,650
everywhere.

871
00:41:34,650 --> 00:41:37,530
And what we do with Bitcoin mining

872
00:41:37,530 --> 00:41:39,870
is create a new money that's harder.

873
00:41:39,870 --> 00:41:42,090
It's a harder money than the dollar,

874
00:41:42,090 --> 00:41:44,040
than the pound, or the Euro.

875
00:41:44,040 --> 00:41:48,060
And it's a type of money
that doesn't devalue

876
00:41:48,060 --> 00:41:50,040
based on somebody else's whims.

877
00:41:50,040 --> 00:41:52,020
It's not controlled by any central body.

878
00:41:52,020 --> 00:41:53,610
It's immutable in code.

879
00:41:53,610 --> 00:41:55,410
And because there's only a set amount

880
00:41:55,410 --> 00:41:56,640
that will ever be created,

881
00:41:56,640 --> 00:41:58,860
by its nature is non-inflationary.

882
00:41:58,860 --> 00:42:02,310
And that provides a completely
new way to think and use

883
00:42:02,310 --> 00:42:05,400
and hold money that never
could be done before.

884
00:42:05,400 --> 00:42:10,140
I can move $100 to you,
or billion dollars to you,

885
00:42:10,140 --> 00:42:13,385
for the same price instantly.

886
00:42:13,385 --> 00:42:16,320
What's exciting about that
in Africa I think is this.

887
00:42:16,320 --> 00:42:19,110
Is that we already have third rate money

888
00:42:19,110 --> 00:42:21,060
as our ordinary everyday currencies.

889
00:42:21,060 --> 00:42:21,930
Right.

890
00:42:21,930 --> 00:42:26,640
- By digitizing them, we
just have a faster way,

891
00:42:26,640 --> 00:42:30,308
and easier way to use our
really poor currencies.

892
00:42:30,308 --> 00:42:33,930
Maybe we should be thinking about not just

893
00:42:33,930 --> 00:42:36,586
how do we use bad money better,

894
00:42:36,586 --> 00:42:38,880
but how do we actually have a better money

895
00:42:38,880 --> 00:42:41,280
that can be used better by everyone?

896
00:42:41,280 --> 00:42:44,130
- The US dollar is a
competitor to Bitcoin,

897
00:42:44,130 --> 00:42:45,120
and in many countries,

898
00:42:45,120 --> 00:42:47,070
US dollar is a whole load
more stable than Bitcoin

899
00:42:47,070 --> 00:42:50,190
and a whole load more
desirable than Bitcoin.

900
00:42:50,190 --> 00:42:53,070
And maybe that could change.
Maybe it could stabilize.

901
00:42:53,070 --> 00:42:55,740
Stable enough to use on a day-to-day basis

902
00:42:55,740 --> 00:42:58,260
as the main medium of exchange.

903
00:42:58,260 --> 00:43:01,212
But like you said, people
have got to want to use it,

904
00:43:01,212 --> 00:43:02,483
and maybe there are communities

905
00:43:02,483 --> 00:43:05,370
where they do want to use
it, or maybe there aren't,

906
00:43:05,370 --> 00:43:06,360
I don't know.

907
00:43:06,360 --> 00:43:07,713
It's not impossible.

908
00:43:09,000 --> 00:43:11,340
- [Luke] Creating Bitcoin
to use as a store of value

909
00:43:11,340 --> 00:43:13,410
or an asset is one thing.

910
00:43:13,410 --> 00:43:16,470
But using it as a currency
is a different story.

911
00:43:16,470 --> 00:43:18,690
I'd heard whispers of surfer communities

912
00:43:18,690 --> 00:43:20,340
experimenting with Bitcoin,

913
00:43:20,340 --> 00:43:22,500
and how they're influencing
more communities

914
00:43:22,500 --> 00:43:24,990
to embrace it as a means of exchange.

915
00:43:24,990 --> 00:43:27,480
I traveled from Cape Town to Mossel Bay,

916
00:43:27,480 --> 00:43:29,850
to witness a community integrating Bitcoin

917
00:43:29,850 --> 00:43:31,320
into their daily lives.

918
00:43:31,320 --> 00:43:34,110
- What this project has
revealed to me about myself

919
00:43:34,110 --> 00:43:36,000
is I don't know when to stop.

920
00:43:36,000 --> 00:43:37,890
I should have stopped many times, I think.

921
00:43:37,890 --> 00:43:41,310
It's all very exciting now,
but the preceding sort of nine,

922
00:43:41,310 --> 00:43:44,970
10 years, was a very long,
hard lonely struggle,

923
00:43:44,970 --> 00:43:47,160
trying to keep a little insignificant

924
00:43:47,160 --> 00:43:49,230
non-profit organization going.

925
00:43:49,230 --> 00:43:52,170
- Well, the non-profit
basically ran out of funds,

926
00:43:52,170 --> 00:43:54,570
and it was either let everybody go,

927
00:43:54,570 --> 00:43:58,833
and just give up 10 years of work,

928
00:44:00,270 --> 00:44:02,820
or think completely out of the box.

929
00:44:02,820 --> 00:44:05,490
We received a donation in Bitcoin,

930
00:44:05,490 --> 00:44:10,490
but the trick was that do
not change it back to fiat.

931
00:44:10,800 --> 00:44:15,150
Do not go back to the
broken system, use it.

932
00:44:15,150 --> 00:44:16,050
It felt pretty hopeless.

933
00:44:16,050 --> 00:44:18,450
In fact, I did actually give up in 2020.

934
00:44:18,450 --> 00:44:20,730
I was like, "I'm done."

935
00:44:20,730 --> 00:44:25,590
And then six months later,
started the Bitcoin project.

936
00:44:25,590 --> 00:44:27,960
- [Luke] Prior to diving
into the world of Bitcoin,

937
00:44:27,960 --> 00:44:31,560
Hermann and Evgenia had
initiated a nonprofit,

938
00:44:31,560 --> 00:44:34,620
using surfing as a tool
for educating kids.

939
00:44:34,620 --> 00:44:38,733
However, like many charitable
endeavors, funds were scarce.

940
00:44:39,750 --> 00:44:41,970
With this infusion of digital currency,

941
00:44:41,970 --> 00:44:45,120
Hermann and Evgenia pivoted
to educating young surfers

942
00:44:45,120 --> 00:44:47,430
about the fundamentals of Bitcoin.

943
00:44:47,430 --> 00:44:49,650
They're on a mission to
educate local businesses

944
00:44:49,650 --> 00:44:53,190
on how to embrace Bitcoin
as their primary currency.

945
00:44:53,190 --> 00:44:55,680
The key focus, how to use the service

946
00:44:55,680 --> 00:44:59,310
that harnesses the USSD
mobile money technology,

947
00:44:59,310 --> 00:45:02,430
the brainchild of my new friend, KG.

948
00:45:02,430 --> 00:45:03,810
The shop that we are going to now,

949
00:45:03,810 --> 00:45:05,370
we struggled for a long
time to get him on board.

950
00:45:05,370 --> 00:45:07,533
I don't know how long. He was pretty keen.

951
00:45:08,550 --> 00:45:10,380
And then he went to talk
to his business partners

952
00:45:10,380 --> 00:45:12,150
and they were like, "No, no,
no, this thing is a scam."

953
00:45:12,150 --> 00:45:14,310
And then six months later, he got robbed,

954
00:45:14,310 --> 00:45:15,570
stole a bunch of cash from his shop

955
00:45:15,570 --> 00:45:17,047
and he came back to the
Tondo and he's like,

956
00:45:17,047 --> 00:45:20,190
"Okay, so well tell me about
that Bitcoin thing again."

957
00:45:20,190 --> 00:45:21,870
Because they're all cash-based, right?

958
00:45:21,870 --> 00:45:23,910
The shops here, and
that's the security risk.

959
00:45:23,910 --> 00:45:25,440
Bank account and card payments

960
00:45:25,440 --> 00:45:26,970
can solve a large part of that problem,

961
00:45:26,970 --> 00:45:28,080
'cause if they break into your shop,

962
00:45:28,080 --> 00:45:30,060
they can't steal your money
if you're taking card payments

963
00:45:30,060 --> 00:45:32,018
and you've got a bank account,
but that's expensive, right?

964
00:45:32,018 --> 00:45:32,851
[Luke] Right.

965
00:45:32,851 --> 00:45:35,550
- [Hermann] With Bitcoin,
you can do the same thing,

966
00:45:35,550 --> 00:45:37,290
but for very low cost.

967
00:45:37,290 --> 00:45:38,668
Because if they break into your shop,

968
00:45:38,668 --> 00:45:40,380
they can't steal your Bitcoin.

969
00:45:40,380 --> 00:45:42,053
First of all, how much do we owe you?

970
00:45:42,053 --> 00:45:43,620
- [Shopkeeper] 32.
- 32 rand, okay.

971
00:45:43,620 --> 00:45:46,950
- So I press send,
- [Kgothatso] And then.

972
00:45:46,950 --> 00:45:48,123
[Luke] There's a barcode. This barcode.

973
00:45:48,123 --> 00:45:48,993
Yes, yes.

974
00:45:49,830 --> 00:45:51,750
And then just click here,

975
00:45:51,750 --> 00:45:54,640
and then can show you send option.

976
00:45:54,640 --> 00:45:55,473
Send.

977
00:45:58,275 --> 00:45:59,995
(phone chiming)
Boom.

978
00:45:59,995 --> 00:46:01,140
- [Luke] Wow.
- [Kgothatso] It's in.

979
00:46:01,140 --> 00:46:03,900
- So really this is a
pretty simple process

980
00:46:03,900 --> 00:46:07,710
in comparison to even what a
mobile body wallet would be.

981
00:46:07,710 --> 00:46:10,440
So the surfing thing kind
of provides this environment

982
00:46:10,440 --> 00:46:12,060
within which the older generation

983
00:46:12,060 --> 00:46:14,220
can teach the younger generation
something constructive.

984
00:46:14,220 --> 00:46:15,873
And for doing that they earn a salary,

985
00:46:15,873 --> 00:46:18,420
which is derived from donations.

986
00:46:18,420 --> 00:46:21,420
And those donations now
come in the form of Bitcoin.

987
00:46:21,420 --> 00:46:24,540
- Kids with whom we work
that come from the township,

988
00:46:24,540 --> 00:46:26,580
financial literacy is definitely

989
00:46:26,580 --> 00:46:28,260
not part of the school curriculum.

990
00:46:28,260 --> 00:46:29,460
And now all of a sudden,

991
00:46:29,460 --> 00:46:31,950
you're giving them this
new piece of technology,

992
00:46:31,950 --> 00:46:35,010
so all of a sudden they
kind of have to learn

993
00:46:35,010 --> 00:46:36,870
and educate themselves, what it is.

994
00:46:36,870 --> 00:46:37,983
All these questions that like,

995
00:46:37,983 --> 00:46:40,740
were not on the radar at all.

996
00:46:40,740 --> 00:46:43,440
- We have this big
digital economy out there,

997
00:46:43,440 --> 00:46:47,070
and communities that are
only using local cash

998
00:46:47,070 --> 00:46:48,360
are shut out of it.

999
00:46:48,360 --> 00:46:50,460
And that doesn't help them grow.

1000
00:46:50,460 --> 00:46:53,790
They need to be part of
this global digital economy.

1001
00:46:53,790 --> 00:46:56,460
And one way of doing
that is to enable them

1002
00:46:56,460 --> 00:47:00,060
to use a digital currency
to make the best use of it.

1003
00:47:00,060 --> 00:47:00,893
I mean,

1004
00:47:00,893 --> 00:47:03,300
Bitcoin is something that
takes time to understand.

1005
00:47:03,300 --> 00:47:05,520
It all comes down to long-term commitment,

1006
00:47:05,520 --> 00:47:06,660
whether that's learning to surf,

1007
00:47:06,660 --> 00:47:08,190
or whether that's saving for the future,

1008
00:47:08,190 --> 00:47:10,770
using the best form of money
that's ever been created.

1009
00:47:10,770 --> 00:47:12,300
What I'd really like is for these kids

1010
00:47:12,300 --> 00:47:14,310
to help get the future generation there.

1011
00:47:14,310 --> 00:47:15,960
Whether they win the next event or not,

1012
00:47:15,960 --> 00:47:17,460
or whether they accomplished whatever.

1013
00:47:17,460 --> 00:47:18,852
I mean, I think they've
already accomplished

1014
00:47:18,852 --> 00:47:21,210
an incredible amount considering
where they come from,

1015
00:47:21,210 --> 00:47:23,280
and what they had to go
through to get there.

1016
00:47:23,280 --> 00:47:24,630
Quite something to witness.

1017
00:47:25,920 --> 00:47:28,230
- [Luke] Regardless of
your stance on Bitcoin,

1018
00:47:28,230 --> 00:47:30,030
one thing is for certain.

1019
00:47:30,030 --> 00:47:31,530
There are little hubs around the world

1020
00:47:31,530 --> 00:47:34,620
where the whole community
is buying into Bitcoin.

1021
00:47:34,620 --> 00:47:37,140
Bitcoin is creating community.

1022
00:47:37,140 --> 00:47:39,960
And these communities draw
inspiration from one another,

1023
00:47:39,960 --> 00:47:43,830
sharing ideas and birthing
new Bitcoin initiatives.

1024
00:47:43,830 --> 00:47:46,320
I could see this network
organism replicating

1025
00:47:46,320 --> 00:47:48,240
right in front of my eyes,

1026
00:47:48,240 --> 00:47:51,990
as this particular project led
me to another nearby venture

1027
00:47:51,990 --> 00:47:54,210
called the Bitcoin Ubuntu.

1028
00:47:54,210 --> 00:47:57,450
- I knew I had to do
something Bitcoin-related,

1029
00:47:57,450 --> 00:48:01,033
but I had no idea what,
until I saw Hermann,

1030
00:48:01,033 --> 00:48:05,640
Bitcoin Ekasi follow the Bitcoin
Beach model successfully.

1031
00:48:05,640 --> 00:48:10,410
Those projects led the way
really for projects like mine,

1032
00:48:10,410 --> 00:48:12,480
to learn from their experience

1033
00:48:12,480 --> 00:48:16,890
and adapt to our own
community and our own needs.

1034
00:48:16,890 --> 00:48:18,930
[Luke] Just like Hermann used surfing,

1035
00:48:18,930 --> 00:48:23,100
Glenn used soccer as the
catalyst for Bitcoin integration.

1036
00:48:23,100 --> 00:48:26,070
- When I started looking
at doing something similar,

1037
00:48:26,070 --> 00:48:29,790
I discovered documents existed,
published by Bitcoin Beach,

1038
00:48:29,790 --> 00:48:34,290
outlining exactly how
they'd gone about achieving

1039
00:48:34,290 --> 00:48:35,910
what they'd achieved.

1040
00:48:35,910 --> 00:48:37,860
I came to the discovery that many people

1041
00:48:37,860 --> 00:48:39,810
had already discovered this documents,

1042
00:48:39,810 --> 00:48:42,687
and had exactly the same idea.

1043
00:48:42,687 --> 00:48:46,710
And to my surprise, these communities

1044
00:48:46,710 --> 00:48:49,590
had already started popping up everywhere.

1045
00:48:49,590 --> 00:48:51,640
There are literally hundreds of them now.

1046
00:48:52,590 --> 00:48:54,990
Little fires popping up
all over the the planet.

1047
00:48:56,190 --> 00:48:59,400
- If you had a community
that ran entirely on Bitcoin,

1048
00:48:59,400 --> 00:49:00,443
right, that would be fine,

1049
00:49:00,443 --> 00:49:04,650
as long as everything
that anybody ever wanted

1050
00:49:04,650 --> 00:49:06,990
was fully obtainable
within that community.

1051
00:49:06,990 --> 00:49:10,500
But if they needed anything from outside,

1052
00:49:10,500 --> 00:49:13,260
they'd have to exchange
it for something else.

1053
00:49:13,260 --> 00:49:15,433
And that's where the price
and stability of Bitcoin

1054
00:49:15,433 --> 00:49:20,433
comes into play.
(ambient music)

1055
00:49:26,525 --> 00:49:30,025
(ambient music continues)

1056
00:49:37,907 --> 00:49:39,240
I think Bitcoin is a solution

1057
00:49:39,240 --> 00:49:41,880
waiting for the problem
to come full circle.

1058
00:49:41,880 --> 00:49:43,860
'Cause the problem is not yet full circle.

1059
00:49:43,860 --> 00:49:46,710
All the symptoms there, all
the indications are there,

1060
00:49:46,710 --> 00:49:49,350
but it's not as if it's gone to the point

1061
00:49:49,350 --> 00:49:51,870
where it's reached its
ultimate conclusion,

1062
00:49:51,870 --> 00:49:56,673
where we go full Zimbabwe,
but not in Zimbabwe, all over.

1063
00:49:59,490 --> 00:50:00,750
[Luke] Zimbabwe,

1064
00:50:00,750 --> 00:50:03,120
a country grappling with economic turmoil,

1065
00:50:03,120 --> 00:50:06,060
impacted by hyperinflation,
currency collapse,

1066
00:50:06,060 --> 00:50:09,660
and political unrest, holds
a special place in my heart.

1067
00:50:09,660 --> 00:50:13,260
It was my first stop in
Africa as a young boy.

1068
00:50:13,260 --> 00:50:15,420
Standing at the top of
one of the city's highest

1069
00:50:15,420 --> 00:50:19,470
off-limits vantage points, it
felt like a step back in time.

1070
00:50:19,470 --> 00:50:20,970
Not much had changed.

1071
00:50:20,970 --> 00:50:23,730
And yet, Zimbabwe provided
the perfect backdrop

1072
00:50:23,730 --> 00:50:25,140
to witness a resilient people

1073
00:50:25,140 --> 00:50:27,840
facing never-ending economic challenges,

1074
00:50:27,840 --> 00:50:29,940
circumstances that some fear

1075
00:50:29,940 --> 00:50:32,640
might mirror the future of the West.

1076
00:50:32,640 --> 00:50:37,640
- Zimbabwe's been a great example
of what is going to happen

1077
00:50:38,458 --> 00:50:41,490
I think, in the rest of the world.

1078
00:50:41,490 --> 00:50:43,590
Principally in terms of currency,

1079
00:50:43,590 --> 00:50:46,560
and what currency is, and currency change.

1080
00:50:46,560 --> 00:50:49,500
Zimbabwe is in a very complex position

1081
00:50:49,500 --> 00:50:51,896
when it comes to our monetary system.

1082
00:50:51,896 --> 00:50:54,480
We have what you would call the RTGS,

1083
00:50:54,480 --> 00:50:55,890
which is the money that's in the bank,

1084
00:50:55,890 --> 00:50:58,500
and that you can only
move through banks, right?

1085
00:50:58,500 --> 00:50:59,340
From bank to bank.

1086
00:50:59,340 --> 00:51:04,290
And then you have mobile
money, NetOne money,

1087
00:51:04,290 --> 00:51:05,790
OneMoney, we have EcoCash,

1088
00:51:05,790 --> 00:51:08,130
we have all these different
mobile money networks.

1089
00:51:08,130 --> 00:51:10,470
And then we have the USD,

1090
00:51:10,470 --> 00:51:12,420
but there's two kinds of USDs, right?

1091
00:51:12,420 --> 00:51:15,990
So you have USD cash,
then you have USD Nostro,

1092
00:51:15,990 --> 00:51:18,420
which is USD that's in a bank, yeah.

1093
00:51:18,420 --> 00:51:21,420
And it's kind of holds a
different value to USD that is,

1094
00:51:21,420 --> 00:51:24,900
it's the same currency,
but they move different.

1095
00:51:24,900 --> 00:51:27,870
And then you have the Zim dollar cash.

1096
00:51:27,870 --> 00:51:29,670
Then there's what you call bond notes.

1097
00:51:29,670 --> 00:51:32,490
But bond notes were actually phased out,

1098
00:51:32,490 --> 00:51:36,870
and we now have the official
ZWL, the Zimbabwe currency.

1099
00:51:36,870 --> 00:51:39,300
We still have some bond
notes still in circulation

1100
00:51:39,300 --> 00:51:42,480
that add to the actual Zimbabwe dollar,

1101
00:51:42,480 --> 00:51:43,830
but there's no more bond notes.

1102
00:51:43,830 --> 00:51:45,990
But because people were
using bond notes for so long,

1103
00:51:45,990 --> 00:51:48,458
the Zimbabwe dollar is still called

1104
00:51:48,458 --> 00:51:50,040
(speaking foreign language)

1105
00:51:50,040 --> 00:51:52,620
- It's still called bond notes.
- [Luke] I am so confused.

1106
00:51:52,620 --> 00:51:55,070
- Yeah, it is.
(Aurra laughing)

1107
00:51:55,070 --> 00:51:56,910
So I went grocery shopping yesterday.

1108
00:51:56,910 --> 00:52:00,360
I think I spent $20 on $7 worth of goods,

1109
00:52:00,360 --> 00:52:03,690
and I got like $3 back in a
bunch of different currencies.

1110
00:52:03,690 --> 00:52:05,370
So in order for a lot of Zimbabweans

1111
00:52:05,370 --> 00:52:08,370
to save on the cost of goods,

1112
00:52:08,370 --> 00:52:11,280
they use these black market
forex exchange people.

1113
00:52:11,280 --> 00:52:13,230
I found a guy who's gonna
meet me at three o'clock

1114
00:52:13,230 --> 00:52:14,820
and he's gonna gimme his bank card.

1115
00:52:14,820 --> 00:52:18,060
And I'm gonna go shopping
on the bank rate.

1116
00:52:18,060 --> 00:52:20,490
And we're gonna work out an
exchange between the two of us.

1117
00:52:20,490 --> 00:52:23,220
And this is how many Zimbabweans operate

1118
00:52:23,220 --> 00:52:24,690
on a grocery store level day to day,

1119
00:52:24,690 --> 00:52:27,210
to save money on the black market.

1120
00:52:27,210 --> 00:52:30,030
- Zimbabwe has spent
a lot of time learning

1121
00:52:30,030 --> 00:52:32,220
how to live with collapsing currencies,

1122
00:52:32,220 --> 00:52:35,040
and the world is gonna
be part of that lesson

1123
00:52:35,040 --> 00:52:36,570
going forwards into the future.

1124
00:52:36,570 --> 00:52:38,847
Most currencies have
devalued significantly

1125
00:52:38,847 --> 00:52:41,100
in the past five to 10 years,

1126
00:52:41,100 --> 00:52:43,530
and that will continue
for some time to come.

1127
00:52:43,530 --> 00:52:45,780
The collapses have only just started.

1128
00:52:45,780 --> 00:52:47,670
The whole meaning of
money is gonna change.

1129
00:52:47,670 --> 00:52:49,680
Money's applicability is gonna change.

1130
00:52:49,680 --> 00:52:51,180
The value of money is gonna change.

1131
00:52:51,180 --> 00:52:52,783
How you use money is gonna change.

1132
00:52:52,783 --> 00:52:55,530
And all of those were
lessons Zimbabwe learned.

1133
00:52:55,530 --> 00:52:59,070
The Zimbabweans learnt to
be incredibly ingenious

1134
00:52:59,070 --> 00:53:04,070
in inventing solutions on
how to get around a currency

1135
00:53:04,260 --> 00:53:09,193
that went from one to one
to the US dollar to one to,

1136
00:53:09,193 --> 00:53:12,150
I think it was at the
final end of the collapse,

1137
00:53:12,150 --> 00:53:17,150
it was many quadrillions
to one to the US dollar.

1138
00:53:18,240 --> 00:53:20,220
[Luke] Zimbabwe's economic struggles

1139
00:53:20,220 --> 00:53:22,950
made me think about another
potential economic storm

1140
00:53:22,950 --> 00:53:24,003
heading to the West.

1141
00:53:25,139 --> 00:53:27,930
And I started to rewind all
the themes I've investigated,

1142
00:53:27,930 --> 00:53:30,234
and the people I visited.

1143
00:53:30,234 --> 00:53:32,580
And all things considered,

1144
00:53:32,580 --> 00:53:35,883
I still questioned how
Africa could save the West.

1145
00:53:36,990 --> 00:53:39,760
But when I came to know a group of women

1146
00:53:40,950 --> 00:53:42,423
called the Firestarters,

1147
00:53:43,380 --> 00:53:46,473
and another group of women
called the Banker Ladies,

1148
00:53:47,850 --> 00:53:52,210
my imposter syndrome
and self-doubt vanished

1149
00:53:53,820 --> 00:53:58,383
because these African
ideologies are already here.

1150
00:53:59,370 --> 00:54:01,200
They're already in the West.

1151
00:54:01,200 --> 00:54:05,490
- When Zimbabwe women get to
a place, we find first of all,

1152
00:54:05,490 --> 00:54:07,590
people who look and sound like us.

1153
00:54:07,590 --> 00:54:12,180
And then once there's about
three Zimbabwean women together,

1154
00:54:12,180 --> 00:54:14,910
we start to look at collective savings.

1155
00:54:14,910 --> 00:54:17,340
In Zimbabwe, it's called mukando,

1156
00:54:17,340 --> 00:54:20,040
which is a Shona word for "to pool,

1157
00:54:20,040 --> 00:54:22,500
or to throw into the middle".

1158
00:54:22,500 --> 00:54:26,820
I realized how much money was circulating.

1159
00:54:26,820 --> 00:54:30,060
The remittances were close to $2 billion.

1160
00:54:30,060 --> 00:54:35,060
I desired to have us move some
of that money to investment.

1161
00:54:35,790 --> 00:54:38,790
- [Luke] Remittances are
funds sent by migrant workers

1162
00:54:38,790 --> 00:54:40,530
to their families abroad.

1163
00:54:40,530 --> 00:54:42,509
And it typically involves transfer fees,

1164
00:54:42,509 --> 00:54:46,170
exchange rate margins,
and recipient charges,

1165
00:54:46,170 --> 00:54:48,300
rendering sending money home

1166
00:54:48,300 --> 00:54:50,940
a lucrative billion-dollar industry.

1167
00:54:50,940 --> 00:54:53,550
And this led to Sharon
and the Firestarters

1168
00:54:53,550 --> 00:54:56,190
expanding upon the concept of a SACCO,

1169
00:54:56,190 --> 00:54:59,580
reimagining a new model that
could benefit the diaspora

1170
00:54:59,580 --> 00:55:01,440
and future generations.

1171
00:55:01,440 --> 00:55:03,570
These women are pooling their resources

1172
00:55:03,570 --> 00:55:05,070
to invest in properties,

1173
00:55:05,070 --> 00:55:08,400
demonstrating a simple way
to build wealth together.

1174
00:55:08,400 --> 00:55:12,300
- What she had done was
a magnificent innovation

1175
00:55:12,300 --> 00:55:15,720
on a lending circle model,

1176
00:55:15,720 --> 00:55:18,840
where instead of women coming together

1177
00:55:18,840 --> 00:55:21,240
to put all their resources in the middle,

1178
00:55:21,240 --> 00:55:23,310
and then whoever needs it
takes it and repays it,

1179
00:55:23,310 --> 00:55:25,920
and they take turns, she innovated to say,

1180
00:55:25,920 --> 00:55:28,410
instead of us lending
the money to each other,

1181
00:55:28,410 --> 00:55:30,780
let's put it into the middle,

1182
00:55:30,780 --> 00:55:32,670
and purchase real estate together.

1183
00:55:32,670 --> 00:55:35,280
And she was able to do it not
just with one group of women,

1184
00:55:35,280 --> 00:55:38,400
but with two groups of women,
and secure two properties.

1185
00:55:38,400 --> 00:55:40,740
- Wherever there are
immigrants immigrating

1186
00:55:40,740 --> 00:55:42,480
from various parts of the world,

1187
00:55:42,480 --> 00:55:45,570
they are bringing their
ROSCA systems with them.

1188
00:55:45,570 --> 00:55:47,310
So in all of our major cities,

1189
00:55:47,310 --> 00:55:49,350
we're finding these ROSCA systems.

1190
00:55:49,350 --> 00:55:52,433
For almost a decade, I've
been working with these women

1191
00:55:52,433 --> 00:55:54,404
who are trying to organize themselves

1192
00:55:54,404 --> 00:55:58,470
as an education advocacy council

1193
00:55:58,470 --> 00:56:02,225
that is working on behalf of ROSCA users.

1194
00:56:02,225 --> 00:56:06,150
- If something is
practiced that universally,

1195
00:56:06,150 --> 00:56:08,310
we have to make a case.

1196
00:56:08,310 --> 00:56:10,110
Where I go, I'm bringing the Banker Lady

1197
00:56:10,110 --> 00:56:11,400
and the ROSCA flag we know.

1198
00:56:11,400 --> 00:56:13,260
I know people are asking questions,

1199
00:56:13,260 --> 00:56:16,200
and they wanna know what is
this, and how does it work,

1200
00:56:16,200 --> 00:56:17,550
and how do I get involved?

1201
00:56:17,550 --> 00:56:19,080
So it's not just for women,

1202
00:56:19,080 --> 00:56:22,320
it's not just for people who
are unbanked or underbanked,

1203
00:56:22,320 --> 00:56:24,810
but everyone actually participates.

1204
00:56:24,810 --> 00:56:28,260
There's no community that you mention it

1205
00:56:28,260 --> 00:56:31,050
to that's racialized, that
doesn't have a name for ROSCA.

1206
00:56:31,050 --> 00:56:34,860
Everybody's doing it like
covertly, like almost afraid.

1207
00:56:34,860 --> 00:56:36,970
- [Luke] I was excited
about this innovation.

1208
00:56:36,970 --> 00:56:40,470
But not everyone shared my enthusiasm.

1209
00:56:40,470 --> 00:56:45,360
- I had no idea of the
hurdles that lay ahead.

1210
00:56:45,360 --> 00:56:49,447
I naturally went to a Black
male lawyer who said this,

1211
00:56:49,447 --> 00:56:54,447
"Oh, my mother is Jamaican,
and she does this partner.

1212
00:56:54,900 --> 00:56:57,837
It's illegal. You can't
do that here in Canada."

1213
00:56:59,370 --> 00:57:01,500
- [Luke] I was humbled to
witness the Firestarters

1214
00:57:01,500 --> 00:57:04,380
receive the keys to their newest property.

1215
00:57:04,380 --> 00:57:05,792
But I couldn't shake the concern

1216
00:57:05,792 --> 00:57:08,550
that barriers would persist,

1217
00:57:08,550 --> 00:57:11,823
preventing the West from truly
acknowledging the system.

1218
00:57:13,590 --> 00:57:16,650
- The issue is that there's no
recognition of these systems.

1219
00:57:16,650 --> 00:57:20,010
People actually think that
what they're doing is illegal,

1220
00:57:20,010 --> 00:57:23,220
when they're actually helping one another

1221
00:57:23,220 --> 00:57:25,470
through financial services.

1222
00:57:25,470 --> 00:57:26,850
It was scary.

1223
00:57:26,850 --> 00:57:30,030
I also felt scared, not just for myself.

1224
00:57:30,030 --> 00:57:32,160
When you are a leader in the community,

1225
00:57:32,160 --> 00:57:35,310
and you've been leading
people and to think,

1226
00:57:35,310 --> 00:57:37,387
how do you go back and tell them that,

1227
00:57:37,387 --> 00:57:42,060
"Guys, this whole thing that
you've been doing is illegal."

1228
00:57:42,060 --> 00:57:45,387
If police or any other authority,

1229
00:57:45,387 --> 00:57:47,880
learns about these collections,

1230
00:57:47,880 --> 00:57:51,090
there is a law called
the Civil Remedies Act,

1231
00:57:51,090 --> 00:57:55,230
which gives authorities the
right to confiscate money

1232
00:57:55,230 --> 00:57:57,930
where the origins are unlawful.

1233
00:57:57,930 --> 00:57:59,820
So if there's any question about

1234
00:57:59,820 --> 00:58:03,810
how these monies were
accumulated, the police go in,

1235
00:58:03,810 --> 00:58:07,650
and raid their apartments
and confiscate those goods.

1236
00:58:07,650 --> 00:58:12,390
These women have no recourse
to any kind of legal solution.

1237
00:58:12,390 --> 00:58:16,860
And so what you have right
now is this legislation

1238
00:58:16,860 --> 00:58:21,210
that exists that may have been
there at a point in history

1239
00:58:21,210 --> 00:58:24,150
for a certain reason, but
now these hardworking,

1240
00:58:24,150 --> 00:58:28,800
cooperative women are being
penalized for doing self-help

1241
00:58:28,800 --> 00:58:30,273
on their own terms.

1242
00:58:31,350 --> 00:58:34,560
- That they were able to do
that together, and over time,

1243
00:58:34,560 --> 00:58:37,620
be able to purchase a
property was very exciting

1244
00:58:37,620 --> 00:58:42,620
and not scalable because
it was labor-intensive.

1245
00:58:43,620 --> 00:58:46,264
And the structure, the corporate
structure that was required

1246
00:58:46,264 --> 00:58:50,460
for all of that to happen was onerous.

1247
00:58:50,460 --> 00:58:54,150
There's no legal scalable
framework currently

1248
00:58:54,150 --> 00:58:55,226
that we've been able to determine

1249
00:58:55,226 --> 00:58:58,530
that would allow women
to pool their resources

1250
00:58:58,530 --> 00:59:01,050
into the purchasing of real estate.

1251
00:59:01,050 --> 00:59:03,150
They needed an exemption to be able to do

1252
00:59:03,150 --> 00:59:06,473
even what they did do
around friends and family,

1253
00:59:06,473 --> 00:59:08,790
that allowed them to have 50 people

1254
00:59:08,790 --> 00:59:10,643
owning a piece of property.

1255
00:59:10,643 --> 00:59:15,607
But that exemption is not
valid for sure for scaling,

1256
00:59:17,880 --> 00:59:19,350
because most people

1257
00:59:19,350 --> 00:59:22,250
don't have more than
five friends or family.

1258
00:59:22,250 --> 00:59:23,640
So even 50 is a stretch.

1259
00:59:23,640 --> 00:59:27,510
And certainly scaling it
beyond that would not work

1260
00:59:27,510 --> 00:59:29,580
under the exemption of securities law.

1261
00:59:29,580 --> 00:59:33,030
Unless I push through the barriers,

1262
00:59:33,030 --> 00:59:34,260
it will remain like that.

1263
00:59:34,260 --> 00:59:37,080
And the situation won't
change for my daughter,

1264
00:59:37,080 --> 00:59:39,360
and for her children too.

1265
00:59:39,360 --> 00:59:42,390
And if we don't say something,
if we don't speak up,

1266
00:59:42,390 --> 00:59:44,610
the status quo will be maintained.

1267
00:59:44,610 --> 00:59:46,530
So we have to make noise,

1268
00:59:46,530 --> 00:59:50,700
because I know that this
is something that works.

1269
00:59:50,700 --> 00:59:53,670
- And so the vision was if this
could be done for 100 women,

1270
00:59:53,670 --> 00:59:55,830
what if it could be done for 10,000 women?

1271
00:59:55,830 --> 00:59:58,230
What if it could be
done for 100,000 women?

1272
00:59:58,230 --> 00:59:59,063
We're saying,

1273
00:59:59,063 --> 01:00:02,310
"Come learn and see how this thing

1274
01:00:02,310 --> 01:00:07,310
that Africans used to do
zillions of years before,

1275
01:00:07,470 --> 01:00:12,240
is not just informal or less
done, but it is legitimate.

1276
01:00:12,240 --> 01:00:16,080
It can stand side by side
with a formal system."

1277
01:00:16,080 --> 01:00:18,030
One of the key things

1278
01:00:18,030 --> 01:00:20,220
that has come out of
this part of the world

1279
01:00:20,220 --> 01:00:23,613
is that we have redefined what banking is.

1280
01:00:25,080 --> 01:00:29,283
For far too long, banking
has been about banks.

1281
01:00:30,780 --> 01:00:35,780
In Africa, that story has
been tossed away completely.

1282
01:00:36,000 --> 01:00:38,280
- But then you get
thrown in as an immigrant

1283
01:00:38,280 --> 01:00:39,390
into a new system.

1284
01:00:39,390 --> 01:00:41,520
We forget what we had.

1285
01:00:41,520 --> 01:00:43,800
And all of a sudden we're
assuming that everything

1286
01:00:43,800 --> 01:00:47,130
that we're being fed is
the right thing, right?

1287
01:00:47,130 --> 01:00:48,270
How is it the right thing,

1288
01:00:48,270 --> 01:00:50,310
and then everything is so messed up?

1289
01:00:50,310 --> 01:00:52,920
- We've got the experience
of dealing with the level

1290
01:00:52,920 --> 01:00:56,790
of volatility that is only
now appearing over there.

1291
01:00:56,790 --> 01:00:58,088
We in the West might think,

1292
01:00:58,088 --> 01:01:00,000
"Ah! Our governments are benign.

1293
01:01:00,000 --> 01:01:02,400
It's never gonna shut anybody
out of the financial system.

1294
01:01:02,400 --> 01:01:04,980
Nobody's going to be denied
access to the means to live."

1295
01:01:04,980 --> 01:01:07,357
I look around the world and think,

1296
01:01:07,357 --> 01:01:08,807
"I am not so sure about that."

1297
01:01:08,807 --> 01:01:10,950
You're never gonna find a situation

1298
01:01:10,950 --> 01:01:13,320
where our problems are solved
by benevolent dictators,

1299
01:01:13,320 --> 01:01:14,880
benevolent politicians.

1300
01:01:14,880 --> 01:01:16,440
But yet people trust in that system.

1301
01:01:16,440 --> 01:01:18,300
People wanna vote for popular politicians.

1302
01:01:18,300 --> 01:01:20,460
People want a charismatic leader

1303
01:01:20,460 --> 01:01:22,530
to come and solve all our issues for us.

1304
01:01:22,530 --> 01:01:23,520
No, that's not gonna happen.

1305
01:01:23,520 --> 01:01:25,800
You've gotta take responsibility
in your own hands.

1306
01:01:25,800 --> 01:01:26,894
Scale down.

1307
01:01:26,894 --> 01:01:29,700
You gotta make decisions as
a family, as a community,

1308
01:01:29,700 --> 01:01:31,590
and take responsibility
for those decisions.

1309
01:01:31,590 --> 01:01:32,820
And people don't like that.

1310
01:01:32,820 --> 01:01:34,470
- These people living
in developing countries,

1311
01:01:34,470 --> 01:01:36,900
they don't wait for their
government to make a plan.

1312
01:01:36,900 --> 01:01:39,870
They come up with a plan, or
community come up with a plan.

1313
01:01:39,870 --> 01:01:44,610
And that is what Westerners
are not usually good at.

1314
01:01:44,610 --> 01:01:47,670
- So much of our world
is literally on fire.

1315
01:01:47,670 --> 01:01:52,650
And here we have these
credible, ancestral tools

1316
01:01:52,650 --> 01:01:56,580
of how to collect money, and
we're not even using them.

1317
01:01:56,580 --> 01:02:00,000
- You need an outsider thing
to come in as everything breaks

1318
01:02:00,000 --> 01:02:01,110
to try and fix it.

1319
01:02:01,110 --> 01:02:02,430
We look at the banking sector,

1320
01:02:02,430 --> 01:02:04,860
and we assume that
there is no alternative.

1321
01:02:04,860 --> 01:02:07,770
It's too easy to forget
the first really big banks

1322
01:02:07,770 --> 01:02:09,030
were co-operatives.

1323
01:02:09,030 --> 01:02:12,810
Many of these institutions
operated perfectly well

1324
01:02:12,810 --> 01:02:15,030
without causing financial crisis.

1325
01:02:15,030 --> 01:02:16,920
And because it's a co-operative,

1326
01:02:16,920 --> 01:02:20,520
the borrowers are the owners, in a sense.

1327
01:02:20,520 --> 01:02:23,040
It's owned collectively by the community.

1328
01:02:23,040 --> 01:02:24,960
So there is no temptation,

1329
01:02:24,960 --> 01:02:28,020
there is no need to go and
exploit your borrowers,

1330
01:02:28,020 --> 01:02:30,450
because you are exploiting yourself.

1331
01:02:30,450 --> 01:02:32,430
- Technology, knowledge-sharing,

1332
01:02:32,430 --> 01:02:35,490
shouldn't be from the
global north to the south.

1333
01:02:35,490 --> 01:02:39,600
There's something that we
have to teach the global north

1334
01:02:39,600 --> 01:02:40,800
and then iterate,

1335
01:02:40,800 --> 01:02:44,280
use technology to improve
some of those things.

1336
01:02:44,280 --> 01:02:46,860
And it can teach the formal system

1337
01:02:46,860 --> 01:02:49,860
one or two things about Ubuntu.

1338
01:02:49,860 --> 01:02:53,640
- We can't run away again
from here, like we did,

1339
01:02:53,640 --> 01:02:54,802
we ran away from Zimbabwe.

1340
01:02:54,802 --> 01:02:56,280
We can't. We're here to stay.

1341
01:02:56,280 --> 01:02:58,080
So the system has to accept us.

1342
01:02:58,080 --> 01:03:01,296
And we'll make sure that we
force the system to accept us.

1343
01:03:01,296 --> 01:03:03,879
(upbeat music)

1344
01:03:11,169 --> 01:03:14,586
(upbeat music continues)

1345
01:03:21,802 --> 01:03:25,219
(upbeat music continues)

1346
01:03:32,475 --> 01:03:35,892
(upbeat music continues)

1347
01:03:43,255 --> 01:03:46,672
(upbeat music continues)

1348
01:03:53,909 --> 01:03:57,326
(upbeat music continues)

1349
01:04:04,595 --> 01:04:08,012
(upbeat music continues)

1350
01:04:15,305 --> 01:04:18,722
(upbeat music continues)

1351
01:04:25,894 --> 01:04:29,311
(upbeat music continues)

1352
01:04:36,659 --> 01:04:40,076
(upbeat music continues)

1353
01:04:47,269 --> 01:04:50,686
(upbeat music continues)

1354
01:04:58,073 --> 01:05:01,490
(upbeat music continues)

1355
01:05:08,669 --> 01:05:12,086
(upbeat music continues)

1356
01:05:14,516 --> 01:05:18,482
- And it's about time that
the government in South Africa

1357
01:05:18,482 --> 01:05:20,251
recognizes the stokvel.

1358
01:05:20,251 --> 01:05:21,524
Yet while they promoting them,

1359
01:05:21,524 --> 01:05:24,014
the net worth of the
stokvels is like 22 billion.

1360
01:05:24,014 --> 01:05:24,847
[Speaker 2] Mmm.

1361
01:05:24,847 --> 01:05:27,750
According to the latest,

1362
01:05:27,750 --> 01:05:30,510
or current figures that we have,

1363
01:05:30,510 --> 01:05:33,690
there's about 55 billion
rand that circulates

1364
01:05:33,690 --> 01:05:38,690
within the South African
economy saved by the stokvels.

1365
01:05:38,972 --> 01:05:41,880
- [Speaker 3] 55 billion rand.
- 55 billion rand.

1366
01:05:41,880 --> 01:05:44,010
This is the money that is being saved,

1367
01:05:44,010 --> 01:05:46,353
or collected by stokvels annually.

1368
01:05:47,932 --> 01:05:49,680
A rotational stokvel as well.

1369
01:05:49,680 --> 01:05:52,440
Next month we buy for
you, it gets installed,

1370
01:05:52,440 --> 01:05:54,523
and then we go to you, and then,

1371
01:05:54,523 --> 01:05:55,830
(speaking foreign language)

1372
01:05:55,830 --> 01:05:59,010
With the high inflation
rate and this and this,

1373
01:05:59,010 --> 01:06:02,009
people can't afford things these days,

1374
01:06:02,009 --> 01:06:04,680
but they can do a lot of
things with a stokvel.

1375
01:06:04,680 --> 01:06:06,774
I think we are done, Luke.

1376
01:06:06,774 --> 01:06:09,524
(women laughing)

1377
01:06:11,109 --> 01:06:13,692
(upbeat music)

1378
01:06:20,925 --> 01:06:24,342
(upbeat music continues)

1379
01:06:31,590 --> 01:06:35,007
(upbeat music continues)

1380
01:06:42,369 --> 01:06:45,786
(upbeat music continues)

1381
01:06:53,099 --> 01:06:56,516
(upbeat music continues)

1382
01:07:03,680 --> 01:07:07,097
(upbeat music continues)

1383
01:07:14,619 --> 01:07:18,036
(upbeat music continues)

1384
01:07:25,102 --> 01:07:28,116
(upbeat music continues)